The KitKat Upgrade: what i have noticed

[nickdalzell]

when my S4 got botched up by my attempt at rooting in order to block the KitKat OTA from installing onto it (i expected it to turn into the iOS 7-inspired UI seen in the Galaxy S5--did not want) i had to replace it. given that i am eligible for Verizon EDGE, i got the Note 3--a phone i wanted for a long time. Of course, the model in the Verizon store had already had KitKat pre-installed onto it. after playing around for a bit, here's some of what i have noticed:

1. The white status bar icons--these are an annoyance, and super-bright on an AMOLED screen, so they might take getting used to. it sort of breaks the whole organic, earthy Nature UX look i have come to know and love, but can be ignored after awhile. the only thing i do wish is that it didn't make the email notifications change. before i had little logos to tell me which account the notification came from--i use Samsung's email client because of the UI and the multi-account support and custom sync scheduling, so i would get a little envelope with a 'Y!' icon for an email belonging to my Yahoo! account, one with a stylized 'M' icon for a Gmail message, and so on. now, it's just replaced with three redundant generic email icons with just a '@' in them, much like the same notification used in earlier versions of TouchWiz Nature UX. it has sort of gone back to the 4.1.2 style notification icon seen in the Galaxy Tab and Galaxy S3.

2. the app drawer has a bit more 3-D polish to the icons, again, taking cues from the earlier version (based on Android 4.1.2) of Nature UX seen in the Galaxy S3, Galaxy Tab and first Galaxy Note tablets. in a way i prefer it, as i did not take well to the more flattened icons in the 4.3 version, so this is a welcome throwback.

3. the UI is otherwise left alone. the Samsung Music app is just as polished as it was, the UI has buttons that still look like buttons, and Nature UX with exception of the colorless icons up top is left alone. Again, i prefer this

4. Battery life and signal seem improved, although the latter might be why the former is improved. i now get one or two bars and a 3G/1X data connection where i would normally have no signal at all. not a major difference but still, welcome. i never factory reset and yet nothing is amiss.

5. the icons, grid, and lock screen fonts are a bit better, smaller and fit the screen better. in 4.3 as seen from the S4, the icons were huge, oversized and only fit so well in the grid with tons of empty space between. this was ok if you often hit the wrong icon sitting next to the one you wanted, and this did happen often, but on a Note's screen this would be too much. so the fit to resolution is nice, too.

6. no ART support. in my view this is what really makes KitKat, KitKat. without it's just a version number jump. i have run KitKat custom ROMs on the S3 before (but always went back to stock as i never was too fond of basic Android) so i know it's doable, and the Nexus 5 has it, so this makes device #3 that never got it, even within Developer Options. a bit disappointing, and sad since even the Nexus tablets missed it.

In the end, aside the uber-bright hideous white icons (they are indeed loud) the upgrade feels more like a simple service pack than an upgrade. i for one am glad it did not put that hideous pastel UI that is seen in the newer Samsung products (Galaxy Tab 4, Note and Tab Pro, Galaxy S5) and can only hope that Samsung realizes that won't work and reverts before they do usher it into the Note 3 and earlier models.

I checked some demos of the iPads just to see if Jony Ive ever realized that iOS 7 was a mistake. i was quite surprised he had toned the flatness down. iBooks now reverts to the wooden bookshelves, the home screen icons have a bit more 3-D to them, even though stock icons are as flat as they have been, the 'frosted glass' has been eliminated, the stock Notes app now has a slight faux white leather texture albeit subdued, the icons in apps are no longer purple but green/orange, and other apps have skeuomorphic elements. that Air had version 7.1.1 installed, which is a few higher than my previous iPad 3, so if this indicates anything, Samsung might add in some of the 3-D to follow suit before long. here's to that, since i would hate to give up all my Samsung products for LG products.

 

[Rukbat]

You're mostly noticing the UI changes. The big change to me is the inability to root. (And the earlier inability to install custom ROMS and recoveries.) IOW - Samsung is moving from an open philosophy to a "whatever corporate America wants" philosophy. Add LG's dropping external storage, and there are few top-of-the-line phones worth owning any more.

Maybe we'll see some Chinese companies coming out with fully open Linux phones in the future. But Kit Kat? I agree - it's a point update. It should have been 4.3.1.

 

[nickdalzell]

it isn't Samsung, it's Google. apparently the white icons and lack of SD Card support is Google's rules, not Samsung's. Samsung was forced by Google to change. that does indeed leave the aftertaste of apples in my mouth.

since rooting became moot when i got devices i was happy with out of the box i try to avoid it. it has always caused other issues and never truly fixed anything. at one time i had such crappy Android phones that rooting became necessary to make it work better, give me external storage to use as internal storage (SD-ext) or force only a few apps to load up on boot, because the device had insufficient RAM and it kept redrawing the launcher or lagging if i installed tons of stuff.

with the Note 3, previous S4, and S3 before it, rooting became a non-issue. i really like Nature UX, and never could stick with a Custom ROM without missing the features.

 

[mikedt]

I'm sure a lot of this is more down to what Samsung wants, rather than Google or anyone else. Samsung are becoming much more like Apple these days I think, securely locking things down, their own app ecosystem, their own things replacing AOSP or Google stuff, playing the luxury products game.

I've never had any issue with rooting, and I very much have to root everything here to make them usable and suitable, to remove the unnecessary bloat and install the Google apps I need. Same with computers, I would never want to own a PC if I didn't have admin or root access.

 

[nickdalzell]

another thing i noticed. the 'light effect' has also reverted to the much-older 'ripple' effect seen in the Galaxy S3, even down to the little 'plik!' when you turn the screen off. seems dated but i neither like nor hate, but was rather enjoying the light effect.

in my view Samsung offered far more choices in their own apps than either AOSP or Google ever did. their music player has voice control which is wonderful in the car or when you dont want to pull the phone out of your pocket in order to pause a song, it even changes volume by voice.

their email app has custom sync scheduling, whereas AOSP/Google only has sync or no sync. the latter only allows a setting to sync every four hours at most, but lacks peak/off-peak scheduling entirely.

Samsung's messaging app allows custom backgrounds, custom bubble colors. with AOSP/Google it is their way or nothing.

Samsung products have a UI i prefer over the crap PS/2-era flat design that took over AOSP/Google.

 

[Rukbat]

since rooting became moot when i got devices i was happy with out of the box i try to avoid it. it has always caused other issues and never truly fixed anything.

Rooting isn't supposed to fix anything, but adding su shouldn't cause problems either. (Running a one click root program might - who knows what those programs do?)

But if you want full access to the filesystem, a different boot animation, or just want Linux to work as Linux, no matter whether it's the Ubuntu distro or the Android distro, you need su, and access to it. And that means an exploit to get temporary root, so you can install it. And a superuser app if you want your apps to be able to use it (although I mainly use it from the CL).

Once you do that of course, you get to use things like TiBU and other programs that need root.

I'd also like to try other ROMs (you can't run anything but a modified Samsung ROM even in 4.3) and be able to keep the kernel up to date. You don't replace a phone like this every 6 months.

 

[nickdalzell]

rooting indeed does not cause problems on its own. what you do with it, however, can. hence why Linux these days blocks root logins. tripping an efuse in Knox can cause problems.

i have tried other ROMs, some to upgrade a device that Google refused to support. others to see the way 'stock' Android works. some to make it feel more like the iPhone i came from. some to toggle things left and right. in the end, Samsung and their UI plus the extra features, extra settings in their apps, their far more reliable (imo) alternatives to Google Play got my business. they are perfect for iOS converts and make great products. for the longest time i wanted something like an iPhone, but with infinite customizations. choices. freedoms. but i did not want something that had to be reconfigured for hours to achieve that. i wanted one device that gave me those freedoms but with a setup i could be happy with out of the box. and that is Samsung Galaxy.

 

[AnonGuy]

I'm sure a lot of this is more down to what Samsung wants, rather than Google or anyone else. Samsung are becoming much more like Apple these days I think, securely locking things down, their own app ecosystem, their own things replacing AOSP or Google stuff, playing the luxury products game.

I've never had any issue with rooting, and I very much have to root everything here to make them usable and suitable, to remove the unnecessary bloat and install the Google apps I need. Same with computers, I would never want to own a PC if I didn't have admin or root access.

Rooting is not necessary to make these devices usable, at all. Not sure why such strong language is merited, Lol...

Suitable? Maybe, that's subjectively based on what you prefer.

Usable. No. They're perfectly usable out of the box.

 

[AnonGuy]

another thing i noticed. the 'light effect' has also reverted to the much-older 'ripple' effect seen in the Galaxy S3, even down to the little 'plik!' when you turn the screen off. seems dated but i neither like nor hate, but was rather enjoying the light effect.

in my view Samsung offered far more choices in their own apps than either AOSP or Google ever did. their music player has voice control which is wonderful in the car or when you dont want to pull the phone out of your pocket in order to pause a song, it even changes volume by voice.

their email app has custom sync scheduling, whereas AOSP/Google only has sync or no sync. the latter only allows a setting to sync every four hours at most, but lacks peak/off-peak scheduling entirely.

Samsung's messaging app allows custom backgrounds, custom bubble colors. with AOSP/Google it is their way or nothing.

Samsung products have a UI i prefer over the crap PS/2-era flat design that took over AOSP/Google.

Samsung TouchWiz has a lot of benefits over Stock Android.

Samsung has an API for Badge Notifications that developers are now putting to use. This is something the iPhone has been doing for *years* which is still missing from Stock Android devices. People have been asking Google to implement this for like... half a decade?

Facebook, Facebook Messenger, Twitter, etc. all give Badge Icon Overlays on Samsung TouchWiz devices now. Gmail, Hangouts, Drive, whatever... Nope, none, nada.

The Stock Messaging app now allows you to set a different font size without keeping the Volume Rocker Font Size adjustment locked on, which is a great usability improvement.

A lot of the Samsung replacement apps (Messaging, Gallery, Email, Internet, Camera, Calendar, Voice Recorder, Music/Video Player) are clearly better than their stock counterparts.

Choosing between Stock and TouchWiz for me is merely a measure of whether or not I want to worry about finding and installing a ton of replacement apps that are as quality as the apps Samsung bakes into their Android devices and then worry about keeping them up to date (and hopefully the develop doesn't abandon them!).

There is too much value in TouchWiz to root the device and rip it out to use something as anti-climatic as a Google Now Launcher, or downgrade to crappy Google Apps when the Samsung apps are clearly better.

Some people do not like Samsung's Aesthetic, and that's a completely valid reason to not like TouchWiz. But I don't mind it. The benefits far outweigh the deficits, and anything I don't need, I am free to either toggle/turn off or disable.

 

[AnonGuy]

rooting indeed does not cause problems on its own. what you do with it, however, can. hence why Linux these days blocks root logins. tripping an efuse in Knox can cause problems.

i have tried other ROMs, some to upgrade a device that Google refused to support. others to see the way 'stock' Android works. some to make it feel more like the iPhone i came from. some to toggle things left and right. in the end, Samsung and their UI plus the extra features, extra settings in their apps, their far more reliable (imo) alternatives to Google Play got my business. they are perfect for iOS converts and make great products. for the longest time i wanted something like an iPhone, but with infinite customizations. choices. freedoms. but i did not want something that had to be reconfigured for hours to achieve that. i wanted one device that gave me those freedoms but with a setup i could be happy with out of the box. and that is Samsung Galaxy.

I agree with this. A lot of what Samsung does on their phones and with TouchWiz is designed to get people to come, stay, and bring their friends with them. They are everything to everyone, and that has worked well for them. Now that their devices have hit critical mass for proliferation, it's a self-driving machine of adoption so they don't really have to copy as much as they used to. Especially from iOS devices - though they have tapered that off quite a bit in the last couple of years (due to lawsuits).

The Galaxy S Vibrant was my first Samsung handset (apart from a Windows Mobile device) and one of the biggest reasons why I got it was cause it looked like an iPhone but didn't require me to switch carriers to get one. It always made me laugh when Samsung defenders said no one would buy that phone cause it looked like an iPhone, cause that's exactly what drove me to pick it up in the first place (that and the screen, SAMOLED was pretty Pr0 back then with almost every LCD being a POS).

In the end, it doesn't even matter. Stock vs. Android Skins are as religious a topic as the OEM or Smartphone OS wars and you aren't going to convince anyone that TouchWiz is any less crappy than they keep saying it is. Instead, they will continue to tell you how they can't use a Samsung Phone cause they're locked down and they need root access to make them "usable."

Good points, but not going to convince those that "disagree."

 

[mikedt]

Rooting is not necessary to make these devices usable, at all. Not sure why such strong language is merited, Lol...

Suitable? Maybe, that's subjectively based on what you prefer.

Usable. No. They're perfectly usable out of the box.

You do know that Android devices sold in mainland China don't come with Google apps and services? They usually come with a plethora of other stuff like Baidu, Tencent, Weibo, Renren, Taobao, Keke etc.

By "usable" I meant that I wish my Android phone to make full use of Google and not Baidu, e.g. Google Play, Google Calendar, Google Contacts, YouTube. And rooting is a must if I wish to have any of these Google apps or services.

Samsung voids the warranty on their phones now if they've been rooted or the Samsung pre-installed software has been otherwise tampered with. They have non-resetable e-fuses that trip, well that's no good to me whatsoever.

Although I do live in China, I'm not actually Chinese, I'm British, an expat.

 

[AnonGuy]

You do know that Android devices sold in mainland China don't come with Google apps and services? They usually come with a plethora of other stuff like Baidu, Tencent, Weibo, Renren, Taobao, Keke etc.

By "usable" I meant that I wish my Android phone to make full use of Google and not Baidu, e.g. Google Play, Google Calendar, Google Contacts, YouTube. And rooting is a must if I wish to have any of these Google apps or services.

Samsung voids the warranty on their phones now if they've been rooted or the Samsung pre-installed software has been otherwise tampered with. They have non-resetable e-fuses that trip, well that's no good to me whatsoever.

Although I do live in China, I'm not actually Chinese, I'm British, an expat.

Where you are living wasn't made clear in the post I quoted and it wasn't obvious at all.

The phones are still usable without Google apps. Many of which I have disabled on my phone cause I use Microsoft services myself. My phone is still perfectly usable.

Usability and suitability aren't the same but you're talking like they're interchangeable. That was my point and really the only part I'm interested in discussing.

Don't care how Samsung locks their phones down, personally, as it doesn't affect me one bit. OEMs do not produce phones expecting users to tamper with them in untested ways, and are within their rights to prevent it.

Also the standard for business and government use is higher and they do target their devices at those markets.

 

[mikedt]

In the end, it doesn't even matter. Stock vs. Android Skins are as religious a topic as the OEM or Smartphone OS wars and you aren't going to convince anyone that TouchWiz is any less crappy than they keep saying it is. Instead, they will continue to tell you how they can't use a Samsung Phone cause they're locked down and they need root access to make them "usable."

It is about "usability" on this forum sometimes, and something that is a FAQ about Android devices. We very often get posts that might go, "Help! I bought this phone and it doesn't have Google Play on it."

 

[AnonGuy]

It is about "usability" on this forum sometimes, and something that is a FAQ about Android devices. We very often get posts that might go, "Help! I bought this phone and it doesn't have Google Play on it."

Missing the point.

I'm talking about back to back exchanges on what is better or preferable. Read the posts and you'll see what I'm talking about.

Me telling you Google apps aren't all that great won't convince you that you shouldn't care that you can't easily get them or that they're bad. It's a waste of energy to argue the merits of TouchWiz, Samsung, skins vs stock with people who clearly have made up their mind and only are interested in putting their firm opinions forward.

It's the common source of discussions that quickly get out of hand on forums (not saying this one would) and usually you just end up repeating yourself a lot anyways... cause people often don't tend to "listen well" on forums.

 

[mikedt]

Where you are living wasn't made clear in the post I quoted and it wasn't obvious at all.

It should be visible next to every post I make, location: "Xilinhot, China", carrier: "China Mobile, China Unicom". I see your carrier is "Verizon Wireless", so that gives me an idea where you are.

Knowing location and sometimes carrier can be important when replying to posts sometimes, especially with problem solving threads. That's why AF has this feature. :thumbup:

The phones are still usable without Google apps. Many of which I have disabled on my phone cause I use Microsoft services myself. My phone is still perfectly usable.

Usability and suitability aren't the same but you're talking like they're interchangeable. That was my point and really the only part I'm interested in discussing.

Don't care how Samsung locks their phones down, personally, as it doesn't affect me one bit. OEMs do not produce phones expecting users to tamper with them in untested ways, and are within their rights to prevent it.

Oh yes they do. Oppo, Xiaomi, Meizu, OnePlus, And all these OEMs actually encourage and supports users to modify and install their own ROMs on their phones. Guess which OEMs might get my future custom and those which may not.

Thing is a modern smart-phone is more than just a phone IMO. it is a computer. Like I would never buy a PC where the manufacturer locked it down so I could only use Windows, and whatever pre-installed software they told me I could use.

I have my own views about Microsoft. I won't go into reasons here because this is not the Politics & Current Affairs forum. I only use Bing for search sometimes, and that's it.

EDIT:

BTW the phone I've got now, Oppo Find 7a, I've completely changed the ROM over to Gummy. The F7a is a nice device, however the OEM version of Android (ColorOS) it comes with is dreadful. and really is unusable because of bugs, the calendar is broken for a start. However Oppo does encourage their users to use different software through their own support forums. Samsung certainly doesn't do that.

 

[AnonGuy]

It should be visible next to every post I make, location: "Xilinhot, China", carrier: "China Mobile, China Unicom". I see your carrier is "Verizon Wireless", so that gives me an idea where you are.

Knowing location and sometimes carrier can be important when replying to posts sometimes, especially with problem solving threads. That's why AF has this feature. :thumbup:



Oh yes they do. Oppo, Xiaomi, Meizu, OnePlus, And all these OEMs actually encourage and supports users to modify and install their own ROMs on their phones. Guess which OEMs might get my future custom and those which may not.

Thing is a modern smart-phone is more than just a phone IMO. it is a computer. Like I would never buy a PC where the manufacturer locked it down so I could only use Windows, and whatever pre-installed software they told me I could use.

I have my own views about Microsoft. I won't go into reasons here because this is not the Politics & Current Affairs forum. I only use Bing for search sometimes, and that's it.

EDIT:

BTW the phone I've got now, Oppo Find 7a, I've completely changed the ROM over to Gummy. The F7a is a nice device, however the OEM version of Android (ColorOS) it comes with is dreadful. and really is unusable because of bugs, the calendar is broken for a start. However Oppo does encourage their users to use different software through their own support forums. Samsung certainly doesn't do that.

I was simply using a general statement in reference to OEMs like Samsung et al who do not support third party software on their phones.

Send an HTC phone with a CM on it to them for servicing and see what they tell you.

There is too much redundancy in Google Apps, a lot of them are Huge, and their Book Store is worthless while their music store is terrible compared to Amazon or Xbox especially for genres like classical and Opera. The Microsoft services work better with desktop operating syatems, and encumbered by a social network, and work better across more mobile operating systems (I'm a huge proponent of platform mobility).

Reasons for choosing them are technical not based on some fallible political rationale

If there are technical reasons for not liking Microsoft services I'd certainly want to know, as they may be important and I may have overlooked them. I don't let politics and ideology govern my use of technology. I find that hurts more than it helps.

 

[mikedt]

I was simply using a general statement in reference to OEMs like Samsung et al who do not support third party software on their phones.

Send an HTC phone with a CM on it to them for servicing and see what they tell you.

There is too much redundancy in Google Apps, a lot of them are Huge, and their Book Store is worthless while their music store is terrible compared to Amazon or Xbox especially for genres like classical and Opera. The Microsoft services work better with desktop operating syatems, and encumbered by a social network, and work better across more mobile operating systems (I'm a huge proponent of platform mobility).

Reasons for choosing them are technical not based on some fallible political rationale

When you're living in a one party communist state, things can become very political, believe me. The very reason why Androids in China don't have Google apps and services, and that YouTube, Google+, Google Docs, Google Drive, are blocked and censored, is purely political.

A few years ago, Google was right on the edge of pulling out of the PRC completely, and closing google.cn. Even now they only operate a minimal presence here. No search, because they refuse to comply with PRC internet laws. Search is redirected to Google Hong Kong, which is not mainland and is often blocked.

If there are technical reasons for not liking Microsoft services I'd certainly want to know, as they may be important and I may have overlooked them. I don't let politics and ideology govern my use of technology. I find that hurts more than it helps.

You can read all about my politics, ideology and uses of technology in this lengthy thread if you want... ...it does help me I find, really to stay safe and have peace of mind.
http://androidforums.com/computers/628602-windows-8-a-5.html

"A PRC edition of Windows 8 .... hmmmm...I bet that's got government back-doors and censoring, like with PRC edition of Skype. Think I'll be sticking with Linux(non-Chinese) for the moment.

EDIT.

This might have been why I couldn't activate the regular Windows 8 I had, and had to basically pretend I was in the UK. Microsoft wants to ensure everyone here is using the special PRC edition to keep the government happy, I guess. That's what MS does with Skype. "

Basically I chose to use Google rather than Microsoft or Baidu, because I don't want the Communist Party of China to have complete access to everything I do.

I'm even using a secure VPN into San Diego, USA to make this post.

 

[AnonGuy]

Not interested in that.

There has never been any proof or even strong speculation that Microsoft has back doors in Outlook.com in any country, or the Windows operating system.

I wanted to know technical reasons for choosing google, not conspiracy theories. I'm not invested in what you use. I was only flabbergasted by the off the cuff comment you made when I mentioned what I used.

 

[Rxpert83]

So... what was the topic of this thread again?

 

[nickdalzell]

hey at least this time i didnt end up causing the thread drift.

sadly, with my tablet, the kitkat upgrade did something to Play Movies, that was never mentioned in the changelog. i can no longer play any downloaded movies/tv shows i bought on my Samsung TV even with Chromecast. i get this messsge.



sucks as my internet connection is too unstable to play them now. i guess i am stuck viewing them on my tiny 10" screen despite having a perfectly good 32" TV in the room. thanks, Google.

 

[AnonGuy]

hey at least this time i didnt end up causing the thread drift.

sadly, with my tablet, the kitkat upgrade did something to Play Movies, that was never mentioned in the changelog. i can no longer play any downloaded movies/tv shows i bought on my Samsung TV even with Chromecast. i get this messsge.



sucks as my internet connection is too unstable to play them now. i guess i am stuck viewing them on my tiny 10" screen despite having a perfectly good 32" TV in the room. thanks, Google.

Samsung has a fix for this that's pretty easy. I seen them give it to some people in Play Store review replies. I forget which app it was under (maybe Samsung Music or Samsung Hub), but it seems like it was working for people.

 

[nickdalzell]

i just tried to update Allshare, Play Movies, restarted my device, cleared data and unpinned everything and repinned, still getting the same message. i pin movies and streamed to my TV to avoid internet connection problems. it appears Google took this option away unless you stream from their servers.

so far it seems i only get this message from Google Play Movies. any saved MP4 videos i can play with Samsung's videos app work fine. but Google Play Movies only play through Google's app where this limit seems to show up.

 

[mikedt]

Not interested in that.

There has never been any proof or even strong speculation that Microsoft has back doors in Outlook.com in any country, or the Windows operating system.

I assume you've never come across called "Windows XP Professional Ghost Edition with Qihoo." ...which is the most requently used version of Windows in this country. Many new PCs still come with it, and I do NOT want anything to do with it at all. PRC government definitely has backdoors into something called Tom Skype, which is a special version that Microsoft redirects anyone with an Chinese IP address to when visiting Skype.com

I wanted to know technical reasons for choosing google, not conspiracy theories. I'm not invested in what you use. I was only flabbergasted by the off the cuff comment you made when I mentioned what I used.

Not conspiracy theories I think:
Microsoft Windows - Microsoft Windows
Microsoft China.

At the bottom of the page there's an 京ICP备09042378号-6
That's an ICP License, which is required by any company operating online services in mainland China, otherwise they can and will be blocked and censored by the Great FireWall.

Microsoft's ICP license means that they're complying with the"Telecommunications Regulations of the People's Republic of China"... which means that the Ministry of Industry and Information Technology and Ministry of Public Security, i.e. spooks, have full access to everything that's stored online in China, without obtaining a warrant.

This is not Hollywood or whatever, this is real.

BTW ever been to China? Good place for a vacation. :thumbup:

 

[AnonGuy]

The MOD just told us "nicely" to stop derailing the thread... 😉