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All things GPS
- Thread starter enjoimark
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- samsung captivate
Rred
Member
pcguy-
"LbsTestMode:
www.spirent-lcs.com
7275
ON
SUPL"
Understand that your settings mean:
1-Use an AGPS server that has been shut down (worthless)
2-Use s specific port on that server which will not connect
3-Use AGPS information from nearby WiFi networks
4-Get SUPLemental assistance from the cellular towers nearby.
So you are not seeing GPS results. You are seeing the combined power of the internet (not functioning), local wifi routers, AND information from local cell towers. If you change the server to supl.google.com and the matching correct server port for that, you'll see even more improvement. But you'll still be using AGPS and if you go out of cellular range, like into a woods, you'll lose signal because you're not using "just" GPS.
"LbsTestMode:
www.spirent-lcs.com
7275
ON
SUPL"
Understand that your settings mean:
1-Use an AGPS server that has been shut down (worthless)
2-Use s specific port on that server which will not connect
3-Use AGPS information from nearby WiFi networks
4-Get SUPLemental assistance from the cellular towers nearby.
So you are not seeing GPS results. You are seeing the combined power of the internet (not functioning), local wifi routers, AND information from local cell towers. If you change the server to supl.google.com and the matching correct server port for that, you'll see even more improvement. But you'll still be using AGPS and if you go out of cellular range, like into a woods, you'll lose signal because you're not using "just" GPS.
Jack45
Android Expert
GPS has never been an obsession with me. Do I understand why folks want it to work well? Of course. Do I go off the deep end, e.g., Die!, Samsung, Die!? No. I'm sort of in the middle on this. Now that that's out of the way, I didn't feel like scrolling through 549 posts to see if what follows has been offered. If it has, I don't care. If it hasn't and helps someone, I do care. Bottom line is I've been getting locks on 10 satellites within about 30 seconds for the past week or so. FYI, I updated Eclair to the current release when it was made available.
Using LbsTestMode...
Application Settings:
Session Type: Tracking
Test Mode (S/W or H/W): S/W Test
Operation Mode: Standalone
Start Mode: Hot start
GPS Plus: ON
Dynamic accuracy: ON
Accuracy: 50
Use SkyHook: OFF
Use PC Tool: OFF
SUPL/CP Settings:
Server FQDN Type: Custom Config
Server: supl.google.com
Server Port: 7276
SUPL Secure Socket: OFF
AGPS Mode: SUPL
Use wireless networks was NOT checked.
As the saying goes, YMMV. After mimicing these settings from another post from another time I turned off the phone to effect a cold boot.
Using LbsTestMode...
Application Settings:
Session Type: Tracking
Test Mode (S/W or H/W): S/W Test
Operation Mode: Standalone
Start Mode: Hot start
GPS Plus: ON
Dynamic accuracy: ON
Accuracy: 50
Use SkyHook: OFF
Use PC Tool: OFF
SUPL/CP Settings:
Server FQDN Type: Custom Config
Server: supl.google.com
Server Port: 7276
SUPL Secure Socket: OFF
AGPS Mode: SUPL
Use wireless networks was NOT checked.
As the saying goes, YMMV. After mimicing these settings from another post from another time I turned off the phone to effect a cold boot.
Just out in the park doing my daily "walk" and got TWELVE sats coming in! I'd say things are looking MUCH different!
Tom
Rred
Member
"After the GSM Dialer reset,"
What reset? AFAIK these codes only open the GPS controls to allow you to change them--they don't reset the GPS. The "Factory reset" doesn't jsut reser the GPS, it will blow away everything on the phone that didn't ship from the factory, AND reset the GPS back to the factory settings--including the disconnected server. (Oh yeah, that's gonna help.<G>)
What reset? AFAIK these codes only open the GPS controls to allow you to change them--they don't reset the GPS. The "Factory reset" doesn't jsut reser the GPS, it will blow away everything on the phone that didn't ship from the factory, AND reset the GPS back to the factory settings--including the disconnected server. (Oh yeah, that's gonna help.<G>)
Jack45
Android Expert
27 - 38
Rred
Member
27-38 is still marginal, if I believe the "GPS Test" app that shows "green" for solid signals above 40. I'll have to see what else I have around that can give me some other s/n readings besides "Yes boss, we can use those birds".
[a bit later]
I have a maybe six year old Deluo Earthmate USB GPS, that was bundled with SA2004 and is a "second generation" GPS unit. (Fourth generation is current now, 3rd generation like the SirfStar-III is considered commodity grade.)
The obsolete Deluo shows 10-20db more signal on each of the satellites that are in use. Pretty much confirms that the Broadcom chipset, as implemented in the GalaxyS phones, is 10-20db "deaf" compared to OBSOLETE chipsets. I'd hate to see how it fares against a SirfStar-III or a current 4th generation set.
That's an objective comparison--not an opinion.
[a bit later]
I have a maybe six year old Deluo Earthmate USB GPS, that was bundled with SA2004 and is a "second generation" GPS unit. (Fourth generation is current now, 3rd generation like the SirfStar-III is considered commodity grade.)
The obsolete Deluo shows 10-20db more signal on each of the satellites that are in use. Pretty much confirms that the Broadcom chipset, as implemented in the GalaxyS phones, is 10-20db "deaf" compared to OBSOLETE chipsets. I'd hate to see how it fares against a SirfStar-III or a current 4th generation set.
That's an objective comparison--not an opinion.
Rred
Member
Jack, seeing all the talk, considering the public market...I'll bet all the kimchee and whatever delicacy tickles Samsung's palette versus a case of good Scotch and Angus beef that someone at Samsung made the concious decision that "this chipset is good enough, and way cheaper than anything else!" and, as we say when we don't want the PG-13 folks to get upset, that's all it takes to apply rotary motion input to the egress end of the pooch. (That boils down to 3 words if you get 'em right.)
Love the bright screen. I guess I'll have to add a Bt GPS if I want to keep this thing and actually get some use out of it...assuming software will work with a BT GPS. Or maybe...clean and polish the old Treo and get another two years out of it.
I don't think any firmware release is going to fix this, any more than it can fix the bum antenna design in the iPhone4. I'd love to be wrong about that, I'm going to drag this out and see what releases in the next week or two.
Love the bright screen. I guess I'll have to add a Bt GPS if I want to keep this thing and actually get some use out of it...assuming software will work with a BT GPS. Or maybe...clean and polish the old Treo and get another two years out of it.
I don't think any firmware release is going to fix this, any more than it can fix the bum antenna design in the iPhone4. I'd love to be wrong about that, I'm going to drag this out and see what releases in the next week or two.
Jack45
Android Expert
I understand all sides of the "discussion," but believe that some have gone way too far in their expressions of disappointment / anger / whatever. I'm all for freedom of expression, but the vitriol that has populated the threads addressing the GPS issue has caused, in some cases, the din to overpower reason. Within the forum itself, filtering other relevant issues from the maze of GPS posts became too onerous. It is because of this and the neverending repetition that I championed a sticky.
Rred
Member
"the din to overpower reason."
Oh, like a s/n ratio that's a good 20db below acceptable, eh?
I guess a 20db s/n ratio could also be called an....115db n/s ratio, or thereabouts. That sounds better, doesn't it? <WEG>
When Motorola jobbed out Startac and other product to Samsung (I think it was Samsung, I know it was "Korea Inc.") there were folks who said the Koreans would eat their (Motorola's) lunch and sure enough...they learned how to build world-class cell phones and Moto got knocked on their bums. Maybe we're just seeing the wheel turning?
Oh, like a s/n ratio that's a good 20db below acceptable, eh?
I guess a 20db s/n ratio could also be called an....115db n/s ratio, or thereabouts. That sounds better, doesn't it? <WEG>
When Motorola jobbed out Startac and other product to Samsung (I think it was Samsung, I know it was "Korea Inc.") there were folks who said the Koreans would eat their (Motorola's) lunch and sure enough...they learned how to build world-class cell phones and Moto got knocked on their bums. Maybe we're just seeing the wheel turning?
Jack45
Android Expert
My allusion was not to the quantitative results that people expect (and should receive) from their device, but rather the qualitative nonsense that droned on and on...akin to "Die, Samsung, Die!" I'm exaggerating, but you get the point. I hope.
What's disturbing is how many people went beyond their 30 day return window hoping Samsung would solve the problem. Now 3 months later, the issue is still unsolved and leaked Froyo builds are showing that no relief is in sight. I was one of those and was lucky enough, by nagging AT&T massively, to get out of the phone. No, I'll never buy Samsung again no matter what product it is.
The other said part is folks who argue that it's not a GPS and tell most users to root the phone then load ROM xyz. Why would you spend $200+ to ruin a phone and still end up with a busted GPS. Memo to Samsung, we are not teters or crash test dummies. Other than the endless Twitter/Facebook messages about "We are working on it", when have we seen a clear description of the problem from Samsung.
The other said part is folks who argue that it's not a GPS and tell most users to root the phone then load ROM xyz. Why would you spend $200+ to ruin a phone and still end up with a busted GPS. Memo to Samsung, we are not teters or crash test dummies. Other than the endless Twitter/Facebook messages about "We are working on it", when have we seen a clear description of the problem from Samsung.
Rred
Member
Jack-
""Die, Samsung, Die!"" Don't these folks pay attention in the movies? The line is "Die, Vampire, Die!". That's Vampire, not Samsung. Samsung was probably keeping the price down, and sadly us little people have to look deeper than "Pretty Pretty Shiny Shiny" (thanks, Cartoon Network) when it comes to technology.
I'm disappointed to find that apparently the Android OS itself only provdes 16 steps for volume level on the phone. At least, I suspect that's an Android limit not a Samsung problem, although I'll hold for confirmation. I noticed with the media players (plural) last night, there's no way to adjust the volume "just right". Maybe that's another cost cutting measure, i.e. a digital control that only has 16 steps instead of the 64 that TVs often have, or 128 for stereos? Took me long enough to bump into that limit, my bad.<G>
I wonder if the iPhone has better volume control...and if the iPhone5 will have a, ahem, better antenna design.<G>
Cuerbo-
"What's disturbing is how many people went beyond their 30 day return window" There are remedies for that too. I wouldn't be surprised, IF this can't be fixed in firmware, if there wasn't a class action suit filed. Or, if AT&T and Samsung were really smart, if they chose to make some accomodation to users in order to AVOID that issue. Like, extending the return time, or providing a BT GPS. Which is after all less than $50 on the retail market and probably would cos tthem all of $15 in bulk.
Stopped at Best Buy the other day. Not because I like the store, but to see the big cell phone selection from the major vendors. There's nothing as bright as the screen on these phones, and frankly, none of the others really screamed out "PICK ME!" any louder.
I may just keep using my GPS for GPS, and consign the one in the phone to "good enough for finding gas stations and hotels nearby" kind of stuff. Compromise, and pray for something better in two more years. UGH. <G>
""Die, Samsung, Die!"" Don't these folks pay attention in the movies? The line is "Die, Vampire, Die!". That's Vampire, not Samsung. Samsung was probably keeping the price down, and sadly us little people have to look deeper than "Pretty Pretty Shiny Shiny" (thanks, Cartoon Network) when it comes to technology.
I'm disappointed to find that apparently the Android OS itself only provdes 16 steps for volume level on the phone. At least, I suspect that's an Android limit not a Samsung problem, although I'll hold for confirmation. I noticed with the media players (plural) last night, there's no way to adjust the volume "just right". Maybe that's another cost cutting measure, i.e. a digital control that only has 16 steps instead of the 64 that TVs often have, or 128 for stereos? Took me long enough to bump into that limit, my bad.<G>
I wonder if the iPhone has better volume control...and if the iPhone5 will have a, ahem, better antenna design.<G>
Cuerbo-
"What's disturbing is how many people went beyond their 30 day return window" There are remedies for that too. I wouldn't be surprised, IF this can't be fixed in firmware, if there wasn't a class action suit filed. Or, if AT&T and Samsung were really smart, if they chose to make some accomodation to users in order to AVOID that issue. Like, extending the return time, or providing a BT GPS. Which is after all less than $50 on the retail market and probably would cos tthem all of $15 in bulk.
Stopped at Best Buy the other day. Not because I like the store, but to see the big cell phone selection from the major vendors. There's nothing as bright as the screen on these phones, and frankly, none of the others really screamed out "PICK ME!" any louder.
I may just keep using my GPS for GPS, and consign the one in the phone to "good enough for finding gas stations and hotels nearby" kind of stuff. Compromise, and pray for something better in two more years. UGH. <G>
When I got home today I took out my camera to show how the GPS is now on my phone after I did the GSM Reset (11 days ago - working like it is in the video since the reset). I was only walking so I don't have it recorded over long distance but it works great for my under Navigation as well - and it locks on this quick even when in a car. As you can see in the video, I was also under alot of trees (if I showed it that is).
I started with GPS off. Wireless assist is always off on my phone.
The GPS Test speedometer is a little finicky so don't pay attention to that, I was definitely walking faster
YouTube - Samsung Captivate GPS
I started with GPS off. Wireless assist is always off on my phone.
The GPS Test speedometer is a little finicky so don't pay attention to that, I was definitely walking faster
YouTube - Samsung Captivate GPS
Rred
Member
The good folks at GPSTest have their speed averaging base set for a bit too long a time period, probably in order to make the speed display smoother. Stop a car and it may say you are sill in motion for another 5 seconds!<G>
But you'll also notice, they show a fair s/n ratio (yellow) for most of the birds in this phone--even when you've got a good skyview. My 20-year old Garmin can outperform the Captivate. And my Nuvi can rings around them both.
I don't think we can expect any improvement, I think the choice is to accept "this is all it does" or to make other tradeoffs for other phones.
Like a dimmer screen, or a bad antenna design.<G> Yeah, I'm a tough customer.
But you'll also notice, they show a fair s/n ratio (yellow) for most of the birds in this phone--even when you've got a good skyview. My 20-year old Garmin can outperform the Captivate. And my Nuvi can rings around them both.
I don't think we can expect any improvement, I think the choice is to accept "this is all it does" or to make other tradeoffs for other phones.
Like a dimmer screen, or a bad antenna design.<G> Yeah, I'm a tough customer.
Hey Guys,
So today I had a meeting for work (work for ATT) at which the District Field Marketing Manager for Samsung was there to give a demo on the cappy for all of the not so tech savvy employees. A bunch of us were given them to demo and show customers. As he was going through his powerpoint of all the great features on the phone, he had one slide dedicated to the update. Low and behold one of the fixes was indeed the GPS. So for me this puts a close on the fact that this was the fix Samsung was promising. After he finished his presentation I brought the issue up to him about me and several other users (you guys) really experiencing no fix for the GPS. I also asked if there was a difference from manually pushing the upgrade and waiting for ATT to push it; the answer was NO, it is the same thing. I explained that I was still not getting locks therefore rendering GPS and Nav useless. At this point in time his only response to me was it should have fixed it but send me your IMEI and I will look into it. So I just sent him an email about 30 mins ago about this issue. I will keep you up to date with and further developments. Hope this clears some things up...
Cliffs: Spoke with samsung in person and update inculded GPS fix and the way you received the updated didnt matter its the same exact thing.
***UPDATE***
Response for Him:
Hi James,
Thank you for that feedback and I am forwarding your message to our tech team. I should get some sort of response though prob no today but I will keep you updated. Your feedback definately helps us
Sent from Samsung mobile
Chad Smith (changed name for privacy purposes)
District Field Marketing Manager
Samsung Telecommunications America
SF Bay Area
Did anyone ever get back to you with any info?
Rred
Member
Well, Chad, I work just down the hall from you but with this nifty mustache and glasses you own't recognize me either. Want a pair? <G>
Thanks for connecting to the sources. Interesting that AT&T would say it is fixed while Samsung would say...Hay, are we allowed to curse in Korean on this forum?<G>
Thanks for connecting to the sources. Interesting that AT&T would say it is fixed while Samsung would say...Hay, are we allowed to curse in Korean on this forum?<G>
I did some playing around with Google My Tracks and JH7. It was spot on. I was headed to football practice. It was a 19.4 mile drive, mix of suburban environments, highway, and some urban environments.
I don't want to say GPS is fixed for everyone, but it works for me in My Tracks. Google Navigation is more frustrating, but not too bad. I really think this is going to be as good as it gets.
I don't want to say GPS is fixed for everyone, but it works for me in My Tracks. Google Navigation is more frustrating, but not too bad. I really think this is going to be as good as it gets.
Attachments
My Captivate would take forever to get a GPS lock untill I did the fatory reset ............. *2767*38--# .... I left two numbers out cuz this reset will delete all data and contacts so be sure this is what you wish to try. My GPS works perfect now with 3 and 4 second lock on's .... I dont know if this works for all phones but it fixed mine, going on 5 days now.... My phone is not rooted by the way .... 100% stock </DIV>