Wouldn't it have been better to look at it before declaring it was mostly false?
Yes, but it also helps my point. My point is that the information given was intentionally misleading in order to gain support through deception. It works well, as evidenced by you and me. The info is not technically false, but it's also very misleading, which is almost the same thing.
That number you are quoting is from the National Education Association. The National Teacher's Union. It would appear that this person you believe would use the highest number possible, uses the number published by the national teacher's union...
Sad state when you look at people who disagree with you as untrustworthy.
You seem to be missing my point. First, Michelle Malkin is not trustworthy, and I'm surprised you don't know who she is. She's no different from Glenn Beck or Michelle Bachmann. Second, the point is, if there are 3 different numbers floating around, she's going to use the highest one to support her agenda. So, I can be sure that in using her number I'm not using one that's too low, even if it's inaccurate.
Bologna. You would have to be uneducated about compensation to believe this.
As a software developer working in the public sector, I am not compensated to this level. Period. My base salary is about the same as the average Wisconsin Teacher salary, and my benefits only come to a whopping $18k. No nearly the $30k they are pulling in.
First, did you mean to say "private sector"? Second, sorry, but you're wrong. Generally, private-sector employees are compensated about on par with public ones. The main benefits are pensions, health insurance and 401Ks. An equivalent job to a teacher in the private sector is going to offer similar levels of those benefits.
It's possible? That's your claim? You've done no research on it, but you dismiss it, because it's possible that's what they are doing?
It doesn't matter what the truth is... just as long as you can dismiss what you don't like.
Yes, it's possible. You'll notice that I didn't say it's the case. It is the case in a related topic, that of the average pay of autoworkers. It may or may not be how they're calculating this one. The point is if they are calculating it that way, it's wrong. If they're not, no big deal. There are other problems with the claims.
Cool.
And? Yes, he's done some amazing things. If he wants to make $300,000/year, he needs to be working in the PRIVATE sector, not on the public teet.
OK, so public employees just shouldn't make that much money. How does that make sense? Did you see the job he's doing at fund-raising? Should we not pay the president several hundred thousand dollars?
Right... and this has NOTHING to do with the union. It's completely in the Municipalities benefit to pay him 3 times his base salary, instead of hiring someone else to pick up those overtime hours as part of their BASE salary.
Wait, are you saying the union forces him to work all that overtime, and forces the city or state to not hire other workers so that he can keep getting that OT? Seriously?
For various reasons it could be cheaper to do it the way it's done. Even if it's not, it's kind of ridiculous to claim that anyone's being forced to work overtime or not hire new people.
Wait, so you don't realize that bus drivers can work extra to make more money? I think this is part of the problem. Some people get all outraged at things before they actually understand them.
Here's a quick one:
School bus drivers usually drive the same routes each day, stopping to pick up pupils in the morning and return them to their homes in the afternoon. Some school bus drivers also transport students and teachers on field trips or to sporting events. In addition to driving, some school bus drivers work part time in the school system as janitors, mechanics, or classroom assistants when not driving buses.
From here.
From that same site:
Median hourly earnings of school bus drivers were $11.18 in May 2004. The middle 50 percent earned between $8.10 and $13.92 an hour. The lowest 10 percent earned less than $6.23, and the highest 10 percent earned more than $16.81 an hour. Median hourly earnings in the industries employing the largest numbers of school bus drivers in May 2004 were as follows:
School and employee bus transportation $11.97 Elementary and secondary schools 10.74 Other transit and ground passenger transportation 10.62 Child day care services 9.28 Individual and family services 8.75
Now that's overall throughout the country. But I have trouble believing a school-bus driver can get to $70,000 without a lot of overtime or doing another job for the state. If you're working 20 hours a week at $20 (well over the top number of $16.81 given here), you're earning $20,000 a year.
Dishonest numbers? These numbers are fact. The use of conjecture to dismiss them is no reason for public unions to exist.
Yes, dishonest numbers, as in numbers that are either false or used misleadingly so that people will read them differently than what they really are. There is no conjecture. There is nothing wrong with any of the numbers when you consider them as they actually are.
Prove it.
Show me that your opposition to this has more to do with the facts, than your distaste for what they indicate.
Prove what? It was in the post in question. That guy only made $50,000 in regular pay. It was only because he worked a crapload of OT that he made over $100,000.
Look, I'd be fine with getting upset at public workers if there was good reason to, but these numbers don't show good reason to.
The funny part is that it's only because you want to be upset with public workers as a scapegoat for all of our financial problems that you use these numbers as support for your argument. If you just look at it objectively, you realize there's no cause for concern.
Besides, as far as teachers go, I'd be fine with them making much more than they do. I'm fine with taxing corporate CEOs more to pay teachers much more. Teachers are one of the few jobs that I wouldn't mind seeing people make well into the 6 figures for. They are some of the most important jobs in the country. They also take a lot of work and education. Every one of those teachers has a bachelor's degree, and a lot of them are required to do continuing education. They also work a whole lot of hours, and their job (as stated in that post) is not 9 months. They work until almost July, and start back up near the middle of August. And the months school is in session, they commonly work 60+ hours a week with no OT.
