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When will Google implement GPU-acceleration in Android?

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It really hurts when you browse the internet on an iPhone, and you see how smooth it is without any lag at all. Scrolling and other operations around the OS is very smooth too.

How come we're at android version 2.3 now and we see no GPU-acceleration?
I know 2.3 brought gargabe collector and other sings, but browsing and swiping things around android is still relying on the CPU, while GPU is just chilling there.
 
I have no issues with web browsing on my vibrant and I have firefox installed as well. Web browsing is pretty fast for me when I do use it.
 
I believe GOU acceleration is slated to come out with honeycomb. It was, for a while, rumored to come with gingerbread though, so who really knows?
 
I just don't understand what google is thinking here... is tethering more important than GPU-acceleration? Is it really that hard to implement it? Isn't it one of the big priorities? And I thought Google had some of the worlds best engineers...
 
I am sure it takes more than just a thought to implement it. For what it's worth, I am also sure an entirely different team adds things like USB tethering than thnose that would work on GPU acceleration. It will come...

FWIW, look how long it took Apple to add key features like cut and paste!
 
Welcome to the forums, rekstrad.

1. What phone are you using?

2. What browser are you using?

3. The image / dsp / graphic subprocessors on any of the superphone's SoC is usually an area for the kernel - and that's typically up to the handset maker to tune.

4. image / dsl / gpu (there are typically all three there) ARE usually utilized by Android, the kernels, and the SoC firmware.

5. The GPU is not just chillin' there.

Like others, my browser suffers no lag, is lightning quick and smooth - and I'm using a Snapdragon.

Sounds like you've got more of a configuration issue than an OS issue.

Lots of us have used Androids next to various iPhone generations - including the iP4 - and wouldn't know what you're referring to here.
 
Layered UIs like HTC Sense and Touchwiz use GPU acceleration. Its one reason why custom Android builds from manufacturers takes so long --- they are working out the optimizations on their respective device GPUs. I will beat you the UI on the Desire Z is smoother than one on the G2 despite the same hardware. I know for certain, its smoother than Froyo on my Nexus One.

Note the GPUs of Android phones are not the same. If you optimize to one GPU, it can break on another. On generic Android, Google cannot play favorites, either to Qualcomm, Samsung, TI, nVidia or whoever makes chipsets that run Android. Gingerbread does have more native optimizations but you won't want to run down the route of having these optimizations end up being hardware dependent.

Look at Windows Phone 7. Its all very smooth. Yet all the phones are forced to run the same Qualcomm 8250 Snapdragon processor. Its the first generation type, even though Snapdragons with faster GPUs are now available. Why? Because these optimizations may have made the code hardware dependent. Changing the hardware means breaking and rewriting the code, and you cannot have an OS whose GUI routines need to store optimizations for five or six different processors and GPUs.
 
Layered UIs like HTC Sense and Touchwiz use GPU acceleration. Its one reason why custom Android builds from manufacturers takes so long --- they are working out the optimizations on their respective device GPUs. I will beat you the UI on the Desire Z is smoother than one on the G2 despite the same hardware. I know for certain, its smoother than Froyo on my Nexus One.

Note the GPUs of Android phones are not the same. If you optimize to one GPU, it can break on another. On generic Android, Google cannot play favorites, either to Qualcomm, Samsung, TI, nVidia or whoever makes chipsets that run Android. Gingerbread does have more native optimizations but you won't want to run down the route of having these optimizations end up being hardware dependent.

Look at Windows Phone 7. Its all very smooth. Yet all the phones are forced to run the same Qualcomm 8250 Snapdragon processor. Its the first generation type, even though Snapdragons with faster GPUs are now available. Why? Because these optimizations may have made the code hardware dependent. Changing the hardware means breaking and rewriting the code, and you cannot have an OS whose GUI routines need to store optimizations for five or six different processors and GPUs.

So it's like Dalvik and JIT that was introduced in FroYo. I think the speed increase was optimized for only Snapdragon(?) and processors like hummingbird wasn't fully opitimized for and it didin't believe the increase in speed for this kind of processor.
 
FWIW I have a Vibrant with a custom Froyo rom and, yes, I still get a little choppiness. It's not really that bad but compared to the iPhone it IS noticeable.

I'm planning on getting a nexus S just to see what the "pure" google experience is like on the latest OS. I have many questions and curiosities. I'll be sure to make a post on this topic as well.
 
Can Android be as smooth as iOs? Is OS X built with smoothness in mind(lol)? Can Android be that smooth with Java?

iOS's smoothness is just unbelievable. Could it be because Apple got more talented engineers than Google? :)
 
Can Android be as smooth as iOs?

If you go with Android and HTC Sense on an equivalent platform, yes - in fact, it's far smoother.

Is OS X built with smoothness in mind(lol)?

Yes, that was one of the targets of Aqua layer.

I've used OS X since before the public beta. I've worked on the Mach microkernel (perhaps you've heard of it) and extended it for real-time operations.

The early development history of OS X is really quite a story of technical triumphs from a systems programming perspective.

Can Android be that smooth with Java?

Java vs. Objective C has nothing to do with it.

Apple's had OpenGL support for years before Android was even conceived.

With the advent of furthering this layer of support as Android evolves (after all, it's already accomplishing so much more in areas that Apple's not considering yet), then you might expect even more astounding graphics as time progresses from generic Android.

And you ask these questions at an odd time, as the Android roadmap specifically didn't target the UI until the now-existent Gingerbread release.

iOS's smoothness is just unbelievable.

It is VERY smooth.

This is exactly what happens when you fully specify the hardware and build the graphical interface to match it.

However, having used an iPhone 4, I don't find it unbelievable at all - I do tend to believe my eyes.

The same three statements can be said for the Desire HD or the Evo running Froyo - for the exact same reasons - total hardware integration with a specialized software team exploiting the platform fully. Adding a higher-performance, independently-developed kernel to the mix makes the entire solution jaw-dropping. Naturally, HTC tends to incorporate these sort of updates once proven in the dev / root community.

Could it be because Apple got more talented engineers than Google? :)

Given Apple's business proclivities, we'll never really know the answer to that question. Sadly, their management heavy-handedness tends to cause their best and brightest to leave, but happily, you often see Apple hiring new market leaders to work on their software side.

Don't you find it really, really sad, as I do, that Android uses the same unix-based pre-emptive multitasking as OS X, yet they chose to hamstring the iPhone with iOS, possibly forever, with a multitasking scheme that harkens back to Windows 95 and has no possibility of ever performing like Android?

Don't you feel sorry for iPhone users that can't access Flash sites properly?

Don't you fell sorry for iPhone users that have to pay for most of the apps that we find free in the Android market?

Don't you agree that it might've made more sense to provide iOS a solid foundation for technical capability so that it might one day catch up with Android, rather than getting the eye candy right first, and then the infrastructure?

All in all, I have to agree with you 100% - iOS sucks the chrome off of a bumper hitch without trying.

And yet, the iPhone just looks so smooth.
 
Thank you for your nice reply. How come Google didin't put UI development on the map when they started putting in more futures, like tethering and Flash Player? If they wanted to "stop Steve Jobs" from world domination, wasn't it a good idea to prioritize the UI and the UI team?

Also, when I ask some of my friends at my job, the first answer they give me is: Android is slow. And I immediately assume that they mean it's not smooth. And that why I think Google is shooting itself in the foot by not making it one of the top priorities.

Also at "http://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=6914" it's Priority-Medium. This means that Honeycomb will probably NOT get accelerated menus and graphics. It's a shame really, because Android is a powerful platform and Google isn't realizing the weaknesses of it.

And one more thing is really bothering me. Google has the worlds best Search Engine, but somehow they managed to get probably the worlds world Android Market search. Isn't that a bit.. ironic? :) Is Google afraid that Android is open source and people can get the Android Market algorithms of Google search, which they might implement in the market? I don't see any other reason Google isn't improving the market search.

:)
 
Well, the answers to your question are largely market and business defined.

Apple is a hardware company. You can't buy their operating systems on anything but their hardware. When you go with their combo, they're quite unbeatable in some areas.

If we look at the history of the iPhone, it evolved from what many considered to already be the most advanced media player interface. Remember how Jobs introduced the iPhone: Here's our most advanced iPod and it even makes phone calls! (I paraphrase from memory, but that's nearly perfect - and exactly perfect in its spirit.)

And it's built from there.

Rather than call out the UI, you'd be closer to the truth calling out the media experience. With Apples experience with the industry-leading QuickTime engine (that tends to be a dog on a Win platform, so most people don't get how astounding it is when configured for proper execution) and their Adobe-shaming iPhoto and Preview apps, it was no surprise that the iPhone performs so well as a media platform.

The iPhone's had full codec support that's only now coming to Android - because the iPhone was designed to interface with a Mac or iTunes host flawlessly.

Now - take Android.

Unlike Apple, Google is not a hardware company - Google is purely a software company.

Google designed Android to complete the vision of cell phone pioneers that it acquired a few years before Android's release and had a different goal than to move Google's (non-existent) iron:

  • To provide a smartphone operating platform that competed with Apple, RIM, and Windows by providing an open architecture and FOSS

Just as OS X's humble beginnings were BSD, so too was Android's beginnings with pure Linux.

Unlike Apple's offering that could be fine-tuned for a particular hardware class, Google's offering was designed to reach the broader market.

When Apple built OS X, they already had decades of UI design, going back to their inheritance from Xerox PARC.

When Google built Android, they had no such background (as an organization - their new Android leaders did have some cutting edge UI ideas looking for a home, though), and adopted Linux as the foundation - and let's face it - the Year of the Linux Desktop never really happened.

So, in a few short years, Google's accomplished a great deal with Android.

You can want them to tackle all fronts quickly so as to catch or surpass Apple in every area - and I often hear that Google has the money, so why not? as an argument - but the simple truth is that 9 women cannot have a baby in one month.

Integration takes time.

I'm not sure what you mean when you ask why they put tethering and Flash on the map and not the UI.

It really goes back to their overall approach - get the performance they desired, up to the JIT compiler in Froyo (2.2) and then deal with the UI.

Actually - this is paying off for Google.

Apple was long-locked into its UI. Have you noticed that the new retinal display is exactly 4x (2x2) greater than its predecessor, and is now 960x640?

Everything got painted into that 480x320 corner. The only easy path to migration for a suitable display was to go overboard - so the software to be updated needed only a 2x scaling in each dimension. Not that there's anything wrong with the retinal display - other than they sure had to put a lot of pixels into a space where fewer (cheaper) would've been just as invisible to the users' eyes. An example of UI-first thinking.

Meanwhile - the Android dev community was forced into more traditional resolution scaling methods, and has the _potential_ for a healthier future for the UIs because infrastructure and portability came first.

As far as the UI being a medium priority, especially for acceleration - yeah - of course.

Android is generic and can brought out on lower-cost, lower-performance devices.

That does not prevent vendors from putting out higher-capability systems at a higher cost - just like with an Apple, better performance can be had and it will simply cost more.

Here's a few things for you to Google - on my phone, I have the basic arm-7 architecture support, but I have more than arm-7 -- so my flavor of Android is also extended with kernel support for swp, half thumb, fastmult, vfp, thumbee and neon.

And my browser codebase? Well, here's its UA:

  • Mozilla/5.0 (with Linux details); AppleWebKit/533.1(KHTML, like Gecko) Version/4.0 Mobile Safari/533.1

So - on that browser thing - maybe you just have not seen the right one on the right Android platform yet.

And yes - you can run Android on small iron or misconfigure it on big iron - and it will lag. You can make iOS lag, too.

Google just updated their Market. I have no comments on their Market search. I think their Market just has a ways to go and is also showing some youthfulness - again - they didn't have a years-long iTMS experience model to draw from before moving forward.
 
Forgot about the checkerboard pattern you see when browsing the internet on an iPhone? There goes the smoothness.
 
If they wanted to "stop Steve Jobs" from world domination, wasn't it a good idea to prioritize the UI and the UI team?

A sig (not mine) on another forum says, with apologies to Voltaire, if Apple hadn't existed first, it would've been necessary for Google to invent them.

The iPhone came first and changed the way most people thought of smartphones.

It will always have an avid following.

Now there's Google - improving the user experience, while Apple finally attacked their lower resolution display and iOS limitations.

Competition in the marketplace is a healthy thing for all of us consumers.

World domination, iPhone-killer, Android is a wild-west porn platform - all statements of hyperbole relegated to the distortion fields of marketing.

I've used iPhones, you couldn't pay me to carry one.

I've no doubt that they're iPhone users who can honestly say the same for Android.

Choice is good.

I find Android gives more choice, so I prefer it - a lot.
 
When you scroll up and down in the Android 2.2 browser, you see a sh** load of lagg, while the iOS browser is silky smooth.

Not on a well-configured Evo - it takes off like a bat out of hell and it accelerates to match the finger swipe speed, just like an iPhone - only _much_ faster than an iP4.

I did find some lag when I first used 2.2 - but again - configuring this, especially using an ad blocker for ad-heavy spammy sites - made this disappear completely.

No tearing, no lag - and the browser can be configured to act mobile or full desktop (not just one checkbox).
 


I think Apple is a single-minded corporation, prioritizing the user experience, while Google is an engineering driven business. While a design driven company excludes a lot of characteristics of an app/OS/website, for the reason that a lot of features interferes with a simplistic design (that's Apple's persona), Google has preferred to employ a whole group of futures and doesn't let designer's brainpower to get in their approach. And agree that this has assisted Android a bit.

Furthermore, you said that Apple had decades of UI fluency. More than 10 years of Google's life span, Google's design model is, if truth be told, really uncomplicated and undemanding. I mean it’s zero graphical, just transcript and tinted borders.

Can't Google just put together a bunch of industry leading UI designers for Android? Well, not just Android, but their other products as well As you said, Google has over $30B cash inside their depository.

Gmail’s interface is dull as hell, Picasa is nothing but a pain to look at, YouTube is to some extent involving; Google News is awfully effortless and nothing amazing. It goes on and on.

But I don't really think Google cares much about the UI of their assets, because as I said, it's an engineering driven company, and geeks doesn't really have a sense of style nor good looking bits and pieces. :-)

Look at the difference in the browser part:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tbb1b3AXOGs
 
Actually, if you look in the industry press - Google's been in several bidding wars for the finest mobile UI talent, to the point of trying to lure them from other firms. I'm aware that some of this has become public within the last 4 months. I don't know how they've actually progressed on that front, tho.

The companies' respective foundations cannot be overstressed.

When you say an Apple phone, you're referring to an iPhone running iOS.

When you say _a_ Google phone, you're referring to a non-specific handset running Android.

I've submitted that rather than expect Google to solve this, look to a handset maker that knows how to make a very good UI.

That's available today.

If you want the sort of power that Sense or the new Sense gives - it's available now.

If you want that sort of power prepackaged into generic Android - yep, you're right, they need to hire people and do something about that.

Many people think Sense is just eye candy or a skin. Perhaps these illuminate, if you're unfamiliar -

OLD Sense:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kax24GN1458


NEW Sense: HTC - HTC Sense

(Here's a pre-release with bugs - gives a good idea, though) -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_fExfBZfWY

An essay on how the Nexus targets are different than for other Android phones (more text by yours truly) - perhaps relevant because the Nexus One and Nexus S are _the_ Google phones.
 
Look at the difference in the browser part:

Yep - and look at the fact that that's running Android 2.1 (note his early mention of Eclair), not 2.2 - on one of HTC's most memory-starved handsets.

Because once of these comparisons are out, they last forever, but they're not set in stone.

I know two guys who were negatively impacted by the new iOS on their iP3GS phones.

So, yes, in March of this year, a decent Desire was slower than a good iP3 configuration.

If you get a chance, try it on a decently configured Desire HD or Evo running 2.2 vs. an iP4.

The results may surprise or please you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yAZYSVr2Bhc

I wouldn't judge the iPhone by the previous generation hardware/software, I wouldn't judge HTC that way either.

That was then, this is now, change is constant.
 
Yep - and look at the fact that that's running Android 2.1 (note his early mention of Eclair), not 2.2 - on one of HTC's most memory-starved handsets.

Because once of these comparisons are out, they last forever, but they're not set in stone.

I know two guys who were negatively impacted by the new iOS on their iP3GS phones.

So, yes, in March of this year, a decent Desire was slower than a good iP3 configuration.

If you get a chance, try it on a decently configured Desire HD or Evo running 2.2 vs. an iP4.

The results may surprise or please you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yAZYSVr2Bhc

I wouldn't judge the iPhone by the previous generation hardware/software, I wouldn't judge HTC that way either.

That was then, this is now, change is constant.

Well, apple's first try (1st generation iPhone) was waay more smoother than android 2.2 AND 2.3's browser. Thats a bit funny.
 
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