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Rooting and backups

D

Dosage

Newbie
Alright so I'm new to all this crap, I spent the last hour googling it and it has been driving me crazy, I know how to root by now, but the thing driving me insane is backing up...I just can't figure out how to do this crap, Titanium backup needs a rooted phone...I'm really afraid of the risk of bricking, so I wanna backup the OS.

Also, another question, will I lose all my apps/widgets after I root? Can i use GO Launcher and GO power saver after I root?

I also read somewhere that I can actually install apps on the SD card instead of installing it on the phone memory, but will that harm the phone in any way? and again, will I risk bricking like that?

Please just dumb it down to me, I'm new to all this....
 
Dosage said:
Alright so I'm new to all this crap, I spent the last hour googling it and it has been driving me crazy, I know how to root by now, but the thing driving me insane is backing up...I just can't figure out how to do this crap, Titanium backup needs a rooted phone...I'm really afraid of the risk of bricking, so I wanna backup the OS.

Also, another question, will I lose all my apps/widgets after I root? Can i use GO Launcher and GO power saver after I root?

I also read somewhere that I can actually install apps on the SD card instead of installing it on the phone memory, but will that harm the phone in any way? and again, will I risk bricking like that?

Please just dumb it down to me, I'm new to all this....
Click to expand...

I don't want to discourage you from researching, but your hour of searching obviously isn't enough. You need to completely understand what you're doing and the risks before you root. Don't do it for the hell of it. It raises the cost for all of us when people who don't understand how to root return their devices.

Rooting in itself does nothing to your current ROM. There is no wipe necessary, so everything will still be there.

You cannot back up the phone without root access. Yes, there is always the risk of bricking when you root. Read, read, read, understand the instructions, and read it once more.

Most current android phones running 2.2 or higher can install apps to the SD card. It's in your manage apps menu.
 
ExtremeNerd said:
I don't want to discourage you from researching, but your hour of searching obviously isn't enough. You need to completely understand what you're doing and the risks before you root. Don't do it for the hell of it. It raises the cost for all of us when people who don't understand how to root return their devices.

Rooting in itself does nothing to your current ROM. There is no wipe necessary, so everything will still be there.

You cannot back up the phone without root access. Yes, there is always the risk of bricking when you root. Read, read, read, understand the instructions, and read it once more.

Most current android phones running 2.2 or higher can install apps to the SD card. It's in your manage apps menu.
Click to expand...

After reading your reply I decided that it is not worth it =/ Thanks for all the info :)
 
Alright just a quick question, and sorry for double posting but I had to bump it.

How can I create a back up for my OS before rooting? I want to root but I need to create a back up first =/
 
You generally need to have installed a custom recovery to do that backup, which in most cases means you have already rooted.

The best place to discuss this would be in your phone's All Things Root forum, as methods do vary. If you tell us what phone you have we can move the thread if you like.
 
No one seems to have all the info about rooting in the same place - you google it, and still find answers jumping from page one to twenty. Everyone posts a video. Not all those who make videos are coherent in presenting the info. It's like some posters at XDA with that awful cell shorthand.

I've only seen one good step by step written wiki, and that was from Cyanogenmod.
If all info was posted in that manner and in one place, things might be better understood by everyone.

It depends on the phone you have - if you have an older phone, no one is likely to answer in that particular forum. Some of the stickies are out of date with links so that is also no help.

Took me at least a week in searching, bookmarking and reading before I did anything.

I forget where I saw it, but did find a rather interesting discussion about TB, Clockwork Recovery, and a couple of other similar programs. Some like all the info and don't know exactly what questions to ask. Or the terminology to phrase the question.
I don't like videos. It's too hard to choose the exact spot if you want a repeat of an instruction.
 
zuben el genub said:
No one seems to have all the info about rooting in the same place - you google it, and still find answers jumping from page one to twenty. Everyone posts a video. Not all those who make videos are coherent in presenting the info. It's like some posters at XDA with that awful cell shorthand.

I've only seen one good step by step written wiki, and that was from Cyanogenmod.
If all info was posted in that manner and in one place, things might be better understood by everyone.

It depends on the phone you have - if you have an older phone, no one is likely to answer in that particular forum. Some of the stickies are out of date with links so that is also no help.

Took me at least a week in searching, bookmarking and reading before I did anything.

I forget where I saw it, but did find a rather interesting discussion about TB, Clockwork Recovery, and a couple of other similar programs. Some like all the info and don't know exactly what questions to ask. Or the terminology to phrase the question.
I don't like videos. It's too hard to choose the exact spot if you want a repeat of an instruction.
Click to expand...

This is how it should be. It isn't a decision first timers should make quickly. If/when they screw it up, they return it to the manufacturer and raises prices for all of us.

Don't get me wrong, I have rooted every device I've owned (and about two dozen for other people), but don't do it for the hell of it. Learn what you're doing, what the risks are, and most importantly, WHY. Don't do it for the hell of it, or because it's the techie thing to do.
 
It took me a week to FIND the information before I could make up my mind whether or not to root. I bookmarked and reread the info for another 2 weeks to make sure I understood it. Not having all the information to make a decision in one place in understandable English was my complaint.


Let's put it this way - I want a music player that plays a certain audio file. I can read all the reviews on Here,Play, Appbrain, etc - and they all tout something like it integrates with Facebook, or it has 50 gazillion skins. Not one damn word about what file formats it will play!

So with rooting and a search - most of it - "my phone never worked better - I can overclock, etc" or "it borked my phone, it sucks" This is not information - it's OPINIONS and that's what a search will turn up. You can't make up your mind on an opinion since one man's meat is another's poison.
 
The reason you find so many different opinions on websites is because the process of rooting is different for every phone, but the end result is the same. However since some methods are more difficult or some are coupled with locked or encrypted bootloaders, the end user's experience will vary from phone to phone.

Rooting is just giving you the ABILITY to modify, change, or delete anything you want on your phone. Other than that, nothing is changed on the phone.
 
Yeah, rooted my phone before, took all of five seconds and all it did was just add an app called superuser. Basically, the dangers of "bricking" a phone in the rooting process is IMO overrated. Its just technically the same as in Windows activated Admin access for a user.
 
Alright, not to undermine anything in response to the original post. All GREAT input answering the post...
A few things I've picked up after wow, too many hours browsing forums, S-engins, and anywhere I found something relevant.

1.) If You are generally dissatisfied with the performance of your Android phone 2x or above. Research your phone & Android version SPECIFICALLY! (A general search for android tips, will get you lost in B.S.)

2.) If you have a more than elementary understanding of coding (fyi:LINUX=JEDI!); Then research rooting processes, again for your phone and Android version! If you find one which has positive feedback(>80%) and IS for YOUR PHONE, create an account, if you must, and check it out. ((The sites that require that are usually more secure (ie. androidforums.com.) I'd know, I'm a Penetration Tester.))

3.) Backing-up BEFORE you root; If you don't already have a Gmail account set up with your phone, get one. Enable background services & data sync. While your phone is powered on, log into your Gmail account via PC or MAC (rooter's choice), double check that all downloaded programs are there. All inherent programs on your device will still be there after rooting. Specific logins and settings will need to be reset. ((!!!-If you have messages, emails, texts, app or game stats. That you wish to be present on your rooted device. Some apps have transfer/backup options within them. If not, a simple app stat back-up application from android market will help you get that data to your PC. (With my Samsung Rugby Smart, I said "F*** this I'm evolving. So I do not have specs on stat back-up.-!!!))

4.) Success is = to your Persistence in research *(multiplied) by your Knowledge / similar User Consensus.

"I could post more, but I'm tired & a bit inebriated."

PS. Props to "zuben el genub" & "ExtremeNerd" words of wisdom. Perhaps we should try to start a sticky, "Who should root?" or "Should I root?"
Because all the "What Is Rooting?" stuff on the net doesn't even make a dent.

Android>IsuckPhone,
Grinley44
 
Thank you for all the valuable information, very helpful..I read a bit more about rooting, and the only things that I personally would benefit from is changable ROMs, downloading more apps, and ofcourse moving my apps to the SD card...and while all of this is useful, it's not worth the risk of bricking (which would leave me with no phone)...don't you agree?
 
That depends on how important those things are to you.

To me having more space, being able to change the ROM, properly back up the system, were essential. Doing my research I found that the risks of truly bricking my phone were virtually zero (for my model, with the tools available for it - as people have noted the methods depend on the phone), so it was a no brainer for me. I cannot imagine that any future device of mine will go unrooted for very long - I'm way too used to the capabilities, and don't like the idea of being so limited as I'd be without root (including the limited ability to fix things for myself). But that's me - if these things matter less to you, or you are less confident of what you are doing, then you would be absolutely correct to come to a different conclusion.

There's no "right" answer to this, just the answer that you are comfortable with.
 
Ok just two last questions, I did not find a clear answer for this anywhere on the internet.

If I brick my phone, is there any way that I can get it to work again?

Can the procces of rooting itself brick my phone or what happens after the rooting? Because if rooting itself does not affect my device then I can simply make multiple backups after I root and be safe and comfortable, right?
 
chanchan05 said:
Yeah, rooted my phone before, took all of five seconds and all it did was just add an app called superuser. Basically, the dangers of "bricking" a phone in the rooting process is IMO overrated. Its just technically the same as in Windows activated Admin access for a user.
Click to expand...

This is the problem. That wasn't all that happened. However, the people who know what they're doing make it easier for us, so it seems easy. Behind that "one-click root" was a long script, and a lot of code. By the time it reaches that point of one-click, it is idiot proof. The rooting process of the Droid 2 is much more difficult, no? If these instructions aren't followed correctly, you CAN brick your phone. SU is simply an app which makes it easier for us to use root access.

@dosage, for a hard brick (can't boot, can't get to recovery), there are few phones/tablets which have a method of repairing it. Yours most likely isn't one.

Both can brick your phone. Rooting is the dangerous process if you can't read and follow directions. After rooting, if you start flashing ROMs, there are dangers, but more easily avoided. Flashing a ROM/radio for a different phone, for example, may brick your device.

If you don't understand any of the terms I used, please don't attempt to root.
 
ExtremeNerd said:
This is the problem. That wasn't all that happened. However, the people who know what they're doing make it easier for us, so it seems easy. Behind that "one-click root" was a long script, and a lot of code. By the time it reaches that point of one-click, it is idiot proof. The rooting process of the Droid 2 is much more difficult, no? If these instructions aren't followed correctly, you CAN brick your phone. SU is simply an app which makes it easier for us to use root access.

@dosage, for a hard brick (can't boot, can't get to recovery), there are few phones/tablets which have a method of repairing it. Yours most likely isn't one.

Both can brick your phone. Rooting is the dangerous process if you can't read and follow directions. After rooting, if you start flashing ROMs, there are dangers, but more easily avoided. Flashing a ROM/radio for a different phone, for example, may brick your device.

If you don't understand any of the terms I used, please don't attempt to root.
Click to expand...

Hmm. The Droid 2 is old Moto right? Before Google acquisition? Yeah the locked bootloaders made it hard. However for Samsung devices it seems its always been easy. Even if you don't have one click, there's a lot of relatively easy ways for root for them. So yeah, depends on your device. I entered Android at a point where there was already a thriving community, much more so now that its bigger.
 
Why doesn't someone make a good tutorial for backup, then? Everyone tells you to back up. How many ways are there to back up? What's the most effective? What kind of software (root and non root) is available? Is there anything like Acronis or others for the phone? Be a good idea even if you aren't rooting.
 
zuben el genub said:
Why doesn't someone make a good tutorial for backup, then? Everyone tells you to back up. How many ways are there to back up? What's the most effective? What kind of software (root and non root) is available? Is there anything like Acronis or others for the phone? Be a good idea even if you aren't rooting.
Click to expand...

The only true backup is a NANdroid backup, which is only available using a custom recovery (Clockwork Mod). There's nothing to it once you're rooted, it's a simple click. There is no way to make a complete backup of your phone without root. Reason is, there's no way to restore the backups you create without a custom recovery.
 
zuben el genub said:
Why doesn't someone make a good tutorial for backup, then? Everyone tells you to back up. How many ways are there to back up? What's the most effective? What kind of software (root and non root) is available? Is there anything like Acronis or others for the phone? Be a good idea even if you aren't rooting.
Click to expand...

Different for every phone, but basically get MyBackup Pro on the market and just backup everything you can. Or use your manufacturer suite. The only things you won't be able to backup is your homescreen setup and game data. But with the games now trending to having cloud backup linked to Facebook, soon rooting for backups won't matter.
 
ExtremeNerd said:
The only true backup is a NANdroid backup, which is only available using a custom recovery (Clockwork Mod). There's nothing to it once you're rooted, it's a simple click. There is no way to make a complete backup of your phone without root.
Click to expand...
I could quibble. Some rooting methods involve unlocking/replacing the bootloader and flashing a custom recovery (not necessarily CWM), which is then used to root the ROM. In these cases you can take a nandroid of the unrooted ROM. But it's a quibble because you've made more significant mods than mere rooting at this point. :)

I don't know of a case where you can back up the ROM on a completely locked phone. MyBackup is, as said, pretty good for unrooted phones, but some things are better done with other apps. There are options to back up a lot of data over to Google, many apps let you back up their data to SD, there are a number of message and game data backups, etc. No single, universal solution.

On my device I'd say it's more important to make sure you understand the rooting procedure than to back up first, since if you do it right the risks are minimal. But there are methods for some devices which will wipe the phone in the process, in which case it's much more important.
 
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