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Red Light Cameras... CHEATING TO ISSUE MORE TICKETS
- Thread starter IOWA
- Start date
Kori_Tamashii
Android Enthusiast
Do you mean 'whining'? Lol.
Sorry, but the stats don't lie - red light cameras just don't make a huge difference.
There has to be a better way to increase revenue. :/
IOWA
Mr. Logic Pants
Yeah, like quit giving tax breaks to the elite's lol.
Not really. The problem is laws enforcing victimless "crimes" that only exist to generate revenue.
Reading up on the difference between Mala Prohibita (illegal because someone wrote a law) and Mala in Se (illegal because it is an offense against society) can be quite an eye opener.
Frisco
=Luceat Lux Vestra=
It's just that the beef is not with law enforcement in such cases, as they are doing what the tax payers pay them to do. The beef is with law makers who are not doing their job we pay them to do if the come up with laws which really are not in the public's best interest.
Kori_Tamashii
Android Enthusiast
I wouldn't go so far as to say speeding is a 'victimless crime'... But that's another story.
Sure it is. Literally MILLIONS of people speed every day with zero harm to anyone or anything. The act of speeding itself doesn't do anything.
Now some of those people crash. Then there's probably a victim involved in some fashion or another and laws and legal investigation should come into play.
We're so mired in "because something might possibly happen" laws that our legal system has become a joke that punishes the innocent right along with the guilty.
Now some of those people crash. Then there's probably a victim involved in some fashion or another and laws and legal investigation should come into play.
We're so mired in "because something might possibly happen" laws that our legal system has become a joke that punishes the innocent right along with the guilty.
IOWA
Mr. Logic Pants
Frisco
=Luceat Lux Vestra=
I agree. The Turtle Survival Alliance has well represented the needs of those who will not speed.
Yuck yuck.
Meanwhile, the Libertarian take on all this flies in the face of insurance company data on speeding and collisions. Yes, millions do speed without colliding with anything. But the ones who do crash cost us all millions per year in dollars and lives lost and injuries.
IOWA
Mr. Logic Pants
I agree. The Turtle Survival Alliance has well represented the needs of those who will not speed.
Yuck yuck.
Meanwhile, the Libertarian take on all this flies in the face of insurance company data on speeding and collisions. Yes, millions do speed without colliding with anything. But the ones who do crash cost us all millions per year in dollars and lives lost and injuries.
Although, you can also look at it as everyone else was going to slow due to bad speed limits. I for one have always thought a speed range would be better than speed limits.
I have also seen drivers slow as turtles that just as much if not more damage due to poor driving skills....
Personally, if it werent for my fast reflexes and long time road experience have avoided many accidents, even though i tend to drive over the speed limit.
Frisco
=Luceat Lux Vestra=
Good points, IOWA, especially about "speed range rather than limits." But :
That already exists, in the real world of driving, as we all know. On a highway or even city surface street we are accustomed to seeing a range of speeds around the posted limit.
The only groups of people going the exact same speed with no passing or causing slowdowns are on a train, not driving.
Also, if slow drivers are involved in collisions it is a lot less likely to be their fault than the speeders who are darting around in anger at them: just slow down, he's likely going within 5mph of the posted limit anyway.
Drivers all over the world have something in common, as I've seen, no matter the city, state or country: most seem to consider the posted limit as a minimum, rather than the maximum. Thus the carnage. Human nature can be nasty.
:That already exists, in the real world of driving, as we all know. On a highway or even city surface street we are accustomed to seeing a range of speeds around the posted limit.
The only groups of people going the exact same speed with no passing or causing slowdowns are on a train, not driving.
Also, if slow drivers are involved in collisions it is a lot less likely to be their fault than the speeders who are darting around in anger at them: just slow down, he's likely going within 5mph of the posted limit anyway.
Drivers all over the world have something in common, as I've seen, no matter the city, state or country: most seem to consider the posted limit as a minimum, rather than the maximum. Thus the carnage. Human nature can be nasty.
Bob Maxey
Android Expert
I have been with fast drivers that complain about the slow drivers when the slow drivers are actually doing the speed limit. Go figure.
I drive fast because I do not have much longer. All older people should be allowed to drive their age. In my case, I am not that old, so for me, I should only be ticketed if I exceed 185 or so.
IOWA
Mr. Logic Pants
Good points, IOWA, especially about "speed range rather than limits." But
That already exists, in the real world of driving, as we all know. On a highway or even city surface street we are accustomed to seeing a range of speeds around the posted limit.
The only groups of people going the exact same speed with no passing or causing slowdowns are on a train, not driving.
Also, if slow drivers are involved in collisions it is a lot less likely to be their fault than the speeders who are darting around in anger at them: just slow down, he's likely going within 5mph of the posted limit anyway.
Drivers all over the world have something in common, as I've seen, no matter the city, state or country: most seem to consider the posted limit as a minimum, rather than the maximum. Thus the carnage. Human nature can be nasty.
The solution would call for more progressive thinking.. for instance, on highways they should have TRUE express zones where there is a minimum and maximum speed limit RANGE and you can get ticketed for traveling outside that range for any extended period of time. It should also be faster than normal speed range/limit to accommodate those who do wish to travel fast, or need to travel fast.
As far as safety is concerned, tailgating should also be strictly enforced.
Easy solution right? Too bad it'll never happen....
Kelmar
Done by choice
Most of the interstates I've seen and traveled in and across the USA have had a minimum speed of 45 or so and a max of 70.
Ironically, if the speed limit were raised to 80, people would drive 90 and complain. If it were raised to 115, people would drive 125 and complain.
As mentioned above (Frisco perhaps?), the current law is what it is. Speeding won't get it changed but rather just get you a ticket and make you mad at a cop. If it's too slow, lobby to get it changed.
Edit: though it has nothing to do with red light cameras
Ironically, if the speed limit were raised to 80, people would drive 90 and complain. If it were raised to 115, people would drive 125 and complain.
As mentioned above (Frisco perhaps?), the current law is what it is. Speeding won't get it changed but rather just get you a ticket and make you mad at a cop. If it's too slow, lobby to get it changed.
Edit: though it has nothing to do with red light cameras
Frisco
=Luceat Lux Vestra=
Germany's Autobahn network has no maximum speed limits for passenger cars and motorcycles.
Here's a paragraph from the Wikipedia about Autobahn safety:
"The overall road traffic safety of German autobahns is comparable to and in some cases better than that of other European highways. According to the statistics collected by the International Traffic Safety Data and Analysis Group,[9] there were 2.2 road user fatalities per billion vehicle kilometers on German autobahns in 2008. Neighboring countries with available data include Belgium (4.2 in 2007), the Netherlands (2.1 in 2009), Denmark (2.5), Austria (4.2), Switzerland (1.2), and France (1.8). Using the same statistic, 4.5 fatalities have occurred in the United States on motorways."
For clarity on the "no max limit" laws there:
A hard limit is imposed on some vehicles:
60 km/h
"The German autobahns are famous for being some of the few public roads in the world without blanket speed limits for cars and motorcycles.
Naturally, speed limits do apply at junctions and other danger points, like sections under construction or in need of repair. Speed limits at non-construction sites are generally 100 km/h, 120 km/h, or even 130 km/h; construction sites have a usual speed limit of 80 km/h but may be as low as 60 km/h, or in very rare cases, even 40 km/h. Certain stretches have separate, and lower, speed limits used in cases of wet lanes."
Here's a paragraph from the Wikipedia about Autobahn safety:
"The overall road traffic safety of German autobahns is comparable to and in some cases better than that of other European highways. According to the statistics collected by the International Traffic Safety Data and Analysis Group,[9] there were 2.2 road user fatalities per billion vehicle kilometers on German autobahns in 2008. Neighboring countries with available data include Belgium (4.2 in 2007), the Netherlands (2.1 in 2009), Denmark (2.5), Austria (4.2), Switzerland (1.2), and France (1.8). Using the same statistic, 4.5 fatalities have occurred in the United States on motorways."
For clarity on the "no max limit" laws there:
A hard limit is imposed on some vehicles:
60 km/h
- Buses carrying standing passengers
- Motorcycles pulling trailers
- Vehicles with maximum allowed weight exceeding 3.5 t (except passenger cars)
- Passenger cars and trucks with trailers
- Buses
- Passenger cars pulling trailers certified for 100 km/h
- Buses certified for 100 km/h not pulling trailers
"The German autobahns are famous for being some of the few public roads in the world without blanket speed limits for cars and motorcycles.
Naturally, speed limits do apply at junctions and other danger points, like sections under construction or in need of repair. Speed limits at non-construction sites are generally 100 km/h, 120 km/h, or even 130 km/h; construction sites have a usual speed limit of 80 km/h but may be as low as 60 km/h, or in very rare cases, even 40 km/h. Certain stretches have separate, and lower, speed limits used in cases of wet lanes."
Stuntman
Android Expert
With regard to driving speed and speed limits, I personally find that as I get older, I noticed a change in my driving behaviour. When I first started driving, I tend not to mind following the vehicle in front of me. Then in my early 30's, I noticed that I seem to have lost my patience. Most of the time, I want to overtake the driver in front of me. I'm not sure exactly why. I have since wanted to drive in the left hand lane more often and would attempt to pass more vehicles than I have when I was younger.
I'm not sure exactly what caused my change in behaviour or more specifically, my significantly reduced patience following another driver. It's something I never felt when I was younger. I remember seeing a number of people pass me and wonder why they need to pass me. Now I'm one of those people.
I'm not sure exactly what caused my change in behaviour or more specifically, my significantly reduced patience following another driver. It's something I never felt when I was younger. I remember seeing a number of people pass me and wonder why they need to pass me. Now I'm one of those people.