Bang Bang Racing - would love your feedback

[Vanquished]

if you run things like chainfire you have to expect shit to be messed up. Don't play tegra games on non-tegra devices. Instead of bashing the dev, look at your hardware...if its not tegra then pony up the cash cheapo. This runs smooth as butter on my xoom, common sense says I wouldn't even touch it with my captivate.

As shaolin said, it seems you are misunderstanding not only what is being said, but what Chainfire 3D is capable of and how the Nvidia chip really isn't all that is is hyped up to be.

Chainfire 3D has allowed people with non-tegra devices to play every Tegra game on the market perfectly, with exception to this one (and any other game that is coded to use the PhysX). This goes to show you that these other devices are perfectly capable of playing these games.

@OP. I would by this game in a heart beat if I could, it looks really cool, but alas, I do not have a Tegra powered phone nor do I plan on getting one. I am however getting the E3D when that comes out at the end of this month, and aside from current devices being able to handle it, I'm pretty sure this could as well (along with the SGSII, Sensation and other dual-core phones coming out on the market), so why limit your profits to one chip set.

Of the hundreds of Android phones that are out, very few people have Tegra 2 devices. Of the few people that actually own these devices not all of them play games. Of the ones that do play games not all of them may like racing games. Of the few people who like racing games this particular "genre" of racing may not appeal to them; and so on...The market you are trying to enter is so small, you won't survive if you don't expand to other devices (in particular the dual core phones, but as both I and other users have stated, there are older devices that can probably handle this fairly well).

I'm sure you could find lots of help over at http://www.xda-developers.com/ to optimize the game on quite a few devices without losing the current game play that you say is only capable with PhysX if you are having trouble. As someone said in another forum about this same arugment, if you really want to you can slap the "works best with Nvidia" sticker on it, but once again limiting the game only to this one device is flat out idiotic.

An example of a game that is really similar which has already been mentioned is Reckless Racing, you should probably check it out. The game is amazing, and doesn't seem to be much different from your game, physics engine and all (the main difference being the "rally" genre while yours has more of a NASCAR/F1 feel to it). This is proof that you can get your game working on other devices without losing any gameplay features (with exception to maybe scaling down the graphics).

You'll notice that the pictures and gameplay video resemble your game quite a bit:
https://market.android.com/details?id=com.polarbit.RecklessRacing&feature=search_result

 

[xtracrispy69]

oh I'm sorry, I misread the optimized requirements! I just thought it would run properly on a tegra device...maybe that's why I used my tegra device and have no problems and not on an sgs. Chainfire may allow many games to play, but the root of the issue is that you are still trying to play a tegra game on a non-tegra device. Any PC gamer fights issues with this stuff constantly, I'm surprised that people don't abide by specs. How many people do I still see trying to run these sort of games on an og droid? Really a year and a half year old phone and you're still trying to game....Everything will be going towards tegra especially with the quads coming...pony up the cash boys

 

[Rural]

Chainfire3D is not the only sollution. There are also modded versions of a small number of Tegra 2-games that works fine without Chainfire3D and root access.
I have not tried these games myself as I do not wish to support the pirate movement, but I've seen them run like butter on Desire HD and SGS2.
If only developers could take note in this "modification" and include it in their games to expand their costumer base by millions, I would buy their games straight away.

 

[Quboid]

I'm a PC gamer and I know that any developer who releases stuff that is locked to particular hardware better have a good reason if they want any credibility. My SGS2 is not "cheapo" hardware, it's probably the highest performance phone on the market.

I appreciate that there can be reasons for exclusive games. If the Tegra 2 is the only system on a chip with a GPGPU (i.e. one with general purpose cores) then things like PhysX will only work on them properly - but games like Reckless Racing strongly suggest that PhysX isn't necessary. If nothing else, an effective 99% as good physics simulation could be done on the CPU.

I know money makes the world go around. I strongly suspect that the reason why this is a Tegra 2 exclusive is because Nvidia have paid for it to be an exclusive and that's fine, but don't tell us it's not possible when it's just not as profitable.

 

[Vanquished]

oh I'm sorry, I misread the optimized requirements! I just thought it would run properly on a tegra device...maybe that's why I used my tegra device and have no problems and not on an sgs. Chainfire may allow many games to play, but the root of the issue is that you are still trying to play a tegra game on a non-tegra device. Any PC gamer fights issues with this stuff constantly, I'm surprised that people don't abide by specs. How many people do I still see trying to run these sort of games on an og droid? Really a year and a half year old phone and you're still trying to game....Everything will be going towards tegra especially with the quads coming...pony up the cash boys

That's not the point. The point is that these games are perfectly capable of being run on other devices, and the creation of Chainfire 3D proves this. Yes, some devices are slightly outdated, such as the Droid, but newer devices such as the SGS are more than powerful enough. Making a game for a specific chipset that is not as powerful as it is beafed up to be, and has even been deamed flawed by the manufacturer, is bad business. Nvidia and their Tegra line are not the only CPU/GPU manufacturers for mobile devices and they never will be.

I'm not sure what you mean by PC gamers fighting with these issues because most people I know, including myself, have PC's that are 3+ years old and are still running new games flawlessly. The graphics may not be Crisis quality, but they still look and run good.

 

[Shocky]

I'm not sure what you mean by PC gamers fighting with these issues because most people I know, including myself, have PC's that are 3+ years old and are still running new games flawlessly. The graphics may not be Crisis quality, but they still look and run good.

Agreed, so long as your running something recent (last 5 years) from AMD or nvidia you can run any game, just with hugely different levels of detail.

I can still run Crysis on my old 7800GT, runs quite well at 720p with medium settings.

 

[shaolin95]

That's not the point. The point is that these games are perfectly capable of being run on other devices, and the creation of Chainfire 3D proves this. Yes, some devices are slightly outdated, such as the Droid, but newer devices such as the SGS are more than powerful enough. Making a game for a specific chipset that is not as powerful as it is beafed up to be, and has even been deamed flawed by the manufacturer, is bad business. Nvidia and their Tegra line are not the only CPU/GPU manufacturers for mobile devices and they never will be.

I'm not sure what you mean by PC gamers fighting with these issues because most people I know, including myself, have PC's that are 3+ years old and are still running new games flawlessly. The graphics may not be Crisis quality, but they still look and run good.

Exactly!
He missed the point again.
The problem again, is , some devs are trying to tell us their games are only TEGRA because only Tegra is able to handle them which is a horrible lie to us. The fact they say that clearly shows they have a hidden agenda.
My Galaxy plays Riptide just like the Tegra even with the added processing used by the chainfire driver so you tell me if they are not full of BS (and $$$ from Nvidia) when trying to sell us the idea Only Tegra can do it.

 

[Scottola]

I think the game looks very nice, the graphics are very clean and have their own style. The viewing angle, seems just about right.

Gameplay wise, it does look like a Reckless sort of game, but with an injection of Micro Machines.

I've got the Galaxy S2, so unfortunately I'm out of your catchment area, but if you do get to convert it across, I'll take a further look.

 

[xtracrispy69]

what I'm saying is that the devs chose to base their game upon tegra. So really who are you to give them shit over that choice. Really they should say if you don't like it don't play. I understood this before I got my xoom. I didn't try and play things my sgs couldn't handle or wasn't made for. Still don't have gingerbread or an xperia play. So at no point would I try to run them, even with cm7. I could try, but to me its not worth the time nor effort. This thread would be better suited for constructive criticism or praise from those meeting the exact requirements of the game. My original post was clear, running tegra system, non-rooted, stock and the game would fc every so often after a race. Constructive....

 

[xtracrispy69]

this is a constructive piece..... this fellow obviously understands. Chainfire should not even be mentioned in this thread as the dev does not condone it for their game.

I think the game looks very nice, the graphics are very clean and have their own style. The viewing angle, seems just about right.

Gameplay wise, it does look like a Reckless sort of game, but with an injection of Micro Machines.

I've got the Galaxy S2, so unfortunately I'm out of your catchment area, but if you do get to convert it across, I'll take a further look.

 

[shaolin95]

what I'm saying is that the devs chose to base their game upon tegra. So really who are you to give them shit over that choice. Really they should say if you don't like it don't play. I understood this before I got my xoom. I didn't try and play things my sgs couldn't handle or wasn't made for. Still don't have gingerbread or an xperia play. So at no point would I try to run them, even with cm7. I could try, but to me its not worth the time nor effort. This thread would be better suited for constructive criticism or praise from those meeting the exact requirements of the game. My original post was clear, running tegra system, non-rooted, stock and the game would fc every so often after a race. Constructive....

And once again it shows you still dont get it.
After so many attemps from me and other its obvious you are not going to get it so its pointless to keep trying.
Once again, if my phone couldnt handle Riptide, Samurai or the Pinball...care to explain why I am playing them perfectly fine?
Its called BS marketing bulling by Nvidia...oh and btw, I own Nvidia video cards for 3d Vision so I am not an ATI fan boy.
Regards

 

[xtracrispy69]

don't take your issues with nvidia out on the devs. They chose to use tegra, and can continue to do so. It's great you play all those games...but the issue remains that you can only do so through chainfire. But don't harp at them because your non-tegra device can't play a tegra game just like the others. Or provide adequate feedback in what is working. Maybe I"m simple but I don't stretch my device beyond it's means. No tegra on my sgs, no tegra games. I know chainfire will allow some instances, but I'm not going to complain if it doesnt....
Also how did you get bang bang? I can't get it on my sgs through the market but can with the xoom.... Hope you didn't hack their. market or pirate!

And once again it shows you still dont get it.
After so many attemps from me and other its obvious you are not going to get it so its pointless to keep trying.
Once again, if my phone couldnt handle Riptide, Samurai or the Pinball...care to explain why I am playing them perfectly fine?
Its called BS marketing bulling by Nvidia...oh and btw, I own Nvidia video cards for 3d Vision so I am not an ATI fan boy.
Regards

 

[Vanquished]

what I'm saying is that the devs chose to base their game upon tegra. So really who are you to give them shit over that choice. Really they should say if you don't like it don't play. I understood this before I got my xoom. I didn't try and play things my sgs couldn't handle or wasn't made for. Still don't have gingerbread or an xperia play. So at no point would I try to run them, even with cm7. I could try, but to me its not worth the time nor effort. This thread would be better suited for constructive criticism or praise from those meeting the exact requirements of the game. My original post was clear, running tegra system, non-rooted, stock and the game would fc every so often after a race. Constructive....

I thought my posts were fairly constructive. Not once did I use vulgure language, and I not only gave an example of another game similar to theirs that runs fine without the use of Tegra or PhysX but pointed them to some people who could help them optimize it for other devices. The mention of Chainfire 3D also goes along with the conversation nicely, reglardless of what you think. PlayBox said that other devices are not capable of playing the game because the lack of the Tegra chip. Chainfire 3D proves this to be false.

You are right though, it is their choice to make it Tegra specific, but in doing so they are losing tons of sales by targeting such a small market, as I have already stated. Any game that can run on a Tegra device is capable of running on quite a few other devices just as well, if not better.

Also how did you get bang bang? I can't get it on my sgs through the market but can with the xoom.... Hope you didn't hack their. market or pirate!

You don't need a Tegra device to download Tegra Zone and pay for apps that are listed there.

 

[xtracrispy69]

granted you're right its their choice. I'm sure they factored monetary loss/gain into their decision. At the end of the day, it's done. If you don't have a tegra device and download tegra zone...as a user you have to expect things not to work (even with chainfire). If it doesn't work, don't complain, don't criticize their choice for using tegra. I bought a tegra device on top of my regular sgs just so I'd have access to these style of games.

 

[shaolin95]

Maybe I"m simple but I don't stretch my device beyond it's means.m.... Hope you didn't hack their. market or pirate!

I am simply amazed that you can miss the point over and over again bro..seriously now.
What part you are not getting yet? Your comment about makes it seem like you are not ever reading previous posts.

I don't stretch my device beyond it's means

Have you been reading at all? We are not trying to strecth a device beyond its limits...isnt the fact that we can play Tegra games enough to make that clear for you ?
I dont care if a dev wants to create a game for Tegra only that is their choice, what we do not like is devs that plainly lie to us about how their games cannot be played on anything else because all other gear lacks the power to do so. If you like to be lied like that and have companies force upgrades on your based on BS then be my guest but other people know a LOT better than to fall for that crap.
If a dev is small an needs Nvidia funding to create a game then by all means, if I were that small company I would probably take the chance but I wont come out spreading BS about how it is on Tegra because it is the only one that can handle it because now, when someone finds a way to make it work they end up being exposed as liars and the real reasons behind it are very clear.
If you dont get it this time...sincerely I have no idea how else to make it clearer for you.

 

[k3Ck]

I tried the demo.

I did not like the controls or camera angles. Besides for that it was pretty good. I wouldn't buy it unless those issues were fixed.

 

[xtracrispy69]

Oh I'm quite clear my friend, you don't see the real point. This is their game...they develop it for what platform they like. They chose tegra, you can't say anything about it. They will continue to make a great game, I've given my support. If you don't like the game or devs...leave. Simple. Or yet check this....buy a tegra optimized device It a shame a little teenie like you can't afford a device that'll run your little games...need a donation?

I am simply amazed that you can miss the point over and over again bro..seriously now.
What part you are not getting yet? Your comment about makes it seem like you are not ever reading previous posts.

Have you been reading at all? We are not trying to strecth a device beyond its limits...isnt the fact that we can play Tegra games enough to make that clear for you ?
I dont care if a dev wants to create a game for Tegra only that is their choice, what we do not like is devs that plainly lie to us about how their games cannot be played on anything else because all other gear lacks the power to do so. If you like to be lied like that and have companies force upgrades on your based on BS then be my guest but other people know a LOT better than to fall for that crap.
If a dev is small an needs Nvidia funding to create a game then by all means, if I were that small company I would probably take the chance but I wont come out spreading BS about how it is on Tegra because it is the only one that can handle it because now, when someone finds a way to make it work they end up being exposed as liars and the real reasons behind it are very clear.
If you dont get it this time...sincerely I have no idea how else to make it clearer for you.

 

[shaolin95]

Oh I'm quite clear my friend, you don't see the real point. This is their game...they develop it for what platform they like. They chose tegra, you can't say anything about it. They will continue to make a great game, I've given my support. If you don't like the game or devs...leave. Simple. Or yet check this....buy a tegra optimized device It a shame a little teenie like you can't afford a device that'll run your little games...need a donation?

ha first for your information 95 in my nickname is the year I got my Black Belt not when I was born kiddo.
Second, how can you even claim to get the point when you keep repeating the same sillyness over and over?
READ IT ONE MORE TIME
I DONT GIVE #$#@ if a dev decides to create a game for a specific platform as long as they dont tell me it is because my gear is not able to handle the processing needed when it is a big fat lie.
It has been proven over and over again with all those so called TEGRA only games.
Do you see me saying the same thing about Xperia games here? No because that is clearly a business thing, they are not telling us some BS about our devices not being able to handle the game like the BS we are getting from the Tegra only devs.
Seriously, if you need more help understanding this oh so clear point I will try my best to get to see if they can do a Blues Clues episode about it or maybe Barney.
I am out, keep enjoying your game and upgrading when there is no reasons to do so just because a company wants to shove a product up our asses...me, I know better than to take it.
I upgrade video cards very often when a game needs more power to run...I am very familiar with the process (being here since the C64 days boy) but I do not upgrade gear when my gear is perfectly fine running the game in the market.
If the devs tells us straight, it is a Tegra exclusive deal then good for them but dont give me the Tegra is the only powerful enough platform BS ..nobody (except you that is) is buying that one.
Regards

 

[xtracrispy69]

mark this one...tegra will be the way it all goes....lets see anything go up against kal-el. If shadowgun pans out, it'll change mobile gaming in a way that infinity blade did for ios. As for tech goes, upgrades in mobile devices are a yearly adventure. It'll get even worse with gaming rearing its head. Better get those food stamps ready, sounds like the way things are going for you, you'll be due for an upgrade.....now

 

[shaolin95]

mark this one...tegra will be the way it all goes....lets see anything go up against kal-el. If shadowgun pans out, it'll change mobile gaming in a way that infinity blade did for ios. As for tech goes, upgrades in mobile devices are a yearly adventure. It'll get even worse with gaming rearing its head. Better get those food stamps ready, sounds like the way things are going for you, you'll be due for an upgrade.....now

It might very well be the future of mobile gaming but right now its product is just not any better than what we have that is the point. We shall see in the future.
Oh and I have a very nice job and do good money so first you though I was a teen and now you are treating me like I am some poor hungry man. You got some issues boy..grow up. When the arguments run out on you , then you decide to go the cheap way of attacking me personally? Thats lame but let me lower myself to your level for this one...I dont need food stamps, I got enough money to leave the way I like, not super rich but good enough for my family and I. BUT I dont like people trying to rip me off or making me spend money when I have a product that is on the same level as the want they want to shove up my ass with BS tactics....but since it seems you are all for that, I got a nice Vaseline jar I can send you free of charge if you want it.
Because you have no valid arguments but I KNOW you want to have the last word, meaningless as it will be, go ahead, you get to say the last one and let me declare you the winner...we are ALL wrong, you and only you "get" it....

 

[xtracrispy69]

sorry just finished another round of this smash hit on my tegra device....oh and there's no "we are all wrong", just you...most people were intelligent enough not to d/l the tegra store on a non-tegra device and whine...most people who use chainfire accept it's flaws but won't spend the time making the dev change their whole game for YOU! I'll see you in shadowgun...or maybe not....

 

[Vanquished]

sorry just finished another round of this smash hit on my tegra device....oh and there's no "we are all wrong", just you...most people were intelligent enough not to d/l the tegra store on a non-tegra device and whine...most people who use chainfire accept it's flaws but won't spend the time making the dev change their whole game for YOU! I'll see you in shadowgun...or maybe not....

Chainfire 3D acts as a driver, so there isn't really much that needs to be changed with the actual code of the game, they just need to use a different method for a physics engine.

There are games that only high end devices can handle, but it is in the developers best interest to support as many devices as possible, not one or two that have one chipset. This isn't the best example, but lets take a look at the iPhone. 95% of the games that work on the 4 work on the 3GS. 90% of the games that work on the 4 work on the 3G. You don't see that same support on Android (granted, fragmentation gets credit for part of this).

The current dual core A5 PowerVR543 chip blows Tegra 2 out of the water, I'm pretty sure the next PowerVR chip will compete with Nvidia's Quad Core. Qualcomm and TI also have things in the works, all of which will equal or suceed Kal-el's power. If developers continue to make apps for specific chips they are hurting themselves more than the consumer.

With that said, this topic seems to be derailing with you two bickering.

I would like to hear back from PlayBox to see what they say about my initial comments (particularly in regards to Reckless Racing but support for other dual-core phones as well).

 

[bluenova]

Guys, play nicely please. Attack the issue not each other.

 

[Quboid]

I shall (try to) be nice and avoid any attacks. The issue I have isn't that the devs choose to make it a Tegra 2 exclusive. The issue I have is that the devs are effectively lying to us. I don't mean this dev specifically, but this is the general response when a Tegra exclusive is questioned.

If they released their Tegra 2 game and said "it's Tegra only because it's quicker to develop for just Tegra and Nvidia are more than making up the money from lost sales" then fine, my non-Tegra device isn't going to run it and that's basically that. It's shame I won't get to play their game and I don't like the fragmentation that it causes, but that's life.

However, they are saying "it's Tegra only because other SoC's don't have the horse power". This is demonstrably false. Their implementation (specifically PhysX) needs a Tegra SoC but games like Reckless Racing show that just as good a physics engine* could be implemented and run well on a wide range of Android devices.

I'm not annoyed out of some misguided sense of entitlement, that I should be able to run any Android software just because my phone has about the highest performance. I'm annoyed that these developers are dishonest about their motives.

* I don't know the physics engine's detail obviously, but Reckless Racing ran well on my 1Ghz Desire and I'd eat my hat if Bang Bang Racing had a physics simulation so much more advanced that a dual core 1.2Ghz phone couldn't handle a proper CPU implementation of it.

 

[shaolin95]

Well put!