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So I noticed that, in my experience...

Tslide91

Android Enthusiast
Faster phones can take advanged of network speed? I dont kbow much about this kind of studf, so im asking not stating.

But, where I live, I only get EDGE. No 3/4g for me.

Anyways, the moto cliq I had avereged about 120 mbps.
The mytouch slide I had did about 150 usually. And this mytouch 4g has been getting ~220 mbps.

Is it possible that with a faster processor, the data passes through quicker, making it easier to push data in faster from the network?

As I stated before, I know nearly nothing about this stuff. I'm just try to learn this, and this theory sorta make sense to me.

Cheers folks!
 
Faster phones can take advanged of network speed? I dont kbow much about this kind of studf, so im asking not stating.

But, where I live, I only get EDGE. No 3/4g for me.

Anyways, the moto cliq I had avereged about 120 mbps.
The mytouch slide I had did about 150 usually. And this mytouch 4g has been getting ~220 mbps.

Is it possible that with a faster processor, the data passes through quicker, making it easier to push data in faster from the network?

As I stated before, I know nearly nothing about this stuff. I'm just try to learn this, and this theory sorta make sense to me.

Cheers folks!

I have to drop sprint and go with att, 220mbps is faster then wimax and lte combined, max theoretical speed. You can not be getting 200mbps+, seriously. That is like saying I just jumped into my car and broke the speed of sound yesterday, but I normally go 200 mph.

As for your question, most of the hardware is good up to 100mbps. The two biggest issues is battery life and movement

The faster you are moving the slower the connection and battery starts to get really drained very quickly on anything over 30mbps. At 30mbps, your average battery will last about 30 minutes. At 74 mbps you will get about 15 minutes.
 
Makes sense, all of the data pouring into your phone still needs to be processed. So more memory and faster processors will process the data faster than older hardware.
 
I have to drop sprint and go with att, 220mbps is faster then wimax and lte combined, max theoretical speed. You can not be getting 200mbps+, seriously. That is like saying I just jumped into my car and broke the speed of sound yesterday, but I normally go 200 mph.

As for your question, most of the hardware is good up to 100mbps. The two biggest issues is battery life and movement

The faster you are moving the slower the connection and battery starts to get really drained very quickly on anything over 30mbps. At 30mbps, your average battery will last about 30 minutes. At 74 mbps you will get about 15 minutes.

I am sure he meant kbps
 
I am a little confused about what you are saying, OP. At edge data speeds it would take a really old phone for the hardware to be the bottleneck.
 
I've noticed that too. So I decided after reading your post, I'd do a quick (unscientific test).

I'm at home using my wifi connection, using a HTC Droid Incredible. I'm going to use the speedtest.net app. I'll be using SetCPU to lower the clock speed. I'll do two runs on each. Results will be displayed as; Test 1: Download/Upload, Test 2: same/same

998mhz - T1: 6950/3390, T2: 7133/3402
768mhz - T1: 6227/3392, T2: 6435/3376
576mhz - T1: 6596/3362, T2: 3838/3341
384mhz - T1: 8035/2613. T2: 5872/2912
256mhz - T1: 6567/1867, T2: 5451/2013

As I said, this is a completely unscientific test, but there's definitely a downward trend. My guess is that the CPU speed matters indirectly, as in the more bogged down it is from other tasks, the more problems it will exhibit when taking in data. So it's not that the speed gets slower, but rather, the data retrieval gets more inconsistent, which leads to perceived lower speeds.
 
I am a little confused about what you are saying, OP. At edge data speeds it would take a really old phone for the hardware to be the bottleneck.

Me, too.

Maybe the real question revolves around this - does this issue really come from and involve wifi use?

Wouldn't that case depend on the data use? TCP buffers can only be so large and feedthru can only happen so fast before blocking is invoked - I'm trying to imagine some sufficiently complex web experience or video feed or something...
 
Guys you are really talking about nothing. As for cpu, anything over 25mhz can handle up to 100Mbps. Why? Because that is what a normal router uses to process your data from the internet to your pc. 25mhz crystal cpu, thats it. Now let look at 100Mbps. 100Mbps=12.5MBps. Your phones memory is about 400mhz on average, that can process up about 1,600Mbps. About 16 times the amount of information your phone radio is giving it. The 1ghz snapdragon can do well over 1,000,000,000 bits per second, 1 million times the amount of information your phone is giving it. Speeds of 2.3mbps where processed since the mid 70's. Speeds of 10mbps where used since the early 80's. Speed of 100mbps where used since the mid 90's. Your phone will not bottle neck your data speed. To do so, it would have to be so resource by memory. As long as you are not overloading your phone with open apps there is no way you can bottleneck your hardware with your data speed. You would have to have 10 times that speed.
 
Correct me if I am wrong, but a router, which is made to do NOTHING more than send and receive this data in various ways seems like a bad comparison. It is sending the data, but it is not interpreting or rendering it in any way, really. I feel like this might have been what the OP was getting at, however he hasn't really come back to clarify. We are also clearly seeing lower bandwidth on lower cpu phones in the real world as well, even though they may have the same radio. Surely this isn;t just coincidence?
 
Correct me if I am wrong, but a router, which is made to do NOTHING more than send and receive this data in various ways seems like a bad comparison. It is sending the data, but it is not interpreting or rendering it in any way, really. I feel like this might have been what the OP was getting at, however he hasn't really come back to clarify. We are also clearly seeing lower bandwidth on lower cpu phones in the real world as well, even though they may have the same radio. Surely this isn;t just coincidence?

Ok. A router is like having 2 radios attached to each other. One receives the other sends. There has to be a cpu to determine which packets go where and control the flow of traffic. For a wireless router it could be up to 20 machines each transfering information from one connection to another. That information must be processed in some way to make the proper connections. There is very little difference between that and your phones radio. If a 25mhz cpu can do it on your router, your phone can handle it just fine.

It is very uncommon for a phone to stream and translate a video from the internet. Most video playback will lag because of slow bandwidth then radio hardware.

Once again, your phones hardware is more the able to process any speed the internet will throw at it. The only problems you will see hardware wise will be battery and antenna, and tower side problems.

Hardware will not slow you down, not with most phones made in the last year or so.
 
Thanks for the explanation. My understanding seems to have been quite wrong. My question, still, is how are we seeing lower bandwidth numbers with phones of lower hardware grades? I suppose we can refernce the example a couple posts above with an underclocked CPU. This general trend is noted in real world situations when comparing phones too.

Just so that my question isn't misinterpreted, I am not trying to say you are wrong, just simply wondering why this trend exists. What other factors may be at play here when, on paper, it seems like a correlation with the Cpu clock speed?
 
Ok. A router is like having 2 radios attached to each other. One receives the other sends. There has to be a cpu to determine which packets go where and control the flow of traffic. For a wireless router it could be up to 20 machines each transfering information from one connection to another. That information must be processed in some way to make the proper connections. There is very little difference between that and your phones radio. If a 25mhz cpu can do it on your router, your phone can handle it just fine.

It is very uncommon for a phone to stream and translate a video from the internet. Most video playback will lag because of slow bandwidth then radio hardware.

Once again, your phones hardware is more the able to process any speed the internet will throw at it. The only problems you will see hardware wise will be battery and antenna, and tower side problems.

Hardware will not slow you down, not with most phones made in the last year or so.
Your right for the most part. However, many routers do MUCH more than 25 Mhz. My old Linksys WRT54G and Buffalo WHPG54 both use almost identical Broadcom chipsets, and the both run at 200 Mhz. And these aren't even wireless N routers. These have technically 5 year old hardware.

It IS possible that a strained processor can cause slower data transfers though. A modern browser makes many connections and each one takes time to open and start. Most newer Androids probably never hit that though. Something like my Eris would, but it doesn't take a lot to max out the processor usage on that.
 
I do not know much about the hardware of the aforementioned phones, but networking is my thing. Is it possible that the manufacturers of the phones with lower hardware specs also cut costs and used cheaper/slower radios?

Grant.
 
My question, still, is how are we seeing lower bandwidth numbers with phones of lower hardware grades? I suppose we can refernce the example a couple posts above with an underclocked CPU. This general trend is noted in real world situations when comparing phones too. That other factors may be at play here when, on paper, it seems like a correlation with the Cpu clock speed?
Correlation is not causation. If I was looking at the numbers, it looks like standard network fluctuations. To be honest, the variation is with in normal parameters for a standard network. If you actually download a 10gig file, you will see the network flow like a wave. It will peak and fall. IF you hit the network at a peak, you get really good speeds, 10 seconds later you get a dip and get really bad speeds.

Medion said:
998mhz - T1: 6950/3390, T2: 7133/3402
768mhz - T1: 6227/3392, T2: 6435/3376
576mhz - T1: 6596/3362, T2: 3838/3341
384mhz - T1: 8035/2613. T2: 5872/2912
256mhz - T1: 6567/1867, T2: 5451/2013
There is no standard deviation in that graph.
7041, 6331, 5217, 6953, 6003 average. Did this in my head so number might be off. That is not a a downward trend, that is a well curve.

Your right for the most part. However, many routers do MUCH more than 25 Mhz. My old Linksys WRT54G and Buffalo WHPG54 both use almost identical Broadcom chipsets, and the both run at 200 Mhz. And these aren't even wireless N routers. These have technically 5 year old hardware.

It IS possible that a strained processor can cause slower data transfers though. A modern browser makes many connections and each one takes time to open and start. Most newer Androids probably never hit that though. Something like my Eris would, but it doesn't take a lot to max out the processor usage on that.

200mhz are mainly found in usb enable router and power over ethernet. Yes, if you load a thousand apps on the handset, you are going to bog it down. But only factoring for operating normalcy, you should not see a problem with hardware induce network problems until way into the 1gbps connections.

I do not know much about the hardware of the aforementioned phones, but networking is my thing. Is it possible that the manufacturers of the phones with lower hardware specs also cut costs and used cheaper/slower radios?

Grant.

Yes, the number one problem with almost any cellophone is bad antennas. Poor construction and placement of an antenna can cut your network speed to a crawl. Cheap parts can cause everything from feedback to interference issues.

But if I was going to guess why the cheaper phones have problems, software. They have been either software disabled or firmware disabled. This is not related to cpu or any hardware stats, even using inferior parts that have a high failure rate and have been low binned chips would exceed the data specs for a 3g/4g connection. They could be software crippled, firmware or driver. Which is what they did for the htc evo. Even though it can go up to 15mbps, the phone does throttle itself down to 4-8mbps.

Combine a low binned part, add on firmware restrictions and software management for network and battery, it is possible to reduced the speed.

But that is social engineering not hardware engineering. Hardware is what we are talking about. Which is designed to go as fast as possible.
 
There is no standard deviation in that graph.
7041, 6331, 5217, 6953, 6003 average. Did this in my head so number might be off. That is not a a downward trend, that is a well curve.


You're only looking at the 1st set of numbers. Look at the 2nd set as well. While I did state the my quick test was anything BUT scientific, the consistency of results varies once you start to drop the speed.

A router's CPU can handle a set amount of data because the router's CPU has a fixed function. A phone's CPU has to do more. For instance, when opening the web browser, not only are you sending/receiving data, but now you're processing that data for rendering on screen. If it gets to a point where the processor becomes maxed out for any reason, tasks become prioritized.

I agree with your general assessment that a smartphone's CPU today is more than enough to handle a typical amount of data. I also agree with your assessment that my data isn't valid (I even said as much in that post). However, there is more in play than you mentioned. Comparing a router's CPU to that of a desktop PC or a smartphone is like when a kid friend of mine stated that his "5.8ghz cordless phone was faster than his Pentium." Ok, it's not THAT bad :)
 
Something you guys are all forgetting..

Even if a 25 mhz cpu can push more than enough data.

Memory speeds are going to limit the rate at which it can be stored. So if you are dealing with lower speed, inferior memory and other issues.. there could be a hardware bottleneck somewhere within the phone. Doesn't mean it IS the cpu just an issue.

Or because, we are discussing phone's here.. there could be software issues.. lower end phone's could also mean lazier coders :p

As someone else said correlation is not causation.

However, I have always found that machines supporting faster processors are better equipped to handle data.
 
On my 15/2 mbit connection from time warner i've done a speedtest on my phone that topped at just over 13mbits using the speedtest.net app, the app only shows up to 10mbits. Maybe someday they will increase it lol. I haven't tried it hooked up to the computer yet though.

EDIT: This is the best record I can go back to. I don't have the higher one in my list anymore.
snap20110103_171410.png


EDIT 2: Did a burst upload to the phone at about 8.4 MB/s which is close to 100mbit.
 
where is the contacts folder stored. i mean, i want to copy it from the internal data. i used to do this with windows mobile called a pim. it can then just be found, renamed, the phone reset, and then all the contacts dissapear, and the phone makes a new pim which is blank until you paste the original again.
can anyone tell me the file name or type . i tried sbu but found nothing. i have root explorer but dont know what i m looking for on android 2.2
 
I think RiverOfIce nailed it in one - other factors go along with lower CPU speed such as lower cost components all around and it's causality we're looking for.

Do cheaper things perform less well than expensive things? Typically, yes.

Do we notice this with respect to network performance on cell phones? Apparently so.

Do these poorer-performing handsets also coincidentally have lower-speed CPUs? Yes and why wouldn't they?

Whether it's silicon in the form of processor, memory, radios, glue logic - or other components such as software or antenna - his argument makes sense to me.
 
where is the contacts folder stored. i mean, i want to copy it from the internal data. i used to do this with windows mobile called a pim. it can then just be found, renamed, the phone reset, and then all the contacts dissapear, and the phone makes a new pim which is blank until you paste the original again.
can anyone tell me the file name or type . i tried sbu but found nothing. i have root explorer but dont know what i m looking for on android 2.2

Hi there - I think we got a wire crossed somewhere with this posting, it kinda ended up in the wrong thread. Reply to me where you'd like to ask this, and I'll help move it there for you. If you're not sure, please tell me your phone make and model and I'll help you from there.
 
Sorry, I forgot all about this thread.

I don't care if anyone says a 25mhz processor is more than enough to pull in 100mbps.

Fact is, my slower phones ran consistently between 110-140~kbps. My faster phone, the MT4G, consistently pulls in 220~kbps on EDGE.

You can deny that all you want, but that's real-world use.
As someone stated earlier, your actual processor has to render a lot more than a router. So I'm disregarding anything said about the routers or any sort. At home on wi-fi, right now, I'm running at 19Mbps. But that does not matter, since I was asking about the EDGE speeds being different.

So. What I know is: Tmobile's EDGE runs at a (somewhat) consistent speed on the same device. Between different devices (tested both simultaneously and randomly), with faster processors and more ram, you pull up your network speed. I'll post wi-fi examples between a MyTouch 3G Slide, T-Mobile 4G, and Moto Cliq

MyTouch 4G: (Down, Up)
1: 9132, 487
2: 8267, 451
3: 8203, 463
4: 8054, 445
5: 8618, 509

MyTouch Slide:
1: 2573, 355
2: 3192, 274
3: 3085, 292
4: 2912, 291
5: 4071, 510

Moto Cliq:
1: 1507, 557
2: 3680, 340
3: 3292, 288
4: 5546, 236
5: 4001, 284

Sooo... OBVIOUSLY there's something bottlenecking it.

Also, super annoying that I had to pull the SIM out of my MT4G and put it in the cliq. The MT4G still works without the SIM. Cliq does not.

Who was it that said a 25 mhz processor will pull the same speeds as a GHZ processor?
 
Unfortunately, this is a poor comparison.

-MyTouch 4G has a 14.4mbps HSUPA radio capable of maximum download/upload speeds of 14.4/5.7mbps.

-MyTouch Slide and Moto Cliq use a 7.2 radio capable of max speeds of 7.2/2.0. So, that comparison is out the window.

-The Moto Cliq has a slower CPU between the latter two phones, but in your tests, averages out to a faster download speed by about 500k. It has a slower upload speed about only 3k. So this only disproves your point.

As I've posted before, I agree with you that comparing a phone or PC's CPU to that of a router is pointless because of the differences in overhead versus available resources. Plus, a router only directs the traffic. It doesn't do anything with the data, whereas your PC or phone has to actually interpret the data and render it on screen.

So, due to issues with overhead, in theory, a 1ghz CPU should have fewer issues with data than a 500mhz CPU of the same product line. But, it won't a difference of 100%, but closer to 5% at best. It's just going to be a more consistent experience that won't be noticeable to the average person. Also, comparisons over 3G aren't very scientific because they are notoriously inconsistent and vary from minute to minute.
 
I dont understand why the upload speeds dont really change if the radio plays that big of a part on speed?
 
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