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AT&T: I upgraded to 4.3 but do not have the KNOX app. WHY?

J

jshoe22

Well-Known Member
AT&T: I upgraded to 4.3 but do not have the KNOX app. WHY? I'd really like to use it for work. Thanks
 
Well it wont have the Knox "Efuse".. thats a piece of physical hardware inside a chip that gets tripped if you mod your phone (flash unofficial firmware) and cannot be un-tripped. Its in the s4 and the big samsung devs are scratching their heads over it lol.
The s3 doesnt contain such a thing and all traces of modding can be removed if need be :)
 
funkylogik said:
Well it wont have the Knox "Efuse".. thats a piece of physical hardware inside a chip that gets tripped if you mod your phone (flash unofficial firmware) and cannot be un-tripped. Its in the s4 and the big samsung devs are scratching their heads over it lol.
The s3 doesnt contain such a thing and all traces of modding can be removed if need be :)
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Oh the SGSIII has it Funky, it just isn't used yet..
At the moment Knox is not quite ready to use on the SGSIII. You'll have the "joys" of a locked bootloader that will register a custom recovery and trip the Knox flag soon enough. On the SGS4 there are people using custom ROMs, rooted and Knox free using the old bootloader that doesn't have it activated. On the Note 3 it had been there since day one.

It is still not confirmed that it is an e-fuse, although current thought thinks it is.
 
surely the likes of my s3 is safe though bro, i havent used sammy firmware since straight after getting 4.1.
Its kinda important to me because i plan to return the phone just before my 2yr warranty ends and claim display LED burn-in so get a new display (or phone) :-)
 
funkylogik said:
surely the likes of my s3 is safe though bro, i havent used sammy firmware since straight after getting 4.1.
Its kinda important to me because i plan to return the phone just before my 2yr warranty ends and claim display LED burn-in so get a new display (or phone) :-)
Click to expand...

You'll be fine, just don't accept any updates OTA or Kies. When the time comes to.. ahem "trade in" your phone flash using Odin to the latest version of your official firmware from SamMobile.

In SGS4 land the work around was to have had one on before "Knox activated" firmware (pre BGG for those that know about these things) this did not have the locked bootloader. You could root as normal and flash away to your hearts content. Many devs included a "Knox free" version of their TW based ROMs with the old bootloader rather than the new one. The new one while you can still root it will trip your "Knox flag" as soon as you try and install a custom recovery. There is as yet only an experimental way of rooting without tripping the Knox flag on these new bootloaders on the SGS4, I am presuming the 4.3 firmware for SGSIII owners will do exactly the same thing, lock your bootloader and make rooting more difficult and then installing a custom recovery will (without a shadow of doubt) trip your Knox flag. As yet there is no way around this, because the actual act of changing anything, even on a rooted successfully device trips Knox, rendering a software hack impossible. Knox once tripped is irreversible it is an eFuse, or so they say. It is not officially confirmed.
 
I got 4.3 yesterday on my Sprint S3 and Knox is there. It's located in Device Administrators under Security.
 
harvickchick said:
Is this update better than the one everyone was complaining about? I'm scared.
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Don't be scared, just be warned. Knox will not bother you or your phone unless you plan to root your phone. If your device is working nicely ATM don't accept any updates for a while until people report back on it. Better waiting a fortnight or so and make sure it is working correctly for others.
 
I don't even know what Knox is and I'm not rooted lol. In the leaked version of 4.3 there were a lot of bugs and stuff so hopefully now they're all worked out :)
 
dynomot said:
You'll be fine, just don't accept any updates OTA or Kies. When the time comes to.. ahem "trade in" your phone flash using Odin to the latest version of your official firmware from SamMobile.

In SGS4 land the work around was to have had one on before "Knox activated" firmware (pre BGG for those that know about these things) this did not have the locked bootloader. You could root as normal and flash away to your hearts content. Many devs included a "Knox free" version of their TW based ROMs with the old bootloader rather than the new one. The new one while you can still root it will trip your "Knox flag" as soon as you try and install a custom recovery. There is as yet only an experimental way of rooting without tripping the Knox flag on these new bootloaders on the SGS4, I am presuming the 4.3 firmware for SGSIII owners will do exactly the same thing, lock your bootloader and make rooting more difficult and then installing a custom recovery will (without a shadow of doubt) trip your Knox flag. As yet there is no way around this, because the actual act of changing anything, even on a rooted successfully device trips Knox, rendering a software hack impossible. Knox once tripped is irreversible it is an eFuse, or so they say. It is not officially confirmed.
Click to expand...

Oh dear. I had an arguement with a dude on g+ who claimed the s3 has the Efuse... so it does then?
Should i be warning potential rooters to not take the 4.3 update?
Im gutted for the s4 peeps who had it sprung on them.
Samsung can go chase themselves man ill never buy one again :thumbdown:
 
funkylogik said:
Oh dear. I had an arguement with a dude on g+ who claimed the s3 has the Efuse... so it does then?
Should i be warning potential rooters to not take the 4.3 update?
Im gutted for the s4 peeps who had it sprung on them.
Samsung can go chase themselves man ill never buy one again :thumbdown:
Click to expand...


It is not confirmed 100% if it is an eFuse on any device. It does appear to be so, it is the only way Knox can be seen as secured. The Knox flag is there to show It departments the device is secure and guranteed so. Trip it and Samsung cannot guarantee that, hence the flag.

The bottom line is if your never going to use your device in a BYOD world it will make no difference, unless you want to make a warranty claim. Then Samsung may or may not (depending on many things) honour your warranty.

Root and install a custom recovery and you must understand the above, you still have a choice.
 
jshoe22 said:
I use my personal device for work. Will I be getting the KNOX app?
Click to expand...

You already have Knox. It is hardware and software. The hardware was always there, the new bootloaders (from 4.3 firmware onwards) are locked and activate it. If you root with a new bootloader that's OK, if you install a custom recovery to flash mods it will trip the flag. No bother to anyone who owns the device and dosen't need Knox security. It will trip the Knox flag and the device will work as normal.

Three things everyone should know about Knox:

1) It looks like the flag that changes is due to an eFuse blowing. This is where the new bootloader checks one bit on a chip and if it had been changed from 0 to 1 (ie blown) it has tripped the Knox flag. This can never be reset, the bootloader may possibly be reversed engineered to "fool" it so it reports as a normal 0 state but so far this has proved impossible for the developers.

2) It means if your employer allows you to use your own phone for corporate use (email, notes, file sharing etc) and has a BYOD (Bring Your Own Device) policy where the IT department checks your device and installs the Knox application to it to use secure features and the Knox flag is tripped then you can't install and run the Knox application. The Knox application is downloadable by anyone with a Knox enabled device it provides a secure (military strength) environment for corporate use and is basically a secure phone within a phone. All your family photos, porn, whatever your own stuff is not available from Knox and all your work stuff email, work documents etc is not available out of the Knox application to you. Technically it provides a secure container for your work things while allowing full use (without root of course) of your phone for your stuff, and never the two will meet.

3) Current thinking is that tripping the Knox flag by rooting rooting and installing a custom recovery will not invalidate your Samsung warranty. This is still a grey area, but there are more reports that Samsung will honour a warranty than not with a Knox flag tripped device. The warranty it invalidates is the security warranty that Samsung provide with Knox, not the device warranty against defects.

4) Tripping your Knox flag technically breaks your phone. While Samsung will cover you for the home button sticking or the earpiece failing under your warranty the phone cannot ever be used for corporate use or run the Knox application. This to be fair and honest should be mentioned to anyone buying a Knox tripped phone second hand.

Knox is great for Samsung it gives them leverage into the corporate world and even the security services IT. It makes no difference to those that own their phones for themselves only and will never use it for work in a BYOD scenario. It is just annoying for those of us that root.


Now the dust is settling in Knox it appears it is not the locked down, warranty ending anti root thing it appeared to be. I feel compelled to share the knowledge I have to all that ask about it. If it becomes absolutely clear from Samsung that tripping the Knox flag will not invalidate the warranty it really is business add usual for those that root provided they never want to use their phone for work.
 
^^ thanks for that mate. It clears things up a lot.
I guess the custom firmware/warranty thing has always been a grey area long before knox. I think legally your warranty can only be made void if your actions/firmware/mods caused the fault but try telling that to the manufacturer :banghead:
 
funkylogik said:
^^ thanks for that mate. It clears things up a lot.
I guess the custom firmware/warranty thing has always been a grey area long before knox. I think legally your warranty can only be made void if your actions/firmware/mods caused the fault but try telling that to the manufacturer :banghead:
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Your spot on in regards to those of us in the European Union funky, but outside the EU I have no idea. Most rooted users if they are denied a genuine warranty repair walk away or pay for it to be repaired, it is mainly a get out clause that is strictly speaking illegal. It would take a class action of thousands of rooted users denied a warranty repair to get Samsung to publicly state that Rooting is OK, and that won't happen.
 
Exactly man. I keep wishing one of the major android sites would make a test case out of it. I know i cant afford to take an OEM to court lol :D
 
I hate to say it but you are wrong when you say I have the Knox app. I don't. Yes Knox is on the phone, but if you listen to what I say I want the Knox APP. You know like the GS4 has. Is the GS3 getting the APP?
 
dynomot said:
Oh the SGSIII has it Funky, it just isn't used yet..
At the moment Knox is not quite ready to use on the SGSIII. You'll have the "joys" of a locked bootloader that will register a custom recovery and trip the Knox flag soon enough. On the SGS4 there are people using custom ROMs, rooted and Knox free using the old bootloader that doesn't have it activated. On the Note 3 it had been there since day one.

It is still not confirmed that it is an e-fuse, although current thought thinks it is.
Click to expand...

Ok cool. I hope I get the app soon.
 
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