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Yeahha said:
You don't have to root to flash roms on any phone really...rooting is having superuser access within the OS...superuser doesn't have anything to do with flashing roms but in reality they two tend to go hand in hand...
Click to expand...

Yes, that is what I meant, many phones you need root access in order to get the recovery on there. I didn't on the Triumph.
 
lol . Nope .
Superuser.apk and SuperSU.apk are just Root Management apps.

the Su binary or sudo binary is the main stuff .
having either of those in /system means you are rooted .

Rogue apps will run havoc if Root management apps are not present :eek:

Each binary may have it's own quirks .

:p
 
agentc13 said:
Yes, that is what I meant, many phones you need root access in order to get the recovery on there. I didn't on the Triumph.
Click to expand...

I think most phones you can flash a custom recovery without root access...it is just easier in many cases with root access or easier for the casual user thanks to the awesome devs we have.

Unrelated not I really like the new dark blue skin for tapatalk they made it fit ICS beautifully
 
karandpr said:
lol . Nope .
Superuser.apk and SuperSU.apk are just Root Management apps.

the Su binary or sudo binary is the main stuff .
having either of those in /system means you are rooted .

Rogue apps will run havoc if Root management apps are not present :eek:

Each binary may have it's own quirks .

:p
Click to expand...
I am glad you are smarter than me when it comes to this. :D

So how was it that my old phone had sudo, but I couldn't use root requiring apps? Just no way for them to get permission for root access?
 
agentc13 said:
I am glad you are smarter than me when it comes to this. :D

So how was it that my old phone had sudo, but I couldn't use root requiring apps? Just no way for them to get permission for root access?
Click to expand...


Security holes perhaps...don't feel bad I had the conversation with karan a few months back and he proved me wrong too...so I researched on my own...to prove him wrong and the took my foot out of my mouth...;)
 
True you cant use root requiring apps .
But if you can access rooted shell with sudo and if someone wrote an app with sudo(instead of su) then your phone would be goner .

There is a reason why Superuser.apk and SuperSU.apk come with their own binaries .It makes management easier (so i think ) .I have remote clue on writing such binary btw ...need to read stuff.....
 
karandpr said:
True you cant use root requiring apps .
But if you can access rooted shell with sudo and if someone wrote an app with sudo(instead of su) then your phone would be goner .

There is a reason why Superuser.apk and SuperSU.apk come with their own binaries .It makes management easier (so i think ) .I have remote clue on writing such binary btw ...need to read stuff.....
Click to expand...

That is making sense to me (I think), so basically I couldn't use something like titanium backup because it was written for /su instead of /sudo? And since there was not management app, whabang it could be toast if the app was malicious.


I really do appreciate you clarifying all this, as my understanding was a bit off!
 
Yeah ,sort of .
You need correct permissions on sudo so that it executes properly . Then malware can have party of the lifetime .
Hypothetical situation though .

Technically installing Superuser.apk or SuperSU.apk is pointless without the relevant su binary which is the basis of rooting :D .

Both use different binaries which are not cross -compatible .
 
Yeahha said:
Security holes perhaps...don't feel bad I had the conversation with karan a few months back and he proved me wrong too...so I researched on my own...to prove him wrong and the took my foot out of my mouth...;)
Click to expand...

I dont remember any such conversation ....
 
I get what you are saying. Basically the sudo binaries were like superuser/supersu binaries (maybe an overly simplistic comparison). And the apks just make it so you have to approve an apps permission to use said binaries. That would be why I needed to flash something in recovery or use gingerbreak to get the superuser binaries to use the superuser apk?
 
My guess is sudo doesn't give write permission on /system or wherever the su binaries need to be

Edit: you could test with an unrooted phone and root explorer file manager...
 
@Yeahha, what was the dark blue tapatalk skin you were referring to? Was there an update lately to include that, or am I just blind?

NVM, its an update, and my God it is nice looking!
 
There was an update today I believe...check Google play

It is under settings and skins or themes and part of the app now
 
Yeah the only thing I wish they did different was the orange subscribed thing...if it was blue as well it would be perfect. I didn't really like the light blue theme
 
Yeah, I haven't been a fan of how those orange indicators for subscribed threads are. The little scroll indicator overlaps them and looks weird at times.

Even making them match the blue theme, they would need more work.
 
agentc13 said:
Yeah, I haven't been a fan of how those orange indicators for subscribed threads are. The little scroll indicator overlaps them and looks weird at times.

Even making them match the blue theme, they would need more work.
Click to expand...

I think I will look into making mine blue...should be that hard...
 
The subscribed icon is under drawable HDMI as notification_n.PNG theme and replace then reinstall the new apk should change it...I saw the bubble in the same folder I'll find the name

Bubble is default_subforum.PNG

Should be able to apk manager those pretty easy
 
agentc13 said:
I get what you are saying. Basically the sudo binaries were like superuser/supersu binaries (maybe an overly simplistic comparison). And the apks just make it so you have to approve an apps permission to use said binaries. That would be why I needed to flash something in recovery or use gingerbreak to get the superuser binaries to use the superuser apk?
Click to expand...

Nope.....
It has nothing to do with running gingerbreak or flashing from recovery .basically apps acquire rooted shell perms. from su binary .

The whole purpose of rooting is to push su binary to /system/xbin or /system/bin . Method doesn't matter .
Method one :Via Custom recovery .
Which you did ....

Method two :via manual broken shell .
You can use broken shell(its pretty simple just a line edit in init.rc) .Then you can manually push the binary in the phone and set permissions and all and get root running .

method 3 :via broken shell(automatic)
The HTC One X root method .If you have gone all the lengths to break shell ,you may as well use a one shot method to install su binary at first boot .

methods 1,2,3 require unlocked bootloaders and/or odin and all since you are either flashing recovery.img or boot.img or so ....

Method 4 : Lets Break Android
This is special method . By this method you break a live system .
You see ,rageagainstthecage(ratc),psneuter ,Gingerbreak ,zergrush are all exploits .
When you run these on an android powered device ,a relevant device system breaks and a temporary access to rooted shell(#) is created . Using this temp access ,the su binary is pushed in /system and your phone is rooted .Some exploits are android wide ,some are phone wide .
The exploit is active till a reboot .Thats why it is advisable to reboot phone after rooting with such method .

Google doesnt care about the first three methods .They are technically harmless and the end-user is responsible for whatever that happens o the phone .

But Google is wary of this last method since all of them are security exploits . Because all the notorious malware use this exploits
Droid Dream used ratc
Fake Angry birds use Gingerbreak.

Now if an app had used your sudo binary to push it's modified su to control the device then it would compromise .Hypothetical but not impossible :eek: .


Yeahha said:
My guess is sudo doesn't give write permission on /system or wherever the su binaries need to be

Edit: you could test with an unrooted phone and root explorer file manager...
Click to expand...

who needs write permission !! if it breaks the shell ,you just need a busybox to acquire a write permission .
 
So, now I am confused again.
Maybe it was a few drinks to many at the pub, I will read this again tomorrow to make sure.
 
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