really need answer not excuses

[TheRealCatfish]

Would like to know why the companies who made these Android devices and cell phone carriers r putting so much Bloatware on the devices instead or putting it in the Android market and let the customer pick where they want the app on there device. not here to bash anyone but want a real answer instead of a bunch bull. because when motorola push and update thou to the droid2 the also put more preinstalled apps on it and I don't use verizon natigator so now I have more bloat ware on my device. so here is the question who ready owns the device me or the companies? if u say companies they where is my check for using the device if u say mine the get this junk off my device Please fixs the problems the update caused before u make another device to show u really mean that u care about ur customers.

 

[medwa]

The bloatware is put on our phones by the carriers, not the phone manufacturers. If you root your phone, you can remove most of the crap that the carriers put on there.

 

[Slug]

The "Introductions" forum isn't really the place for this. As you mention a Verizon-supplied app I'm moving this to the Verizon carrier-specific forum.

 

[gvillager]

The real answer is $$$.

 

[jsward12]

You can buy a Nexus One on ebay. No bloatware on that phone!

 

[3devious]

What about the Nexus S? Any bloatware on that? I actually think that's a cool phone. I think the answer is the same reason we root the phones and put our on stuff on them. "Because it is ours."

Look at it as their way of peeing on a fire hydrant.

The two are pretty similar. Both urine on a fire hydrant and bloatware are unpleasant but luckily they are simple to remove.

 

[pool_shark]

I don't understand why this is such a big deal for people.

The apps aren't taking up a major amount of space and they aren't ruining your battery life.

 

[Mayhem]

It may not be a big deal to some people, but others obviously have issue with the bloatware even being there. It's simply a matter of preference.

I don't use MySpace. I'd rather not see it in the list of apps. Why? Because it bugs me, even if its not doing anything. It's an annoyance. Not a big one, but still..

 

[pool_shark]

It may not be a big deal to some people, but others obviously have issue with the bloatware even being there. It's simply a matter of preference.

I don't use MySpace. I'd rather not see it in the list of apps. Why? Because it bugs me, even if its not doing anything. It's an annoyance. Not a big one, but still..

So basically it's completely irrational, got it.

 

[RiverOfIce]

So basically it's completely irrational, got it.

Basically, they do run down your battery and do take up major space. If you use task killer to take out just the bloatware apps, you can increase your battery life by about 30%. It may be irrational to you, but 30% is not to me. Now about the op question. Back in the day, before mass data. Installing bloatware and making it un-removable on your phone was for your own good. If you deleted the app off your phone and did not have data, you could not replace that app. Back in the day, phones where sold to be close systems. Today, with current internet, telecoms make money and will not bother to change their ways. So they get paid to add some apps to the phone, they also figure that want has work for the last 20 years, should continue for the next 40 years. Basically, all telecoms are monopolistic dinosaurs that figure if it makes them a buck, why not. But the real answer is to insure all consumers have the promised features when they fired up the phone, they force and lock the included bloatware.

 

[pool_shark]

Basically, they do run down your battery and do take up major space. If you use task killer to take out just the bloatware apps, you can increase your battery life by about 30%. It may be irrational to you, but 30% is not to me. Now about the op question. Back in the day, before mass data. Installing bloatware and making it un-removable on your phone was for your own good. If you deleted the app off your phone and did not have data, you could not replace that app. Back in the day, phones where sold to be close systems. Today, with current internet, telecoms make money and will not bother to change their ways. So they get paid to add some apps to the phone, they also figure that want has work for the last 20 years, should continue for the next 40 years. Basically, all telecoms are monopolistic dinosaurs that figure if it makes them a buck, why not. But the real answer is to insure all consumers have the promised features when they fired up the phone, they force and lock the included bloatware.

Most agree that those apps that are in background aren't running, they are waiting, their cpu utilization is ZERO.
No CPU utilization means no battery drain.

You're advocating using a task killer which again by most Android user standards is a bad thing to do.

As far as it being irrational, I was referring to the person who said it just bugs him to see them in the app drawer.

 

[RiverOfIce]

Most agree that those apps that are in background aren't running, they are waiting, their cpu utilization is ZERO.
No CPU utilization means no battery drain.

Actually they do something really cute. They themselves dont run, but they cause the android system to run. They add on to things like htc sync, where it is android system working harder. Don't beleive me, setup your own tower, have your phone connect and sniff the traffic. Even though things like sprint's nfl, tv, and facebook have never been turned on by the user, they are still using a lot of bandwidth. Bandwidth equals lesser battery. Task killers, when used properly work very well. The only reason that they are not liked by the development community is because some guy kills their app and then blames them for it not working.

 

[PSkeptic]

I don't understand why this is such a big deal for people.

The apps aren't taking up a major amount of space and they aren't ruining your battery life.

Some of them are taking up a decent amount of space on the phone. Especially when you add them all up, you get about 50MB of wasted space.

Adding to that, most of them do drain your battery by always sending traffic (Even if they are unused). That equates to more battery drain.

 

[pool_shark]

Actually they do something really cute. They themselves dont run, but they cause the android system to run. They add on to things like htc sync, where it is android system working harder. Don't beleive me, setup your own tower, have your phone connect and sniff the traffic. Even though things like sprint's nfl, tv, and facebook have never been turned on by the user, they are still using a lot of bandwidth. Bandwidth equals lesser battery. Task killers, when used properly work very well. The only reason that they are not liked by the development community is because some guy kills their app and then blames them for it not working.

Task killers are not liked by a lot of android users. The reason is there are tasks that respawn by the OS. If you have a task killer set to kill those respawning processes, the task killer is always working which will take resources and run down the battery.

 

[pool_shark]

Some of them are taking up a decent amount of space on the phone. Especially when you add them all up, you get about 50MB of wasted space.

Adding to that, most of them do drain your battery by always sending traffic (Even if they are unused). That equates to more battery drain.

Those apps sit in background and the battery monitor reads 0 cpu utilization.
If the cpu is 0 they aren't actually running at that time.

Amazon mp3 is 1.17MB, my verizon is 3.08MB, Blockbuster 396KB.
The only relatively large one is NFS which is 100MB and can be uninstalled.

 

[PSkeptic]

Those apps sit in background and the battery monitor reads 0 cpu utilization.
If the cpu is 0 they aren't actually running at that time.

And, you monitor your CPU constantly? If they sit in the background, init cycles through them to check if they need to wake up. Not to mention, Android polls them periodically.

And, have you ever seen your CPU say "0.9%"? No, it rounds down.

At the least, having all that bloat there in the background gobbles up memory for your device, since it needs to keep the pointer to it's stack in the memory map and process table.

Amazon mp3 is 1.17MB, my verizon is 3.08MB, Blockbuster 396KB.
The only relatively large one is NFS which is 100MB and can be uninstalled.

Ok, so you're forgetting the rest of the bloatware there: MySpace, Twitter, Mobile 3G, VCast Suite, etc. I know on the Ally, VZW installs about 50MB of bloat, which is easily solved by flashing a new, slimmed down ROM. You also see the phone get instantly snappier. That bloat must be doing something.

And, on the Fascinate, Tw, TwLiveWallPapers, plus all the bloat there totals about 75MB.

So, yeah. Call me a neat freak, but I like to throw away things I never will use, in order to free up space. I'd never would have rooted my phone if VZW would have left the phone alone, and shipped it clean.

 

[Tempusfugit]

If bloatware doesn't do ANYTHING, I wonder why I get sprintTV widget force closes, even though i have no such widget, and have never used sprintTV except for once when I first got my phone. I also wonder why I get DRM notifications ever since the newest update including the blockbuster app.

Strange how a program could cause itself to force close without using any CPU cycles.

Besides those points, and the pop up for a program I DON'T WANT, and DON'T USE, is negatively affecting my use of MY PHONE, ya it bugs the hell out of me to see programs in the app drawer that I don't want. Call me irrational, I'm not the one telling people what should and shouldn't bother them.

edit: to answer the OP, money... think pop-ups that don't go away.

 

[pool_shark]

And, you monitor your CPU constantly? If they sit in the background, init cycles through them to check if they need to wake up. Not to mention, Android polls them periodically.

And, have you ever seen your CPU say "0.9%"? No, it rounds down.

At the least, having all that bloat there in the background gobbles up memory for your device, since it needs to keep the pointer to it's stack in the memory map and process table.



Ok, so you're forgetting the rest of the bloatware there: MySpace, Twitter, Mobile 3G, VCast Suite, etc. I know on the Ally, VZW installs about 50MB of bloat, which is easily solved by flashing a new, slimmed down ROM. You also see the phone get instantly snappier. That bloat must be doing something.

And, on the Fascinate, Tw, TwLiveWallPapers, plus all the bloat there totals about 75MB.

So, yeah. Call me a neat freak, but I like to throw away things I never will use, in order to free up space. I'd never would have rooted my phone if VZW would have left the phone alone, and shipped it clean.

I didn't forget anything, just didn't list them all. Each device is different we don't all have the same pre-installed software. I don't have myspace, twitter, or the vcast stuff.

I didn't root to get rid of the software, I did it to install a screenshot app, tether (though I don't use it), and to be able to do what I want at the command line.

 

[pool_shark]

If bloatware doesn't do ANYTHING, I wonder why I get sprintTV widget force closes, even though i have no such widget, and have never used sprintTV except for once when I first got my phone. I also wonder why I get DRM notifications ever since the newest update including the blockbuster app.

Strange how a program could cause itself to force close without using any CPU cycles.

Besides those points, and the pop up for a program I DON'T WANT, and DON'T USE, is negatively affecting my use of MY PHONE, ya it bugs the hell out of me to see programs in the app drawer that I don't want. Call me irrational, I'm not the one telling people what should and shouldn't bother them.

edit: to answer the OP, money... think pop-ups that don't go away.

Show me where I told one person that it shouldn't bother them.
What I said was that I don't understand why it does.

As far as things running, if you ever have the opportunity, look on an AIX server. You'll see AIO running when you do a pstat -a, however AIO doesn't do a thing until there is a system call for it.
It's just waiting in ready mode at the bottom of the process list.

If any of you want proof of what's using cpu and what isn't, go to the command line and run the top command.
You will see countless apps running, most with 0.0 cpu.

 

[Tempusfugit]

Show me where I told one person that it shouldn't bother them.
What I said was that I don't understand why it does.

As far as things running, if you ever have the opportunity, look on an AIX server. You'll see AIO running when you do a pstat -a, however AIO doesn't do a thing until there is a system call for it.
It's just waiting in ready mode at the bottom of the process list.

Calling someone irrational, is saying whatever is bothering them, shouldn't bother them... Its not rational to be bothered by that...

I don't need to check anything. I know what is running on my phone.

 

[pool_shark]

Calling someone irrational, is saying whatever is bothering them, shouldn't bother them... Its not rational to be bothered by that...

I don't need to check anything. I know what is running on my phone.

Your first point is true.

Sure you need to check. You only think you know what's running.
I edited my last post, run the command and see if you see what you though.

 

[PSkeptic]

I didn't forget anything, just didn't list them all. Each device is different we don't all have the same pre-installed software. I don't have myspace, twitter, or the vcast stuff.

I didn't root to get rid of the software, I did it to install a screenshot app, tether (though I don't use it), and to be able to do what I want at the command line.

If you have a Verizon phone, it has VCast Suite on it: VZ Nav, VCast Song ID, VCast 411, VCast Media, etc. There's no exception there.

 

[pool_shark]

If you have a Verizon phone, it has VCast Suite on it: VZ Nav, VCast Song ID, VCast 411, VCast Media, etc. There's no exception there.

You're wrong. I downloaded vcast song ID on my own, and didn't have VZ navigator until the update.
I do not have Vcast media, nor Vcast 411.

 

[Tempusfugit]

So from that picture you posted, what am I supposed to be seeing, that handcent also takes 0.0, so it also never uses any CPU?


OMG OMG, I just checked task manager on my computer, and guess what, google updates, chrome, avast, spybot, are all taking 0 CPU right now, that means they never use any CPU or power!

 

[PSkeptic]

You're wrong. I downloaded vcast song ID on my own, and didn't have VZ navigator until the update.
I do not have Vcast media, nor Vcast 411.

So, you do have components of the VCast Suite, right, that are preinstalled? CityID?

Come on, what are you arguing here? That VZW doesn't load about 50MB of bloat on all phones?

Sure, there is different bloat on all phones. My Ally didn't come with NFS:Shift... My Fascinate didn't have SongID. Both phones had about 50MB of bloat, taking up space.