Do not "update" Windows.

[mikedt]

Spotted recently on a hotel lobby public computer in Hong Kong.

A timely reminder of why I don't do online banking, or anything which involves private information on public PCs, and why I use Linux and a Mac.

BTW the penguin icon by the clock is Tencent QQ, this is known to be spyware.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/08/world/asia/08censor.html?pagewanted=2&_r=2&ref=technology

"Even so, screening the electronic activities of hundreds of millions of people is a nearly impossible task. Moreover, users increasingly are resorting to technological maneuvers like virtual private networks and proxy servers to sidestep the censors’ blocking of banned Web sites altogether. By some reports, a million people now hurdle the Great Firewall via such dodges — a number that remains a tiny fraction of all users, but that has spiked upward in the last year.

So the censors have taken other tacks to tighten their grip.

One is automation. China’s leading instant-messaging service, called QQ, automatically installs a program on users’ computers that monitors their communications and blocks censored text."

 

[Isthmus]

This is why people should bother learning Linux. No one can screw with your system if you know what you are doing.

 

[dylo22]

This is why people should bother learning Linux. No one can screw with your system if you know what you are doing.

What does this got to do with learning linux? If they had a QQ program for linux, it would still be susceptible to surveillance. As soon as you give it permission to install, all the necessary spyware will be installed in a linux machine also. If you don't want the spyware on your machine, just don't install it. This goes for all OSes.

 

[ToastPwnz]

What does this got to do with learning linux? If they had a QQ program for linux, it would still be susceptible to surveillance. As soon as you give it permission to install, all the necessary spyware will be installed in a linux machine also. If you don't want the spyware on your machine, just don't install it. This goes for all OSes.

I'm not quite sure you understand how viruses work.
For starters, even if you gave the program permission to install in some variant of Linux, it would still need permission to access what it needs to to view your information constantly. One would assume that most people using Linux would find that fishy.
As far as other OS's (mainly Windows), your "If you don't want spyware on your computer, just don't install it" statement is quite far from the truth. A virus isn't something you knowingly download, and though in most cases antivirus software will prevent you from getting infected, there are multiple ways around antivirus software as well.

 

[dylo22]

I'm not quite sure you understand how viruses work.
For starters, even if you gave the program permission to install in some variant of Linux, it would still need permission to access what it needs to to view your information constantly. One would assume that most people using Linux would find that fishy.
As far as other OS's (mainly Windows), your "If you don't want spyware on your computer, just don't install it" statement is quite far from the truth. A virus isn't something you knowingly download, and though in most cases antivirus software will prevent you from getting infected, there are multiple ways around antivirus software as well.

I apologize for not being clear. I meant that it's irreverent which OS you know since the context of this thread is about a public machine. You have no control over how the machine is run when it is public. Whether it is windows or linux, using a public machine for sensitive data is always dangerous.

I don't doubt linux is more secure than windows. However, I'm not naive in thinking linux is some impenetrable machine.

 

[ToastPwnz]

I apologize for not being clear. I meant that it's irreverent which OS you know since the context of this thread is about a public machine. You have no control over how the machine is run when it is public. Whether it is windows or linux, using a public machine for sensitive data is always dangerous.

I don't doubt linux is more secure than windows. However, I'm not naive in thinking linux is some impenetrable machine.

It isn't, but if you don't give fishy things (or stupid things, like a picture) root access, it gets pretty darn close.

 

[Isthmus]

Fair enough that this is a public computer, but then again, no one should ever trust the security of any public computer or publicly accessible network.

As for linux, I was referring to a personal machine, not a public machine. The point I was making that not only is linux far more secure (it's no impenetrable wall as you said, but then I again, I didn't say that either), but also users have much deeper control over their systems, and typically more knowledge about them and what software gets on and off their machines. in other words, the likelyhood of an experienced linux user's system being infected by this kind of spyware is very small.

The point was, that by giving linux a try, one would expect users to also learn more about their systems. A better educated user, in turn generally avoids these kinds of issues.

 

[nyydynasty]

even if a computer is virus/spyware free, doing banking on a public computer is ALWAYS a stupid idea. you have NO idea what is loaded on that computer.

 

[mikedt]

even if a computer is virus/spyware free, doing banking on a public computer is ALWAYS a stupid idea. you have NO idea what is loaded on that computer.

Last week, when I was staying at the HK hotel, I did see quite a few unsuspecting and unwitting peeps logged into their Chase, Bank of America, Barclays, Santander and HSBC accounts on that lobby PC. Bet they're wondering where all their money vanished to.

 

[mikedt]

What does this got to do with learning linux? If they had a QQ program for linux, it would still be susceptible to surveillance. As soon as you give it permission to install, all the necessary spyware will be installed in a linux machine also. If you don't want the spyware on your machine, just don't install it. This goes for all OSes.

Actually there is a Linux and Mac version of QQ, but unlike the Windows one they do not run a load of background monitoring, censoring, keylogging and surveillance processes when the applications themselves are not running. Although the QQ for Linux and Mac applications themselves are subject to censoring and monitoring, this is normal for 'approved' Chinese IM software.

BTW there is a 'special' Chinese version of Skype(Windows only), which again has background surveillance and censoring processes going on. http://skype.tom.com/ Myself, I use the normal international versions of Skype.

 

[big_z]

This is why people should bother learning Linux. No one can screw with your system if you know what you are doing.

The point was, that by giving linux a try, one would expect users to also learn more about their systems. A better educated user, in turn generally avoids these kinds of issues.

On a large scale, when does this happen?

I say this as someone who uses all 3 major OSes. I know my way around computers because I've been fascinated by them since I was 3 years old. Most people don't give a crap about learning how computers work. They have tasks that they want to get done, and computers usually help them get that job done better and/or faster. People are creatures of habit; change the way that they're used to doing things and you'll usually get nothing more than a bunch of bellyaching and the minimum adaptation necessary to carry on their business.

By way of analogy, changing the air filter on your car is stupid-easy, yet most people will pay a shop an extra $50-80 to change it during an oil change. To most people, cars are tools that get people and things from point A to point B. They're not tools to broaden one's horizons.

 

[Bob Maxey]

View attachment 18186
Spotted recently on a hotel lobby public computer in Hong Kong.

A timely reminder of why I don't do online banking, or anything which involves private information on public PCs, and why I use Linux and a Mac.

BTW the penguin icon by the clock is Tencent QQ, this is known to be spyware.

I looked it up and apparently, Tencent QQ is an IM program. What am I missing?

 

[mikedt]

I looked it up and apparently, Tencent QQ is an IM program. What am I missing?

What I quoted from the NY Times article in my OP.

So the censors have taken other tacks to tighten their grip.

One is automation. China’s leading instant-messaging service, called QQ, automatically installs a program on users’ computers that monitors their communications and blocks censored text."

This spying, monitoring and censoring process runs all the time on a PC with QQ installed, regardless if one is actually using the QQ client itself.

Rather like Green Dam Youth Escort, but a lot more sneaky.
Green Dam Youth Escort - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

AFAICT this only affects the Chinese version of QQ.
QQ International intended for use by non-Chinese people is clean. There is also Web QQ, which is QQ on a webpage, again this is clean.

BTW I do use QQ myself, as it's such a useful way of communicating here. But I only use Web QQ.

EDIT:-

I should just add though, all IMs via the QQ service which goes through Tencent's servers in Shenzhen are subject to censoring and monitoring.