Confirmed: Angry Birds for Android

[andy-roid]

not yet every bodys waiting

 

[F150FAN]

It shouldn't be much longer. They have stated that it is done with the exception of getting the screen size options and everything working in one package and then on the Android Market! At least that is how I envision it!

 

[jonmorris]

PopCap said they were working on Android versions of games like Chuzzle and PvZ when I asked them at the end of 2009, soon after our magazine had awarded the HTC Hero the phone of the year.

So, I do wonder why it has taken so long - but accept there could be any number of reasons. Maybe they hired a load of programmers who didn't have a clue what they were doing and set the projects back months.

Ditto with the company making Angry Birds.

I am happy for them to admit to problems and say they wanted to make sure the games were perfect, as against the many apps and games that seem to be updated almost daily to fix bugs and the new bugs created by fixing old ones. Sometimes I do think that this will be the undoing of Android if they're not careful - you don't get anywhere near as many fixes/updates on iOS. You still get a lot, but not as many.

In two days, I've had EIGHT updates for my Milestone and about SIX for my X10 mini pro. Even when you get the 'update all' on 2.2, it's still not on - especially when a new update may have more problems and quickly get another release.

 

[sequre]

I've been waiting for this for months and have been growing extremely impatient with this one. It was rumored to be released August. It's the 26th. We'll see.

 

[F150FAN]

I've been waiting for this for months and have been growing extremely impatient with this one. It was rumored to be released August. It's the 26th. We'll see.

Like I posted earlier Rovio claims on their Twitter account that they are "working hard on getting it done, have it running on all devices, but some work on how we bring it all together." They have also said this about the Android version "don't worry, working hard on getting Android out too", and "we haven't announced exact date, but we are getting really close." This should spell a release very soon. I am really excited for this as I am sure the rest of you are. Everyone keep your fingers crossed!

 

[tmaxey1]

Seriously? Do you have the slightest idea of how any of this works?

Don't stress Rovio...you guys lost one customer here for ignorance. You still have me and probably at least another 500,000 others

Do I have the slightest idea how any of this works? Why yes I do. I am a businessman who knows how business works. It is not the concern of mine or the problem of mine to care about the internal issues of Rovio. I am a consumer and they are a manufacturer. They choose to manufacture video games and i choose to consume them. As a consumer it is not necessary for me to apologize to a company for their struggles to produce a product for me to consume.

Since you are the one who feels they have such a grasp of how this works why dont you educate us on this process. Educate us on how the development of an android game works. Explain to us how long it should take to develop a game from the ground up even on android.

Why you are at it please tell us what you know about Rovio. How many employees do they have? Offices? Software developers? Financial resources? Ect.

You want to call a person that believes this company should have the ability to put an android game out in an amount of time I consider reasonable "ignorant" without knowing anything about what it is I actually know.

Explain the difficulties in developing a game for Android vs. IOS and Symbian? Explain why numerous games have been put out on these other platforms while android is still just so difficult they cant seem to figure out this puzzle. And explain why so many other smaller developers have managed to port their apps and games to android since Rovio started talking about developing for android.

I am waiting Genius. Or shy away from the challenge as I am sure you will.
You will either ignore these questions or you will attempt a comeback that will just show who the "ignorant" one really is.

 

[Jedii]

Do I have the slightest idea how any of this works? Why yes I do. I am a businessman who knows how business works. It is not the concern of mine or the problem of mine to care about the internal issues of Rovio. I am a consumer and they are a manufacturer. They choose to manufacture video games and i choose to consume them. As a consumer it is not necessary for me to apologize to a company for their struggles to produce a product for me to consume.

Since you are the one who feels they have such a grasp of how this works why dont you educate us on this process. Educate us on how the development of an android game works. Explain to us how long it should take to develop a game from the ground up even on android.

Why you are at it please tell us what you know about Rovio. How many employees do they have? Offices? Software developers? Financial resources? Ect.

You want to call a person that believes this company should have the ability to put an android game out in an amount of time I consider reasonable "ignorant" without knowing anything about what it is I actually know.

Explain the difficulties in developing a game for Android vs. IOS and Symbian? Explain why numerous games have been put out on these other platforms while android is still just so difficult they cant seem to figure out this puzzle. And explain why so many other smaller developers have managed to port their apps and games to android since Rovio started talking about developing for android.

I am waiting Genius. Or shy away from the challenge as I am sure you will.
You will either ignore these questions or you will attempt a comeback that will just show who the "ignorant" one really is.

Well now. Aren't we friendly.

A few things here:

First, i used the term ignorance b/c as a consumer i myself have patience. I do not choose to set a specific "time frame" before i give up on purchasing an item. Especially in this constantly changing industry.

Now, to address my knowledge on the company Rovio itself, i will not pretend to have extensive knowledge other than what their official site provides. Rovio - Company

Assuming you are a developer (i would hope with your somewhat challenging remarks) you can understand the HUGE difference in iOS and Android. The largest being the many many differences on the Android platform. First the hardware: Screen size, resolution, memory, etc. More importantly the line of software versions: 1.5, 1.6, 2.0, 2.0.1, 2.1, 2.1 update 1, 2.2. Now being the developer you are, you can appreciate the difficulty to be able to port the application over each of these so when it is released on the market, people will not freak out because their particular device is not capable.

I was calling your decision as a consumer ignorant. Not you as a person.

This thread was created for those of us who are excited about the port over (no matter how long it takes). Then people like you get on here and rant about your personal "window of opportunity" that has closed.

And as far as a "businessman" I would look at it one simple way. Profit. They are well aware of the growing Android community and I am sure they are doing their absolute best of making this happen for the growth of their company. I guess it is a good thing that most of us do not give up on something so quickly.

One final note: You asked if I could educate you on how to develop a game on Android. And how long it could take to develop even from the "ground" up. Well, every game would be from the ground up. Sure, some may have the general layout already complete, but the code writing is completely different. You could use something as App Inventor and have a game up and running in less than an hour (it would not be a good game in the least). Or you could fully write one in the proper time that it takes (1 week to 6 months for that matter). It all depends on how many people you have on the project, how many hours they are putting into it, which software version variations they are making it compatible for and such.

This could go on for hours. I normally would not post back a "battle" with you, but I feel you took my post as a jab towards you. For that, i do apologize. But I do think this thread and those posting are simply excited about Angry Birds and are awaiting its arrival.

 

[BigCiX]

This is one game I'll pay a buck or two for

 

[rsarno]

Do I have the slightest idea how any of this works? Why yes I do. I am a businessman who knows how business works. It is not the concern of mine or the problem of mine to care about the internal issues of Rovio. I am a consumer and they are a manufacturer. They choose to manufacture video games and i choose to consume them. As a consumer it is not necessary for me to apologize to a company for their struggles to produce a product for me to consume.

Since you are the one who feels they have such a grasp of how this works why dont you educate us on this process. Educate us on how the development of an android game works. Explain to us how long it should take to develop a game from the ground up even on android.

Why you are at it please tell us what you know about Rovio. How many employees do they have? Offices? Software developers? Financial resources? Ect.

You want to call a person that believes this company should have the ability to put an android game out in an amount of time I consider reasonable "ignorant" without knowing anything about what it is I actually know.

Explain the difficulties in developing a game for Android vs. IOS and Symbian? Explain why numerous games have been put out on these other platforms while android is still just so difficult they cant seem to figure out this puzzle. And explain why so many other smaller developers have managed to port their apps and games to android since Rovio started talking about developing for android.

I am waiting Genius. Or shy away from the challenge as I am sure you will.
You will either ignore these questions or you will attempt a comeback that will just show who the "ignorant" one really is.

Wow i read only the first few paragraphs, and i am quite confident that on quite a few occasions you have had your ice cream shit in, or soda pissed in at restaurants lol

enjoy, bet your a real thrill to go out with haha

 

[Jedii]

Wow i read only the first few paragraphs, and i am quite confident that on quite a few occasions you have had your ice cream shit in, or soda pissed in at restaurants lol

enjoy, bet your a real thrill to go out with haha

LOL. Dont ever make me laugh that hard again! I almost choked!

 

[johnlgalt]

Unfortunately I don't think that profitability is guaranteed in android market, there is many problem that developer faces in Android market that isn't in the iPhone market.

1. Piracy, let face it this is a big problem for Android right now, hard to sell premium games for $9+ when people can pirate it.
2. Too many different spec for hardware/system, 4+ screen resolution with 10+ chipsets, 3+ RAM configurations, 6+ hard drive config, 2 keyboard config and 4 active OS. It is a logistical nightmare. (even pc games has less configuration permutations).
3. Market size, iPhone has much bigger audience, and more International markets, not to mention that fact that some carrier like ATT block the Android market.
4. Lack of promotional sites like toucharcade for Android. And also weak search and promotional support in the app market.
5. People trust apple app market more then people trust android market. While everyone dislike the wall garden approach apple is taking, how many times did we ask ourself, why does a game or a simple app need access to my contact info, ability to make calls and network access? But even most android fans would agree that they don't have the same worry (at least not to the same degree) when they buy an itune app.

So lets face it, Google need to step up before android platform can attract more game developers.

Good points all. Of course, we also have one more thing to realize that no one here wants to admit:

You don't need to know as much (or I should say as many) languages to code for other mobile OSs as you do for Android. See my next post for details.

While I agree with pretty much everything that you have said I will say that #5 can be a little misleading. The I have understood it, and I could be wrong, is that these apps are looking at these things for a few reasons. First, they may be a poorly designed app, nothing harmful to your device or information, just not designed correctly. Next, I was once told that an app may look at things like the ability to make calls in case you have an incoming call and while the app may be pushed to the background it will save the current state while it is exited. These are just some of the reasons that I have heard, correct me if I am wrong, please, as to why one will see these things when downloading an app. Otherwise I really think that you hit the nail on the head. Apple just has two main hardware platforms and that's it. There are a lot of different hardware makeups for Android which will make it a little more difficult for app designers. I have to say though, I am not giving my DX up for anything! Android is the way to go!

Your analysis is spot on - however, the next reply is what makes it a problem, as you already acknowledged in *your* reply to it....

Like you I love my evo. But I also realize it is a uphill battle for google to over take apple in the app market. As it stands, even if iOS and android market share is the same, aplle still have huge advantage due to the simpler platform and more international markets.

As for #5, I am not sure it is misleading, I think it is an issue with how permission work on android. Let say I am a malicious developer, and want to steal your contact info, or have your phone call a pay per minute phone line that I own. If I release a pretty decent free game to the market to disguise the malware, there is no way you can tell the difference between the malware, and a normal game that just want to implement save state correctly during a phone call. I think this is the main problem with app permission in android OS, even a power user like you and me can't easily tell the difference. So I don't think #5 is misleading at all, I think google need to bring out a more fine grain permission model on their next os, or else one day soon, the android os will require the use of AV softwares, just like windows. Unfortunatly, it pains me to say this, but this is a area in which the wall garden approach might be needed.

A good point - at some point, though, there is going to have to be a basis of trust that the end user is going to have to place in the product and the development team behind the product.

I a brand new app, followed by a lot of hype, asks for a ton of permissions to use, and it is from a dev I have never heard of, well, I am going to be a little more than distrustful.

however, if same said app is from an established company like Rovio (or Adobe, or any other large company excluding Sony) then I am going to feel a little more warm and fuzzy in dealing with said app.

1. Agreed. Plus devs don't need to jack up the price on some apps (I'm looking at you, Doodle Jump) versus their price on the iPhone.
2. This is also a problem that needs to be addressed by Google.
3. AT&T doesn't block the Android Market, they merely block installing apps from outside sources.
4. That's a fault of the Market. Google really needs to fix this, I agree.
5. The more people use Android phones, the more they'll trust the Android Market. Don't think that Apple's apps don't access all of those things. They just don't tell you that because you don't "need to know".

That last point is a good one - as more people use it (and as more apps are developed - we recently passed 100K, IIRC) more people will hear about it and more people will start to trust.

There are exceptions - I will never run any sort of AV on my phone - WTF is the point? IDGAF if 250K people have downloaded it - *I* won't.

But I am the exception to the rule, not the typical end-user of an Android phone, so....

From what I have gathered they are putting a lot of effort into their version of Angry Birds for Android. From their Twitter account it looks as though there was a learning curve for them and they are trying to integrate the different screen sizes into the app before releasing it to the Android Market. They have stated that the port of Angry Birds is complete but they are just working out a couple of kinks. I expect it to go live in the next couple of weeks at the most. I would rather they take their time to make sure that it is well polished than rush it out. That could just be me though.

Wouldn't be a bad idea to link the twitter account here in this thread so folks don't have to load Rovio's web page to find it - so here it is:

Angry Birds (RovioMobile) on Twitter

Seriously? Do you have the slightest idea of how any of this works?

Don't stress Rovio...you guys lost one customer here for ignorance. You still have me and probably at least another 500,000 others

Trust me - they know they make great products - otherwise they would have folded their business a long time ago.

 

[johnlgalt]

Do I have the slightest idea how any of this works? Why yes I do. I am a businessman who knows how business works. It is not the concern of mine or the problem of mine to care about the internal issues of Rovio. I am a consumer and they are a manufacturer. They choose to manufacture video games and i choose to consume them. As a consumer it is not necessary for me to apologize to a company for their struggles to produce a product for me to consume.

Since you are the one who feels they have such a grasp of how this works why dont you educate us on this process. Educate us on how the development of an android game works. Explain to us how long it should take to develop a game from the ground up even on android.

Why you are at it please tell us what you know about Rovio. How many employees do they have? Offices? Software developers? Financial resources? Ect.

You want to call a person that believes this company should have the ability to put an android game out in an amount of time I consider reasonable "ignorant" without knowing anything about what it is I actually know.

Explain the difficulties in developing a game for Android vs. IOS and Symbian? Explain why numerous games have been put out on these other platforms while android is still just so difficult they cant seem to figure out this puzzle. And explain why so many other smaller developers have managed to port their apps and games to android since Rovio started talking about developing for android.

I am waiting Genius. Or shy away from the challenge as I am sure you will.
You will either ignore these questions or you will attempt a comeback that will just show who the "ignorant" one really is.

Hold on there sparky. You're telling me that just because you're a businessman that you know everything about every form of business out there?

Horsecaca. All businesses do not run the same - and neither is there a single business model that covers all businesses.

If the internal workings of a particular business are not your concern, then you must not care about what your own customers think about your internal business problems. That is just fine - and it is great that that is the business model that you choose.

However, let's get a few things pretty straight before be go much further, shall we?

From the iOS wiki @ iOS (Apple) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The SDK was released on March 6, 2008, and allows developers to make applications for the iPhone and iPod Touch, as well as test them in an "iPhone simulator". However, loading an application onto the devices is only possible after paying an iPhone Developer Program fee. Since the release of Xcode 3.1, Xcode is the development environment for the iPhone SDK. iPhone applications, like iOS and Mac OS X, are written in Objective-C.[24]

Now, from the Object-C wiki @ Objective-C - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Objective-C is a reflective, object-oriented programming language which adds Smalltalk-style messaging to the C programming language.

Today, it is used primarily on Apple's Mac OS X and iOS: two environments based on the OpenStep standard, though not compliant with it.[2] Objective-C is the primary language used for Apple's Cocoa API, and it was originally the main language on NeXT's NeXTSTEP OS. Generic Objective-C programs which do not utilize these libraries can also be compiled for any system supported by gcc or Clang.

OK, so that covers iOS/ Objective-C, which is based upon regular old C, which has been around for, let's see - damned near 40 years. C (programming language) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Now, let's look at Symbian, from the wiki @ Symbian OS - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (the original Symbian) as well as Symbian platform - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia - the current Symbian on Nokia phones.

Symbian OS is one of Nokia's mobile operating systems for mobile devices and smartphones, with associated libraries, user interface, frameworks and reference implementations of common tools, originally developed by Symbian Ltd.[3] It was a descendant of Psion's EPOC and runs exclusively on ARM processors, although an unreleased x86 port existed.

The Symbian platform is an open source operating system (OS) and software platform designed for smartphones and maintained by the Symbian Foundation. The Symbian platform is the successor to Symbian OS. The Symbian platform was officially made available as open source code in February 2010.[3]

Ok, so let's look at the history of it: Symbian OS - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Psion

In 1980, Psion was founded by David Potter.

Hmm, so 30 plus years of development from its original form.

There is more there you can read it as I have linked you to it.

But this is really gonna bake yer noodle: Development on Symbian: Symbian OS - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

As of 2010, the SDK for Symbian is standard C++, using Qt. It can be used with either Qt Creator, or Carbide (the older IDE previously used for Symbian development).[18][19] A phone simulator allows testing of Qt apps. Apps compiled for the simulator are compiled to native code for the development platform, rather than having to be emulated.[20]

C++ using Qt - hmmm - let's see about this one: C++ - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

C++ (pronounced see plus plus) is a statically typed, free-form, multi-paradigm, compiled, general-purpose programming language. It is regarded as a "middle-level" language, as it comprises a combination of both high-level and low-level language features.[2] It was developed by Bjarne Stroustrup starting in 1979 at Bell Labs as an enhancement to the C programming language and originally named C with Classes. It was renamed C++ in 1983.[3]

Again, 30 years of development.

Finally, let's look at Android from Android (operating system) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Android is primarily a mobile operating system for an increasing long list of Android devices such as cellular phones, tablet computers and netbooks. Android is developed by Google and is based upon the Linux kernel and GNU software. It was initially developed by Android Inc. (a firm later purchased by Google) and lately broadened to the Open Handset Alliance.[4] According to NPD Group, unit sales for Android OS smartphones ranked first among all smartphone OS handsets sold in the U.S. in the second quarter of 2010, at 33%.[5][6] BlackBerry OS is second at 28%, and iOS is ranked third with 22%.[7]

Yeah, yeah, we all know and love this stuff. But really, let's go deeper.

The Android operating system software stack consists of Java applications running on a Java based object oriented application framework on top of Java core libraries running on a Dalvik virtual machine featuring JIT compilation. Libraries written in C include the surface manager, OpenCore[14] media framework, SQLite relational database management system, OpenGL ES 2.0 3D graphics API, WebKit layout engine, SGL graphics engine, SSL, and Bionic libc. The Android operating system consists of 12 million lines of code including 3 million lines of XML, 2.8 million lines of C, 2.1 million lines of Java, and 1.75 million lines of C++.[15]

Now it gets fun. First, let's have a small history lesson: Android (operating system) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Acquisition by Google

In July 2005, Google acquired Android, Inc., a small startup company based in Palo Alto, California, USA.[16] Android's co-founders who went to work at Google included Andy Rubin (co-founder of Danger),[17] Rich Miner (co-founder of Wildfire Communications, Inc.),[18] Nick Sears (once VP at T-Mobile),[19] and Chris White (headed design and interface development at WebTV).[20] At the time, little was known about the functions of Android, Inc. other than that they made software for mobile phones.[16] This began rumors that Google was planning to enter the mobile phone market.

Now we get to the really good stuff. In addition to the second quotation I made from the Android Wiki, let's look at this: Android (operating system) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Software development
Early Android device.

The early feedback on developing applications for the Android platform was mixed.[69] Issues cited include bugs, lack of documentation, inadequate QA infrastructure, and no public issue-tracking system. (Google announced an issue tracker on 18 January 2008.)[70] In December 2007, MergeLab mobile startup founder Adam MacBeth stated, "Functionality is not there, is poorly documented or just doesn't work... It's clearly not ready for prime time."[71] Despite this, Android-targeted applications began to appear the week after the platform was announced. The first publicly available application was the Snake game.[72][73] The Android Dev Phone is a SIM-unlocked and hardware-unlocked device that is designed for advanced developers. While developers can use regular consumer devices purchased at retail to test and use their applications, some developers may choose not to use a retail device, preferring an unlocked or no-contract device.

But it gets better....

Software development kit

The Android SDK includes a comprehensive set of development tools.[74] These include a debugger, libraries, a handset emulator (based on QEMU), documentation, sample code, and tutorials. Currently supported development platforms include x86-architecture computers running Linux (any modern desktop Linux distribution), Mac OS X 10.4.8 or later, Windows XP or Vista. Requirements also include Java Development Kit, Apache Ant, and Python 2.2 or later. The officially supported integrated development environment (IDE) is Eclipse (3.2 or later) using the Android Development Tools (ADT) Plugin, though developers may use any text editor to edit Java and XML files then use command line tools to create, build and debug Android applications as well as control attached Android devices (e.g., triggering a reboot, installing software package(s) remotely).[75]

OK, so iOS is Objective-C. Symbian is C++ using Qt (although other environs can also be used b/c, well, C++ is nice like that.

Android requires knowledge of C, C++ (which are not all that different) but also JAVA, XML, Python, and a whole slew of other languages and / or technologies.

Does it make even a small bit of sense now that it is intensely harder to code for Android than it is to code for iOS and Symbian?

You be the judge....and while you're judging, be sure to ask any Android developer who has developed for other platforms what the learning curve was.....

 

[johnlgalt]

Well now. Aren't we friendly.

A few things here:

First, i used the term ignorance b/c as a consumer i myself have patience. I do not choose to set a specific "time frame" before i give up on purchasing an item. Especially in this constantly changing industry.

Now, to address my knowledge on the company Rovio itself, i will not pretend to have extensive knowledge other than what their official site provides. Rovio - Company

Assuming you are a developer (i would hope with your somewhat challenging remarks) you can understand the HUGE difference in iOS and Android. The largest being the many many differences on the Android platform. First the hardware: Screen size, resolution, memory, etc. More importantly the line of software versions: 1.5, 1.6, 2.0, 2.0.1, 2.1, 2.1 update 1, 2.2. Now being the developer you are, you can appreciate the difficulty to be able to port the application over each of these so when it is released on the market, people will not freak out because their particular device is not capable.

I was calling your decision as a consumer ignorant. Not you as a person.

This thread was created for those of us who are excited about the port over (no matter how long it takes). Then people like you get on here and rant about your personal "window of opportunity" that has closed.

And as far as a "businessman" I would look at it one simple way. Profit. They are well aware of the growing Android community and I am sure they are doing their absolute best of making this happen for the growth of their company. I guess it is a good thing that most of us do not give up on something so quickly.

One final note: You asked if I could educate you on how to develop a game on Android. And how long it could take to develop even from the "ground" up. Well, every game would be from the ground up. Sure, some may have the general layout already complete, but the code writing is completely different. You could use something as App Inventor and have a game up and running in less than an hour (it would not be a good game in the least). Or you could fully write one in the proper time that it takes (1 week to 6 months for that matter). It all depends on how many people you have on the project, how many hours they are putting into it, which software version variations they are making it compatible for and such.

This could go on for hours. I normally would not post back a "battle" with you, but I feel you took my post as a jab towards you. For that, i do apologize. But I do think this thread and those posting are simply excited about Angry Birds and are awaiting its arrival.

OK, so I am pretty sure I have firmly and unequivocally addressed the differences in iOS an Android and Symbian, and the learning curve and mind-numbing knowledge required to develop for it.

And I would like to add this (in reply to others, not Jedii above) - as someone else mentioned, I'd rather have a damned fine working piece of software than one that gets updated every other day. Or hour. Or minute. I'll sit here and be patient like the others waiting for products from Rovio, just like I am sitting here waiting for Diablo III from Blizzard b/c I am still addicted to playing Diablo II.

I trust that all subsequent questions will be related here. Let's at least keep it civil.

You wanna bitch, please go somewhere else - it's simply not tolerated.

 

[rsarno]

 

[F150FAN]

@johnlgalt

Wow man. I knew that it was more involved when coding for Android but damn! I am speechless! Regardless of what anyone else says, I definitely learned something tonight. That was awesome. I also completely agree with you on waiting for a polished app rather than one that only works 1/4 of the time, forces closed too much, etc. Rovio makes a great product hands down. They are definitely some talented people. I am more than willing to sit it out for a great game, especially Angry Birds! They also update it with more levels frequently which is great to see! They care about their customers and fans. I was actually very happy to see WebOS get their own version. I am glad they are crossing platforms and pushing out a great product to such a variety of operating systems. Very well said sir, very well said!

 

[tmaxey1]

OK, so I am pretty sure I have firmly and unequivocally addressed the differences in iOS an Android and Symbian, and the learning curve and mind-numbing knowledge required to develop for it.

And I would like to add this (in reply to others, not Jedii above) - as someone else mentioned, I'd rather have a damned fine working piece of software than one that gets updated every other day. Or hour. Or minute. I'll sit here and be patient like the others waiting for products from Rovio, just like I am sitting here waiting for Diablo III from Blizzard b/c I am still addicted to playing Diablo II.

I trust that all subsequent questions will be related here. Let's at least keep it civil.

You wanna bitch, please go somewhere else - it's simply not tolerated.

Wow! You really enjoy copying and pasting on message boards. Its not as complicated as you want to make it seem. This "learning curve and mind numbing knowledge" that you claim is needed to develop for Android seems to be a problem that is much more difficult for Rovio to overcome than it is for many other mobile developers..hmmm.

You can attempt to copy and paste your way into convincing yourself that Android is an impossible mission for a company to develop for. However, its much more difficult to copy and past your way into answering the simple question of why other "lesser" developers have not had this much difficulty.

The answer is one that you would rather talk around than actually accept. Rovio has not put the Android platform on its list of priorities up to this point. It isnt about ability. Its about desire. They are not being asked to solve an impossible math equation where a team of the worlds most gifted mathematicians need to spend months or years locked into a think tank trying to solve. If they wanted to they would have had this game out months ago.

As far as bitching and it not being tolerated..... 1st I was unaware that having an opinion or viewpoint different than the one you choose to express is considered "bitching", 2nd I was also unaware that you are the authority on what is tolerated and what is not tolerated here on Android Forums. It seems that you have become quiet impressed with yourself and this has caused you a sense of empowerment not truly earned.

Bottom line... Android isnt that difficult to develop for. So many mobile companies has shown this already. Rovio is making a business decision to allocate their resources toward other projects. It is their business and they have the right to make this decision. As a consumer I speak with my wallet. I have that right. And I will exercise this right. Sorry this doesnt jive with your Angry Birds anticipation love fest you want the thread to be. If you dont like hearing other peoples views or opinions then simply dont read their post. Or you could always copy and paste wiki pages and convince yourself your thoughts are somehow more valid and legit than they are. I'm assuming this is the direction you will take.

 

[rsarno]

I think i can act on behalf of Rovio and many others here, and hand you a big cup of STFU mixed with a bit of GTFO.

Enough with the consumer nonsense. I actually work for a mobile development company and actually agree with you on some points, but you come across like an a-hole, TBH.

Sorry if that comes across as insulting, im not meaning to be. We are all here to discuss, and enjoy the discussions. Im just throwing my 2cents in.

 

[mjblaurock]

With the exception of tmaxey1, your all idiots. This was a simple thread discussing angry birds. Tmaxey was only expressing his opinion which he is entitled to and you guys turned this thread in to the ugly mess it now is. I don't necessarily agree with him, but its a discussion board and he was only sharing his thoughts. Why pick apart what someone has written? If you dont like it, then skip over it and post something useful. The main reason I spend most of my time reading discussions and not posting on them is because of stupid people! Which seem to have hijacked this thread!!! Get a freakin life!!!

 

[Nodders]

johnlgalt - yes all very clever, but you've missed the point really

Like all things software, Rovio's communications is utterly pants. Think it will come out in August? Add a month or two to be on the safe side and tell people. Don't dangle "maybe August", "soons" etc in front of people. It isn't helpful, is unprofessional, and damages expectations as with the chap you are debating with. Not that Rovio are alone (in fact this is fairly mild I would argue - I'm not in the slightest bit angry or annoyed, but they are exhibiting the same tiresome old limitations), most of the industry is the same (look at HTC and the 2.1 upgrade for Hero for an extreme example).

Is coding difficult? Sometimes yes. Should a professional company be able to manage a piss-up in a brewery? I would hope so. The key is communications, not the technical irrelevances you were highlighting that they can plan around.

 

[Dirtball]

*Sits back with the popcorn and enjoys the show*

 

[dguy]

Wow! You really enjoy copying and pasting on message boards. Its not as complicated as you want to make it seem. This "learning curve and mind numbing knowledge" that you claim is needed to develop for Android seems to be a problem that is much more difficult for Rovio to overcome than it is for many other mobile developers..hmmm.

You can attempt to copy and paste your way into convincing yourself that Android is an impossible mission for a company to develop for. However, its much more difficult to copy and past your way into answering the simple question of why other "lesser" developers have not had this much difficulty.

The answer is one that you would rather talk around than actually accept. Rovio has not put the Android platform on its list of priorities up to this point. It isnt about ability. Its about desire. They are not being asked to solve an impossible math equation where a team of the worlds most gifted mathematicians need to spend months or years locked into a think tank trying to solve. If they wanted to they would have had this game out months ago.

As far as bitching and it not being tolerated..... 1st I was unaware that having an opinion or viewpoint different than the one you choose to express is considered "bitching", 2nd I was also unaware that you are the authority on what is tolerated and what is not tolerated here on Android Forums. It seems that you have become quiet impressed with yourself and this has caused you a sense of empowerment not truly earned.

Bottom line... Android isnt that difficult to develop for. So many mobile companies has shown this already. Rovio is making a business decision to allocate their resources toward other projects. It is their business and they have the right to make this decision. As a consumer I speak with my wallet. I have that right. And I will exercise this right. Sorry this doesnt jive with your Angry Birds anticipation love fest you want the thread to be. If you dont like hearing other peoples views or opinions then simply dont read their post. Or you could always copy and paste wiki pages and convince yourself your thoughts are somehow more valid and legit than they are. I'm assuming this is the direction you will take.

You really don't have the slightest clue what you're talking about. Why do you insist on burying yourself further? Should have called it quits quite a few posts ago.

 

[tmaxey1]

You really don't have the slightest clue what you're talking about. Why do you insist on burying yourself further? Should have called it quits quite a few posts ago.

It's much easier to say someone doesnt have a clue than it is to actually prove they dont have a clue.

Show me.

How many games has gameloft or polarbit now released for this "mind numbing" difficult to develop for android OS? How many has Rovio released for Android?

Please answer the question about why so many other developers have solved this puzzle yet Rovio hasnt?

It's easier to insult than actually debate with some intellect. This has been shown by a few people already on this thread. Are you glad you now put yourself in that same category?

To anyone who want to call me clueless Please just answer the simple question?

Why have so many other developers managed to develop for Android while Rovio has not yet figured this out?

We can all have our opinions on the answer. But my .02c on the answer has been stated before and i will state it again.
Rovio made a business decision to allocate company resources to other projects they deem more important. Most likely iOS projects. I am not saying this is wrong for them. Its their business decision. They have that right. Maybe they make so much more money on ios games they feel it helps their bottom line better than android does. It may be true. It may not. But if so many developers could port games already then Rovio could have also if they had the same desire to. I am amazed this original point has angered so many people on this thread.

 

[F150FAN]

With the exception of tmaxey1, your all idiots. This was a simple thread discussing angry birds. Tmaxey was only expressing his opinion which he is entitled to and you guys turned this thread in to the ugly mess it now is. I don't necessarily agree with him, but its a discussion board and he was only sharing his thoughts. Why pick apart what someone has written? If you dont like it, then skip over it and post something useful. The main reason I spend most of my time reading discussions and not posting on them is because of stupid people! Which seem to have hijacked this thread!!! Get a freakin life!!!

Throughout this thread I have been trying to helpful by relaying info that I have gathered from Rovio's Twitter account in regards to the Angry Birds release. I have been following that everyday with hopes to hear that it will be released soon and wanted to join in the conversation. I have not called anyone our for their opinion but I don't think that anyone else really did either. There was a misunderstanding on a post, which I could have taken wrong as well. I honestly don't agree with tmaxey1 at all, but I think that he could have explained himself a little better and not exploded like he did. As for expressing his opinion, he should. That is what this forum is all about. With Rovio not figuring out how to develop for Android, I think they have figured it out. Otherwise why would they be saying that it is practically done with the exception of tying a couple loose ends together and releasing it in the Android Market. Manufacturers will give estimated dates for the release of products. It happens all the time, but when they miss their "estimated" date of release sometimes people become so irritated that they cannot have what they want when they want it is absurd. I believe that things happen. Products, especially software, can always hit snags and be delayed. That is a definite with software and I think that patience with these delays can go a long way. This shows to me that Rovio is committed to releasing a quality product to their standards, which is great. If I have offended anyone due to my posts then I apologize. At no point was I intentionally trying to do this, but I think that some have taken it too far. I have agreed with certain people and their views but nothing more than that. As it was stated earlier this was a thread about how people are excited about the release of Angry Birds. I hope that everyone can just relax a little and get this thread back on track, where people are excited about this release. Just my thoughts, for what it's worth.


PS -- I just saw this on Rovio's Twitter, @RovioMobile, someone asked if they would support Apps to SD and they said that that was the plan. This could also have been a late addition causing some of the delay. Just thought that I would share that.

 

[richg12524]

While I agree with pretty much everything that you have said I will say that #5 can be a little misleading. The I have understood it, and I could be wrong, is that these apps are looking at these things for a few reasons. First, they may be a poorly designed app, nothing harmful to your device or information, just not designed correctly. Next, I was once told that an app may look at things like the ability to make calls in case you have an incoming call and while the app may be pushed to the background it will save the current state while it is exited. These are just some of the reasons that I have heard, correct me if I am wrong, please, as to why one will see these things when downloading an app. Otherwise I really think that you hit the nail on the head. Apple just has two main hardware platforms and that's it. There are a lot of different hardware makeups for Android which will make it a little more difficult for app designers. I have to say though, I am not giving my DX up for anything! Android is the way to go!

Hey there f150fan, I was wondering where you have been hanging out. You moved to the X I see and I'm guessing you "really like it". You're still the voice of reason as well, I believe at the time you were the reason my droid still lives. Sorry for the off topic, back to the games. rich

 

[Xefan]

I found this thread from a Google search regarding Angry Birds, because I've been wondering what's happened to it too.

However, reading all the above I felt I'd correct some gross inaccuracies. Whilst I thought tamxey1's businessman comment and such was a little arrogant, those responding are wrong on so many things that I thought I'd at least clarify some of the more obvious ones related to my area of expertise.

I'm a lead software developer at an engineering firm, I develop in C# .NET currently, but have experience developing in C, C++, x86 assembly and Java professionally as well as experience with a bunch of other languages in my spare time. Importantly though, I have experience developing for both Android and iOS in my spare time.

Ultimately it is johnlgalt's post which I take objection to the most, he has cited many links from Wikipedia, but he has jumped and come to completely the wrong conclusions based on what he has read.

First up is the assertion that because Objective-C stems from C that C experience inherently means that C experience, of which there is 40 years of maps directly to it. This is patently false, it is a completely invalid conclusions. Whilst Objective-C does stem from C, it has undergone so many changes that it is quite different, fundamentally there is a paradigm shift in that Objective-C is an object oriented, rather than purely procedural language like C is. Importantly though, in terms of ease of migration between languages, Java is actually closer to C (and C++) syntactically than Objective-C is, ultimately they both use C style syntax with additions, but the shift in Objective-C's syntax for some tasks is a much bigger shift, and definitely so when compared to C++ which is much more common than C nowadays anyway. C++ is closer in concept to C in that it generally runs natively, both Objective-C and Java tend to make use of a VM.

Whilst Symbian has a 30 year history, it too has shifted a lot in that time. Further, a lot of Symbian phone app development was based on JavaME rather than with it's C API's because Symbian phones would in recent years (since phones became smart enough to run apps) nearly always provide a JavaME execution environment. Again though, even if apps were written mostly in C++ with Qt, C++ is still syntactically and conceptually (from a language rather than execution environment) point of view much closer to Java than Objective-C still.

Moving on to the next point about the technologies required to develop for Android, the fundamental mistake johnlgalt has made is that Android development requires (his word, not mine) knowledge of the technologies he listed. This is completely and utterly false, it does not require knowledge of these technologies, it merely provides support for them if you prefer to use them due to previous experience with them. You can develop for Android purely with knowledge of the Java language, you do not have to use Python, C, or C++ at all if you do not wish to. You will only want to use C/C++ if you decide to use the NDK for achieving extremely high performance but I'm not convinced something like Angry Birds for example would require this except perhaps for the oldest Android handsets around. Apache Ant is merely a tool for managing software builds and Eclipse is just a program that let's you develop your code- it's worth noting that iOS provides it's own development suite that you have to learn to use too, so this is nothing unusual, you don't write your code in notepad (unless you're bat-shit crazy), so development IDEs are actually a bonus as they make the task of development easier. XML is just a data format, and is trivial to understand, it's not a required language to learn, it's merely a data format you may choose to interact with as many web services provide data in this format (and so for example, iPhone and Symbian developers need to use them too to communicate with such services).

But fundamentally it's all academic anyway, the idea that Android is more difficult to develop for is a complete joke- anyone whose developed for Symbian will be chuckling to themselves at that comment, and iOS isn't exactly straightforward. Ironically the easiest environment to develop for is actually the one not mentioned here- Windows Mobile, existing versions and new versions, largely because Visual Studio is simply the best IDE on the market, but I digress. There is a more fundamental reason why developing for Android is not going to be difficult for most programmers, and that is the afformentioned fact that most Android apps can be written entirely with Java and nothing else - and here's the killer, Java is the single most used language in the world right now. Your 40 years of C's existence and so forth are irrelevant in the face of the fact that most universities and most business for the last 10 to 15 years have been teaching and using Java. More people simply know and use Java than any other language. Even aside from that though, there's the point that any program worth their pay should be language neutral anyway- experienced programmers will have knowledge of multiple languages using multiple paradigms (functional, procedural, object oriented) and jumping to a new language will be a pushover regardless.

The only difficulties in developing for Android stem from the various different capabilities of Android devices, but this is something Windows programmers, Symbian programmmers, and nowadays, with the changes to Apple's hardware over the last few years, even Apple devices all have to deal with. If you can't work round the concept of abstraction layers then you're not going to get far.

At the bottom of your post johnlgalt, you said:

You be the judge....and while you're judging, be sure to ask any Android developer who has developed for other platforms what the learning curve was.....

Well, you've got one here, and here's the answer- Android is probably the second easiest mobile platform to develop for on the market today after the upcoming Windows Phone 7, because it uses a language that is the most widely used in the world, it uses concepts and technologies that existing developers are familiar with (XML), it's well documented, and importantly- something you probably wont grasp without an understanding of programming, it has a really well designed underlying development framework, it doesn't have issues with private APIs which can get your app killed as with iOS either.

Now back on topic, I actually agree with the fundamental sentiment that people need to be patient and I sympathise with Rovio's challenge of porting a game built for Objective-C to a completely different environment- it's not easy still even then. As to the real reason for the delay that's anyone's guess, only Rovio themselves know, but it's worth keeping in mind that there is still simply more money for them in increasing their product offerings on the iPhone right now, so Android will be less of a priority because from their point of view, thus far, Android is a lower profit platform (however personally I expect that to change drastically in the years to come).

Or to sum it up for those that can't be bothered to read the whole thing, johnlgalt is completely and utterly wrong, Android is not difficult to develop for and you do not need to learn multiple languages, but also tamxey1 is also wrong to infer that Rovio are incompetent, they're almost certainly not. Even if Android isn't a bad environment to develop for, software development is still damn hard in general and even nowadays there is a lack of real good methods to predict the amount of time it'll take to develop something because every bit of code you write is (or should be) new, and different. People here need to learn some important lessons- citing Wikipedia does not make false conclusions true, and being impatient wont make things come faster. Don't argue about things you simply don't understand, and don't complain if you don't get what you want right away.