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Leadership fail?

shadowninty said:
health reform was part of Obama's platform
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Yep, they voted for Obama, but about 75% of people opposed what came through Congress (which, just FYI, Obama had nothing to do with. He wouldn't even tell them what should be in it).

shadowninty said:
???
I am reffering to free voting, filibustering etc
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The Health Care Overhaul has already raised my premiums $400/month (this year... great isn't it).

It has very real negative consequences. You think they should just have let that go without attempting to stop it?
 
byteware said:
Yep, they voted for Obama, but about 75% of people opposed what came through Congress (which, just FYI, Obama had nothing to do with. He wouldn't even tell them what should be in it).
because people ate gullible
people here vote for Euro Federalist and Euro Expansionist parties then freak about conscription and abortion at every referendum
The Health Care Overhaul has already raised my premiums $400/month (this year... great isn't it).

It has very real negative consequences. You think they should just have let that go without attempting to stop it?
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unfortunately this is because patients with pre existing conditions have to be charged equally
that or government health care
or leave them die/sell all their worldy possesions
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shadowninty said:
because people ate gullible
people here vote for Euro Federalist and Euro Expansionist parties then freak about conscription and abortion at every referendum
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Actually, because what they were told was absolutely NOT what was passed. They voted for what he promised. He just didn't deliver on what he promised.

shadowninty said:
unfortunately this is because patients with pre existing conditions have to be charged equally
that or government health care
or leave them die/sell all their worldy possesions
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Well, don't you make assumptions pretty quickly? This isn't the reason, just FYI.

Everyone at my employer is covered, regardless of pre-existing condition. It's part of the contract that my employer has with the Insurer.

The reason that MY insurance premiums have gone up so drastically is that we are now forced to cover adults up to 26 years old on their parents' insurance policy.

It has drastically hurt us.

But thank you for making broad assumptions based on a limited understanding of how the US insurance system works.
 
shadowninty said:
I guess that's just an issue with your political system
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"Your political system." You're American. lol.

Republicans are no different than Democrats. Both have the exact same foreign policy and desire to disempower the congress and empower a global government. Start wars and police the world as recently proven by Obama.

By pitting you guys against each other, the people lose.
 
byteware said:
Whether or not he's honest about it... I don't know, but he has stated clearly, he's Irish.
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Half of America also makes that claim.

I'm Scottish. Also, Italian and Canadian. I have Canadian, US, and British/UK Citizenship.

I have a US and British passport and a Canadian Birth Certificate.
 
jamor said:
Half of America also makes that claim.

I'm Scottish. Also, Italian and Canadian. I have Canadian, US, and British/UK Citizenship.

I have a US and British passport and a Canadian Birth Certificate.
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Let me rephrase... whether or not he's honest, he claims he lives in Ireland.
 
Steering this back to the original topic of leadership I think one thing is quite clear in contrast between the previous and current presidential administrations.

Obama (appears to be) is more deliberate and takes more time before making big decisions, like whether to increase the troop level in Afghanistan, whether to involve the U.S. in the Libyan air strikes, and several other areas.

In comparison, at least to me, the Bush White House made decisions faster, whether rightly or wrongly, and I think people are starting to notice that.

I don't believe enough time has passed to fully digest which strategy works better and perhaps many of us are just hoping things don't get any worse than they are now.

On the economy at least, in my home state of NJ, I've noticed a surge lately in the number of good jobs being posted. It might not last, but at least compared to six months ago, the job outlook has improved.
 
Potvin63 said:
Obama (appears to be) is more deliberate and takes more time before making big decisions, like whether to increase the troop level in Afghanistan, whether to involve the U.S. in the Libyan air strikes, and several other areas.

In comparison, at least to me, the Bush White House made decisions faster, whether rightly or wrongly, and I think people are starting to notice that.
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Another thing that I've noticed about Obama... he doesn't seem to want to take responsibility for ANYTHING.

What I mean by that... he didn't protect Civilians in Libya when they were actually just civilians. He waited for the UN to decide on it, before he went in to protect the rebels.

We have a moral responsibility to protect civilians in Libya? Then why did we sit by while protesters were being slaughtered, and wait for the UN to decide we should protect them?

The same is true on ALL of his "signature" legislation. He's provided no leadership. He's stayed out of the process. He's left Congressional Democrats to fend for themselves.

Nothing is his responsibility.
 
And the votes continue to come from somewhere. Instead of blaming the elected officials, try blaming yourself for electing him, or at least blame those who did vote for him. After all, if you believe that voting actually works, its all the fault of those who voted for them, not the candidate.
If you don't believe that voting works, blame the international bankers who really run the show. Maybe you should all pull out of the bank system and starve those beasts to death.
 
Bugly said:
And the votes continue to come from somewhere. Instead of blaming the elected officials, try blaming yourself for electing him, or at least blame those who did vote for him. After all, if you believe that voting actually works, its all the fault of those who voted for them, not the candidate.
If you don't believe that voting works, blame the international bankers who really run the show. Maybe you should all pull out of the bank system and starve those beasts to death.
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The American people don't elect the president. The electoral college elects the president. If you want an example. Look at Truman vs Dewey. Dewey won the popular vote. Truman won the electoral vote. Who won as president?
 
byteware said:
The same is true on ALL of his "signature" legislation. He's provided no leadership. He's stayed out of the process. He's left Congressional Democrats to fend for themselves.

Nothing is his responsibility.
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This is exactly what the article is about. The dems don't want to make the first move in the right direction because the right direction even thought the writing is on the wall isn't popular. The republicans are the same. And the president even though he's the leader says not I also. THIS is why we need term limits and salary caps.

Potvin63 said:
Steering this back to the original topic of leadership I think one thing is quite clear in contrast between the previous and current presidential administrations.

Obama (appears to be) is more deliberate and takes more time before making big decisions, like whether to increase the troop level in Afghanistan, whether to involve the U.S. in the Libyan air strikes, and several other areas.

In comparison, at least to me, the Bush White House made decisions faster, whether rightly or wrongly, and I think people are starting to notice that.

I don't believe enough time has passed to fully digest which strategy works better and perhaps many of us are just hoping things don't get any worse than they are now.

On the economy at least, in my home state of NJ, I've noticed a surge lately in the number of good jobs being posted. It might not last, but at least compared to six months ago, the job outlook has improved.
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Appears, is the right word.

Bugly said:
And the votes continue to come from somewhere. Instead of blaming the elected officials, try blaming yourself for electing him, or at least blame those who did vote for him. After all, if you believe that voting actually works, its all the fault of those who voted for them, not the candidate.
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I would agree on this. The problem isn't so much the bankers it's more about the uneducated voters that vote on appearance and not so much experience, voting history and past political rhetoric. I'm not even saying that McCain was a good choice....I'm just saying that Obama was the worst choice...the last 3 years have shown us that much.
 
Dark Jedi said:
The American people don't elect the president. The electoral college elects the president. If you want an example. Look at Truman vs Dewey. Dewey won the popular vote. Truman won the electoral vote. Who won as president?
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Uh, there was an electoral/popular split much more recently than that, and in that one, Bush only won electoral with his mass disenfranchising scheme.
 
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