HP 12C Calculator Application

[MB200]

Great. Just found this post on Android forums today.

As the owner of an original 1981 HP 12C, still working perfectly after 29 years, I'm very happy to hear about the HP 12C look alike calculator for Android with RPN functionality.

I will download it shortly.

And thanks to Ed Falk for being a developer who takes the time to monitor these forums and learn from the users (and potential users) of his app. Good on ya Ed!

 

[palmheads]

I'll give running them across the top a try, see how it looks.

The other calculator apps have lots of space between the keys, whereas I ran the keys right next to each other to make them bigger. Do any users of the iPhone calculator apps have any comments on how the smaller keys are to use? I have to admit it looks better that way, but I'm worried about usability.

I guess it depends on where you want RPNCalc Pro to head. With the programming addition, I guess your heading for as close to 100% compatibility for a real HP-12C as you can get? I guess in that case making it look physically exactly the same as the real thing might be a benefit (case colours/key shape etc etc). Am not sure how technically the key press works, but I guess you could display the keys smaller, but still have a bigger "footprint" around them. Conversely if you wanted to keep the RPNCalc Pro "look" then maybe it doesn't matter so much.

At least one of the iphone developers has "lite" versions of the voyager based calcs that exclude programming, so I don't think its that confusing. They just have stepped pricing. I guess you'd then have 3 versions - RPNCalc to give a taste (free), RPNCalc Pro & perhaps RPNCalc Pro+ (w/programming).

 

[MB200]

I downloaded RPNcalcPro about a week ago. Love it. Just like my HP-12C calculator, with a few nice additions (more registers, screen feedback of what is in some registers, a backspace key, etc.)

My only feedback is that for my large fingers, and the display on a Motorola Cliq, 2.5" x 1.9" screen, the buttons are a little small. Or, more particularly to the problem, it is too easy to touch an adjacent button rather than the one you were aiming for.

 

[the208]

RPNCalcPro is a great app. Can you give us the ability to long press a key as an alternative to using the shift key? I appreciate the effort, Ed.

 

[spellcheck]

From another frustrated Android user who can't buy apps on the Market - what about selling via Handango? The have a growing Android app base, and are quite easy to use. I have used them in the past for Pocket PC apps.

So, has there been any progress in selling outside of the Market? The inability to buy apps on the the Market is a major drawback to owning an Andorid phone.

 

[kelautz]

Am a new HTC Eris owner, but a longtime 12C user, including, occasionally, the programming feature. Just downloaded your app, and oooh, I like it already!

 

[palmheads]

Will be interesting to see Eds latest updates with programming etc. A month ago he was aiming for "within the month" so he might be close to an update!

 

[cranky_dan]

biggest issue to me is how the add/subtract works (different than normal calculators). once you get used to it it is impossible to use a normal calculator.

Ya. My 11c spoiled me. I *cannot* use a four-banger without running the numbers two or three times to 'get it right.'

Dan

 

[falk]

Will be interesting to see Eds latest updates with programming etc. A month ago he was aiming for "within the month" so he might be close to an update!

OK, progress update: programming mode works. I still need to add "save/load" functions for programs. Mostly it needs more testing -- it's always a bad idea to release a calculator with any bugs in it.

 

[falk]

RPNCalcPro is a great app. Can you give us the ability to long press a key as an alternative to using the shift key? I appreciate the effort, Ed.

Adding long keypress for 'f' keys would be very easy to do. Problem is, the calculator has both 'f' and 'g' keys, and I don't think there would be any way to differentiate them with long press.

How many people would want this feature, and would you prefer 'f' or 'g'?

 

[stevel_uk]

The HP 12C Platinum version allowed algebraic notation as well as RPN, any chance the RPNCalc Pro could include this option as well?

 

[stevel_uk]

to Falk, re your earlier questions, i would prefer long press to relate to the f function and landscape mode, i am planning to get the new HTC desire and think this would be great on this slightly larger screen

 

[falk]

Hey all; another progress update.

Programming mode works, as does save/restore. I could upload it right now if I wanted, but I couldn't guarantee HP12 compatibility.

By the way, if you'd like to see what a saved program looks like, see http://www.efalk.org/RpnCalcFinancial/Programs/full_part.rpn. The preliminary documentation for programming mode is at RpnCalc Pro Programming. Feel free (in fact, please do) send me feedback.

For the last month, I've been running all the examples in the HP12 manual, and any time I find a difference in behavior, I have to stop, figure out why the difference was there, and fix it. Some of the differences have been devilishly subtle. For instance, some of the HP12 programs depend on the stack being only 4 levels, so I had to modify RpnCalcPro to have a 4-level stack while in run mode, but a 16-level stack in normal mode. There are also subtleties involving when stack lift is enabled and when the last-x value is stored. These things all make a difference.

So I had a thought this morning: If anybody would like to send me their favorite HP12 programs, along with instructions on running them, the inputs they expect, and the outputs they should generate, I'll try them out on RpnCalcPro and make sure they work as expected.

Anyway, it will be on the market Real Soon Now.

 

[palmheads]

Hey all; another progress update.

Programming mode works, as does save/restore. I could upload it right now if I wanted, but I couldn't guarantee HP12 compatibility.

By the way, if you'd like to see what a saved program looks like, see http://www.efalk.org/RpnCalcPro/full_part.rpn. The preliminary documentation for programming mode is at RpnCalc Pro Programming. Feel free (in fact, please do) send me feedback.

For the last month, I've been running all the examples in the HP12 manual, and any time I find a difference in behavior, I have to stop, figure out why the difference was there, and fix it. Some of the differences have been devilishly subtle. For instance, some of the HP12 programs depend on the stack being only 4 levels, so I had to modify RpnCalcPro to have a 4-level stack while in run mode, but a 16-level stack in normal mode. There are also subtleties involving when stack lift is enabled and when the last-x value is stored. These things all make a difference.

So I had a thought this morning: If anybody would like to send me their favorite HP12 programs, along with instructions on running them, the inputs they expect, and the outputs they should generate, I'll try them out on RpnCalcPro and make sure they work as expected.

Anyway, it will be on the market Real Soon Now.

Sounds great!

As an example Program, here is one from the hpmuseum forum. Don't ask me what it is (I have no idea), but it has the listing & expected results. Called the 'Lambert W' calculation.

Lambert W (HP-12C+)

If you follow the thread thru, the 3rd from bottom is the final version of it. Looks like a pretty complicated thing, so if it works you must have done something right!

 

[krischik]

Nonpareil HP calc simulator (Nonpareil: High-Fidelity Calculator Simulator) used to have them included, but licensing issues meant they needed to be seperated out.

The MacPorts version of Nonpareil still got them. It is not all that difficult to patch the 0.78 voyager code into 0.79 Nonpareil. I don't know what kind of license problems there where - once it's open source there is no point in kicking up a fuss any more.

Sadly the Macports version sometimes has display problems - unrelated from the patching done.

Martin

 

[palmheads]

The MacPorts version of Nonpareil still got them. It is not all that difficult to patch the 0.78 voyager code into 0.79 Nonpareil. I don't know what kind of incense problems there where - there is no point in kicking up a fuss any more.

Sadly the Macports version sometimes has display problems - unrelated from the patching done.

Martin

I was able to find a 0.78 version that I was able to compile for ubuntu, so its great to be able to see it in action!

 

[krischik]

I was able to find a 0.78 version that I was able to compile for ubuntu, so its great to be able to see it in action!

Get yourself the 0.79 version as well and diff them. The differences are rather minute and it is quite easy to patch voyager back into 0.79.

Or you could just download the ready made patch file from MacPorts - They contain nothing Mac specific.

 

[falk]

Sounds great!

As an example Program, here is one from the hpmuseum forum. Don't ask me what it is (I have no idea), but it has the listing & expected results. Called the 'Lambert W' calculation.

Lambert W (HP-12C+)...

Hey, thanks for the reference.

I have a question: is that source code in some standard notation? It's not the "05 - 43 11" format an actual HP12 would display. Is there a reference for this notation anywhere?

 

[Blrfl]

I have a question: is that source code in some standard notation? It's not the "05 - 43 11" format an actual HP12 would display. Is there a reference for this notation anywhere?

The instructions are displayed as a step number, a hyphen, and then pairs of digits representing the row and column on the keyboard of each key pressed. So your example is the "g" key (row 4, column 3) followed by the "n" key (row 1, column 1) and results in the "12x" operation. The exception are the digit keys, which just show up as themselves. You'll find this in the Programming section of the owner's manual.

The usual format for listings are the keys themselves, e.g., "[STO] [3]" and "[g] [x<=y]" It might be useful to give your emulator a configuration item to display it the "authentic" way or the "human-readable" way.

If you ever do apps for the rest of the 10C family, I'd give certain unmentionable parts of my body for an 11C, 15C and 16C.

--Mark

 

[falk]

... I prefer Verizon service and have the Droid...but I need the 12c.

I just got a Droid myself. I love it. RpnCalcPro works great on it. They keys are slightly larger on the Droid, which is great.

 

[falk]

The instructions are displayed as a step number, a hyphen, and then pairs of digits representing the row and column on the keyboard..

Yeah, that's how the real HP12 displays it, but follow palmhead's link above. People on that forum are showing code like "06 ENTER" and "10 RCL 1", which is incredibly close to the format I was already using in RpnCalcPro.

I'm wondering if that's some sort of standard notation, in which case I'll use it myself.

If you ever do apps for the rest of the 10C family, I'd give certain unmentionable parts of my body for an 11C, 15C and 16C.

--Mark

Yeah, I'd like to do a 15C next. Dunno about the 16C though; I used to have one and I hated it. The user interface was just not quite right.

 

[palmheads]

Valentin Albillo's Calculator Pages

Looks to have some excellent programs as well for the HP-12c

He uses a slightly different notation where he specifies the function key pressed as well

eg
01 f CL FIN
02 f 2
03 ENTER
04 +
05 PMT
06 g INTG
etc etc

Taken from http://membres.multimania.fr/albillo/calc/pdf/DatafileVA002.pdf

I guess the notation is just something that makes sense when keying in proggies. The Programming section of the HP-12c manual kinda does the same thing by displaying the keystrokes, as well as what you'd see on the Hp-12c screen.

 

[palmheads]

Looks like RPNCalc Pro has been released with programming! Looks great! Also has copy & pasting.

It basically is a full 12C now!

 

[falk]

Looks like RPNCalc Pro has been released with programming! Looks great! Also has copy & pasting.

It basically is a full 12C now!

Yep, we're live. If you downloaded 1.7, you should immediately upgrade because it used the wrong format for storing programs. You'll also need to install the OI File Manager to save and restore the programs.

Documentation in RpnCalc Pro Programming

There are a few useful programs in Useful RpnCalcPro programs, but they're not documented yet.

Anyway, give me your feedback on the new calculator. Until it's had a little more testing, I'm not ready to call it hp12-compatible.

-ed falk

 

[palmheads]

Yep, we're live. If you downloaded 1.7, you should immediately upgrade because it used the wrong format for storing programs. You'll also need to install the OI File Manager to save and restore the programs.

Documentation in RpnCalc Pro Programming

There are a few useful programs in Useful RpnCalcPro programs, but they're not documented yet.

Anyway, give me your feedback on the new calculator. Until it's had a little more testing, I'm not ready to call it hp12-compatible.

-ed falk

So far it looks great! I tried entering that lambertw equation that I linked to above - I get the same results back as listed on that page.

I also really like your new layout for the financial calc not in landscape mode - you've made it '12c' like with all the function keys etc. Very nice.