Help Super AMOLED (again) with PenTile subpixel matrix?

[Bluebrain]

the text is fine on the galaxy S! try and look at it, zoom it or whatever, the text is fine..LOL

Yes, the Galaxy-S is fine compared to a iPhone 3/G/S
It's also fine compared to a G1.
And it's also fine compared to any old Nokia or Sony Ericsson.

BUT IT's DEFINITELY NOT FINE compared to any other high-res phone!!!

Compare it with the Milestone/Droid, compare it with the iPhone 4, compare it with the EVO 4G, HTC HD2/Leo or the Droid-X, and you will clearly see the difference!

i don't know what you are talking about.. i've tried zooming in on pages and i don't see any problems .. and why would you read a site all zoomed out anyway? i don't get it?

If you don't get it, I'll try to help:
Would you read a book with some kind of masking sheet over the pages where you have to move it around all the time to read the page?
Or do you prefer to see the entire page?

This is the same on the phone.
On the Milestone I was able to read a website fully zoomed out in portrait view. I can hold it in one hand and only hat to scroll down with my thumb.

On the Galaxy-S I have to zoom in and out, scroll left and right and up and down. That's frustrating!

The point that makes me angry is, that it's a step backwards! The technology is here, it's cheap and other devices use it: LCD TFT (or even Sony's Super-LCD)

So: why not use it? Because of the AMOLED's vivid colors and the deep black?
Well, that's nice and as I mentioned before: a big plus if you mainly want to watch videos.
But we are talking about text readability here! And with that I give a shit on the bonbon-sweets-colors!
The advantage (is it?) of the "better" colors is far less than the disadvantage of the worse sharpness and readability!!!

This has nothing to do with AMOLED. The HTC Legend is also equipped with an AMOLED but without Pentile Matrix. (but it only has a low res of 320x480 Pixel)
Give me an AMOLED screen with high resolution and with a "real", native RGB subpixel pattern and I'm happy!
But if I have to choose between sweets-like colors and far better readability, I'll take a LCD!

 

[lcgreen]

LOL, if its not a problem why are so many buyers, forums and websites making such a big deal out of it? it is a BIG issue weather you want to admit to it or not.

And seriously, you talking about gaming on the android/samsung galaxy s lmao, the gaming scene is a joke on this platform, why have such a powerful gpu/cpu combo when there are NO games to show it off? none of the major companies/developers make games on android,

Compare games running on the galaxy s to the iphone 3gs (with its poor screen) and it still pis*es over the galaxy s, look at farm frenzy, nova, need for speed shift, doodle jump, settlers, the android versions look like basic java versions lol.

As a huge gamer this is also one reason why the samsung is going back and i'm getting an iphone 4, my 3gs is superb for gaming, so many superb games to play, the iphone 4 has a superb gpu/cpu and ram too and with the better screen is easily a match for the samsung galaxy s in terms of 3d graphics, it also has a MUCH better SDK for gaming.

Its a problem I agree- but you can't make up stuff to support it. None of the major sites are even mentioning this. Engadget, Gizmodo, Gsmarena, etcetc.
Its only in this forum dude. Calm down!


Advice- when you start buying a phone for games....you're doing it wrong.

That said- you are right when you mention there are no games to show off the dedicated gpu. But did you expect to play Crysis on your phone?

If you are a 'huge gamer' then stick with getting a PS3 or buying a gaming computer instead getting so emotional about gaming on a phone....

 

[jroc]

Bluebrain....thank you for this thread. I saw a comparison clip of the X and the Galaxy S a few weeks ago. I noticed the differences when looking at a street sign taken by both phones.

I feel a lil better knowing I wasnt seeing things...lol Here is the thread I noticed it in:

http://androidforums.com/motorola-droid-x/119365-droid-x-vs-samsung-galaxy-s.html#post1122124

 

[FK1983]

Its a problem I agree- but you can't make up stuff to support it. None of the major sites are even mentioning this. Engadget, Gizmodo, Gsmarena, etcetc.
Its only in this forum dude. Calm down!


Advice- when you start buying a phone for games....you're doing it wrong.

That said- you are right when you mention there are no games to show off the dedicated gpu. But did you expect to play Crysis on your phone?

If you are a 'huge gamer' then stick with getting a PS3 or buying a gaming computer instead getting so emotional about gaming on a phone....

I do have a 360, ps3, wii and gaming PC, I also use my mobile device for gaming as do millions and millions of other people, the iphone 3gs is a superb gaming device as figures show.

Just because your not into gaming on your device doesn't mean others aren't, did you know the iphone/touch market share recently overtook the sony psp marketshare for gaming? there you go....

 

[Evil Peter]

So: why not use it? Because of the AMOLED's vivid colors and the deep black?
Well, that's nice and as I mentioned before: a big plus if you mainly want to watch videos.
But we are talking about text readability here! And with that I give a shit on the bonbon-sweets-colors!
The advantage (is it?) of the "better" colors is far less than the disadvantage of the worse sharpness and readability!!!

A little tip; making your opinion in bold letters and with several exclamation marks does not make it more of a fact.

And better contrast and colors are important all the time as you are using a graphical UI, not a pure text based one. I get really annoyed by the crap black level on the other screens that I own, especially the one with only 800:1 contrast ratio (which happens to be what the iPhone 4 offers). No matter what I do with the screen, I can't make that problem disappear. If I want to increase the brightness the black level will get even worse. On the SAMOLED it will just enhance the non-black areas and make the effect of the black level even greater.

On the websites that get zoomed out to the point where I can't read I have yet to find one where it's not acceptable to do a minor zoom to get it into "reading distance", or if I choose to browse in landscape mode. Is that perfect? Of course not. Is the readability a problem I can do something about? Apparently yes. Therefor I prefer the SAMOLED (as have several reviewers so I'm not unique). If someone makes the other choice he's free to buy a different phone.

This should display how it's actually a matter of opinion and it's nicer to express an opinion as just that instead of as a fact. Personally I hope I never have to buy a backlit screen again.

 

[Lee Mac]

Colors are way too exaggerated on the Galaxy S. I bought a Samsung Captivate to see if I could get used to using it, and can't stand it. There is just nothing better about this screen than the other phones out right now with a high resolution LCD, aside from maybe battery usage.

I'm glad to hear someone describe it as mesh. I had been trying to find a better word to use to describe it, and that is exactly what I feel like. I'm looking through mesh to do anything.

 

[Markiz]

ok, this has gone really out of proportion. And the reason for it is this new stunt apple pulled with PPI.

I do not own galaxy s, nor have i seen it in person yet, but i can say this:
i read the whole "confederation trilogy" (2500+ pages) by Hamilton on my old 2.4 320x240 nokia n73 in 3 weeks. Even with pentile, galaxy s resolution would still be more than double to that on n73. so i can not even imagine what all the fuss is about.

Those that are really stuck on this PPI thing and REALLY NEED to be able to read miniature text without zooming, just buy yourself droid/milestone or whatever and stop complaining. on the other hand, if you want a screen with the best multimedia experience, buy galaxy. and thats it. no phone is perfect, you just have to weigh pros and cons and decide which one is for you. nobody is forcing you to buy this phone.

also, since this will be my next phone, i too would love if they didn't use pentile, but it's definetely not something of great importance to me.

 

[YellowGT0]

Ugh. Already a thread on this, but this is what the screen looks like at normal viewing distance.

Yeah if you get close enough to any screen you will see pixals. Get super close to your HDTV. But when you use it like it was designed it looks fine.

 

[Lee Mac]

ok, this has gone really out of proportion. And the reason for it is this new stunt apple pulled with PPI.

I do not own galaxy s, nor have i seen it in person yet, but i can say this:
i read the whole "confederation trilogy" (2500+ pages) by Hamilton on my old 2.4 320x240 nokia n73 in 3 weeks. Even with pentile, galaxy s resolution would still be more than double to that on n73. so i can not even imagine what all the fuss is about.

Those that are really stuck on this PPI thing and REALLY NEED to be able to read miniature text without zooming, just buy yourself droid/milestone or whatever and stop complaining. on the other hand, if you want a screen with the best multimedia experience, buy galaxy. and thats it. no phone is perfect, you just have to weigh pros and cons and decide which one is for you. nobody is forcing you to buy this phone.

also, since this will be my next phone, i too would love if they didn't use pentile, but it's definetely not something of great importance to me.

It's nothing to do with PPI. Compare the Galaxy S to any phone with the exact same resolution -- even a phone with a BIGGER screen looks better. While I believe it might be true that at a higher resolution PenTile might look fine, it is the technology that is the problem, not the PPI.

Using the Galaxy S is like watching a HDTV through a mesh screen. Even my 56 year old mother could see it, and I know her eyesight isn't as good as mine.

 

[galaxyS]

LOL, if its not a problem why are so many buyers, forums and websites making such a big deal out of it? it is a BIG issue weather you want to admit to it or not.

And seriously, you talking about gaming on the android/samsung galaxy s lmao, the gaming scene is a joke on this platform, why have such a powerful gpu/cpu combo when there are NO games to show it off? none of the major companies/developers make games on android,

Compare games running on the galaxy s to the iphone 3gs (with its poor screen) and it still pis*es over the galaxy s, look at farm frenzy, nova, need for speed shift, doodle jump, settlers, the android versions look like basic java versions lol.

As a huge gamer this is also one reason why the samsung is going back and i'm getting an iphone 4, my 3gs is superb for gaming, so many superb games to play, the iphone 4 has a superb gpu/cpu and ram too and with the better screen is easily a match for the samsung galaxy s in terms of 3d graphics, it also has a MUCH better SDK for gaming.

YouTube - Gaming on HTC Desire & Samsung Galaxy S
YouTube - ???S vs HTC Desire 3D ?? ??, Galaxy S
YouTube - ???S 3D?? NOVA,Galaxy S Nova 3D game!

can other phones run these games just as smooth?

maybe the iphone is much better for gaming, i wouldnt know coz i dont have an iphone..

 

[galaxyS]

LOL, if its not a problem why are so many buyers, forums and websites making such a big deal out of it? it is a BIG issue weather you want to admit to it or not..

which websites mentioned this again? i would like to read it..

 

[galaxyS]

Yes, the Galaxy-S is fine compared to a iPhone 3/G/S
It's also fine compared to a G1.
And it's also fine compared to any old Nokia or Sony Ericsson.

BUT IT's DEFINITELY NOT FINE compared to any other high-res phone!!!

Compare it with the Milestone/Droid, compare it with the iPhone 4, compare it with the EVO 4G, HTC HD2/Leo or the Droid-X, and you will clearly see the difference!



If you don't get it, I'll try to help:
Would you read a book with some kind of masking sheet over the pages where you have to move it around all the time to read the page?
Or do you prefer to see the entire page?

This is the same on the phone.
On the Milestone I was able to read a website fully zoomed out in portrait view. I can hold it in one hand and only hat to scroll down with my thumb.

On the Galaxy-S I have to zoom in and out, scroll left and right and up and down. That's frustrating!

The point that makes me angry is, that it's a step backwards! The technology is here, it's cheap and other devices use it: LCD TFT (or even Sony's Super-LCD)

So: why not use it? Because of the AMOLED's vivid colors and the deep black?
Well, that's nice and as I mentioned before: a big plus if you mainly want to watch videos.
But we are talking about text readability here! And with that I give a shit on the bonbon-sweets-colors!
The advantage (is it?) of the "better" colors is far less than the disadvantage of the worse sharpness and readability!!!

This has nothing to do with AMOLED. The HTC Legend is also equipped with an AMOLED but without Pentile Matrix. (but it only has a low res of 320x480 Pixel)
Give me an AMOLED screen with high resolution and with a "real", native RGB subpixel pattern and I'm happy!
But if I have to choose between sweets-like colors and far better readability, I'll take a LCD!

i onyl have 2 words for you..

personal preference!

but i see what you're talking about, it is a little harder to read the texts on zoomed out view in portrait mode, but on landscape it is fine!

i like the colors on the galaxy S especially the "real" black on the galaxy s.. so ya i'd choose it over the pale colors and soft black of other screens..

no phone is perfect after all..

 

[jroc]

YouTube - Gaming on HTC Desire & Samsung Galaxy S
YouTube - ???S vs HTC Desire 3D ?? ??, Galaxy S
YouTube - ???S 3D?? NOVA,Galaxy S Nova 3D game!

can other phones run these games just as smooth?

maybe the iphone is much better for gaming, i wouldnt know coz i dont have an iphone..

I doubt it. The iPhone would probably be 2nd followed by the X. I think these Samsung phones have the best gpu out right now.

Althought the iPhone 4 uses that gyroscope....the Samsungs use something close, but its not the same.

 

[iPenguin]

While I'm not in love with the Pentile Matrix, it really isn't as much as a problem *for me*. I use my phone mostly for media and web browsing. Sure text when I'm surfing looks a little sub-par, but I don't find it too horrible, and the gains I get watching movies on such a vibrant/bright display makes it more than worth it for me. Plus it's 4 inches, which I find quite preferable to 4.3 Different strokes for different folks, and this happens to be mine.

 

[Eazail70x7]

As a heavy user of a 480 x 320 Amoled display, i have to say that I will be pleased with the Epic 4g display. My sister has a Hero and way before I hears of pentile, I recognized that the Hero screen was slightly sharper but nothing drastic.

If its the same difference at 800 x 480 from lcd that I seen between the Moment and Hero, Im not gonna be too worried.

Is it just me or has all the geeks gone pixel crazy ever since we learned of the 960 x 640 res display?? Is it me??

 

[iPenguin]

As a heavy user of a 480 x 320 Amoled display, i have to say that I will be pleased with the Epic 4g display. My sister has a Hero and way before I hears of pentile, I recognized that the Hero screen was slightly sharper but nothing drastic.

If its the same difference at 800 x 480 from lcd that I seen between the Moment and Hero, Im not gonna be too worried.

Is it just me or has all the geeks gone pixel crazy ever since we learned of the 960 x 640 res display?? Is it me??

Completely agreed. While it isn't the BEST as far as sharpness, it "badness" it definitely overblown.

And I would agree with you, but... heh, I'm afraid of being stabbed in my sleep. ATT store right down the street...

 

[ghdtpdna]

As a heavy user of a 480 x 320 Amoled display, i have to say that I will be pleased with the Epic 4g display. My sister has a Hero and way before I hears of pentile, I recognized that the Hero screen was slightly sharper but nothing drastic.

If its the same difference at 800 x 480 from lcd that I seen between the Moment and Hero, Im not gonna be too worried.

Is it just me or has all the geeks gone pixel crazy ever since we learned of the 960 x 640 res display?? Is it me??

Is there any reason you are getting epic 4g vs other sgs phones?
Is it mainly because you are on Spring?
I am asking because I wanted to see how many people who have used 3.5+ inch screen with multitouch screen keyboard would ever consider buying a phone with a hardware keyboard also with 3.5+inch screen.

 

[Lee Mac]

As a heavy user of a 480 x 320 Amoled display, i have to say that I will be pleased with the Epic 4g display. My sister has a Hero and way before I hears of pentile, I recognized that the Hero screen was slightly sharper but nothing drastic.

If its the same difference at 800 x 480 from lcd that I seen between the Moment and Hero, Im not gonna be too worried.

Is it just me or has all the geeks gone pixel crazy ever since we learned of the 960 x 640 res display?? Is it me??

I guess you'll just have to decide for yourself if you like the screen, after using it. As for me, I found it so annoying that I returned the phone 5 hours after buying it. Some people's vision may be a little better than others, but it was something that I could always see on the screen. It's a texture that permeates the screen for everything you do, whether that be reading text, looking at pictures, or watching movies. I could see the pixels that make up a letter. A solid white background on a web page looked grey because of it. It isn't just an issue with text, and it isn't just an issue that requires looking through a microscope to see. At 12 inches away it was very obvious. I didn't find it acceptable. I had an EVO for a few weeks, and I couldn't see pixels on it even if I put it up to my face. I also thought the AMOLED exaggerated the colors, making them look unnatural and over saturated. In other words, it just didn't look as good as what it's being advertised to be.

 

[Bluebrain]

@Lee Mac
What happened to your EVO?

 

[Lee Mac]

@Lee Mac
What happened to your EVO?

I didn't like HTC Sense, felt that it was too big, and had glass separation and light leakage. I exchanged it and had the same problem with the replacement, so I took it back and decided to wait for the Galaxy S. I loved the screen, though.

 

[r@nd0m]

I have had my Galaxy S for almost a week now and have not come across this mesh effect or pixelation of text. I have seen the mesh effect in photos taken of the phone but it is like when you take a photo of a TV or computer screen...

I went to a website and zoomed all the way in and the lettering was fine.

I don't see what the problem is, but I think the screen is fine. I am not upto date with PenTile or Non-PenTile screens but to me it looks pretty good...

 

[FK1983]

YouTube - Gaming on HTC Desire & Samsung Galaxy S
YouTube - ???S vs HTC Desire 3D ?? ??, Galaxy S
YouTube - ???S 3D?? NOVA,Galaxy S Nova 3D game!

can other phones run these games just as smooth?

maybe the iphone is much better for gaming, i wouldnt know coz i dont have an iphone..

This was the exact reason I got the Galaxy S in the first place! it has a superb CPU/GPU combo and it has the potential to be a superb gaming device but at the moment that will never happen due to the limited developer support and basic SDK for the android OS.

Basically the OS is holding this phone back, it could also be because android is still quite new, once it settles in and people get used to making games for it the story may be better.


And yeah, the Samsung is MUCH more powerful than the iphone 3gs even though the 3gs is still the better gaming device due to the huge selection of games (think psp vs ds), the iphone 4 more than matches the samsung in all areas except the gpu, the samsung gpu is still more powerful than the iphones 4's A4 chip on paper.

I think gaming on android will be huge in 2011 but by then the Samsung will be old in terms of specs and won't be able to run the newest games. theres already talk of the galaxy 2 lol.

 

[Evil Peter]

And yeah, the Samsung is MUCH more powerful than the iphone 3gs even though the 3gs is still the better gaming device due to the huge selection of games (think psp vs ds), the iphone 4 more than matches the samsung in all areas except the gpu, the samsung gpu is still more powerful than the iphones 4's A4 chip on paper.

I think gaming on android will be huge in 2011 but by then the Samsung will be old in terms of specs and won't be able to run the newest games. theres already talk of the galaxy 2 lol.

There's more things it's behind on when going by technical reports (as Apple is poor on delivering detailed specs). For example the iPhone 4 CPU is said to be downclocked to 800MHz, which makes it worse than the Hummingbird.

Given that all other phones currently have last year's GPU-model there's nothing to believe that the SGS will be too old next year. That makes no sense at all as there isn't even a stronger model around and the phones that are in development seem to be fitted with the same GPU as the SGS. Or do you expect the game developers to create far more complex games than they do for iPhone so pretty much all but the odd Android model are unable to run it?

Rumors about the next phones are always on the go. Note that the rumors abaout the SGS2 does not include a different GPU than the SGS.

As for games on the iPhone it wouldn't surprise me if 3GS could run better than the iPhone 4 since they didn't improve the GPU much and now they have 4 times as many pixels to draw.

 

[lcgreen]

I do have a 360, ps3, wii and gaming PC, I also use my mobile device for gaming as do millions and millions of other people, the iphone 3gs is a superb gaming device as figures show.

Just because your not into gaming on your device doesn't mean others aren't, did you know the iphone/touch market share recently overtook the sony psp marketshare for gaming? there you go....

If you have so many expensive and 'actual' gaming systems then stop whining so much about gaming on a phone. 'nuff said.

btw- I never mentioned about my preferences of gaming on a phone but I just wanted to tell you you shouldn't make up stats to support your arguments...


There are also opinions around the thread conflicting on how the pentile screen looks so I guess no-one is right or wrong but surely to show off the screen, you don't need games. Play a movie on it jeez- something like FFVII: Advent Children Complete will do nicely. Or other movies can do really. The SGS can handle 720p videos beyond the mp4 format. -Something that the iPhone 4 still can't do-

Heres one for you, FK1983; I have no doubt more people watch movies than play games. Theres a TV in pretty much every household but I doubt there's even a PC in every household. Let alone a PS3.

(Also- If you compare sales between phones which pretty much everyone from teenagers onwards should have- to gaming devices which only select people are gamers who can afford one have..... I have no doubt the phone will win.)

 

[Markiz]

Ok, so here you go:
YouTube - iPhone 4 Retina Display vs Samsung Captivate Super AMOLED

there is no much real life difference between samoled and retina. this guy is an iphone owner, but his videos have always been unbiased, and at 720P, both screens look to be pretty much equally usable.