A.Nonymous
Extreme Android User
By his logic, you'd have to hate Bill Gates too.
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Steve Jobs Invented Your Dell PC and Your Android Phone
- Thread starter quest7
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By his logic, you'd have to hate Bill Gates too.
Good idea.
A.Nonymous
Extreme Android User
I wish I was a schmuck like Steve Jobs. I'd then be ridiculously successful and people would debate whether I was the most influential person in PCs in all of history or not. If Jobs is a schmuck, then I aspire to be one too.
SUroot
Extreme Android User
I do, plus he is an elitest prick. However, the MS OS is not as cut off as Mac OS. I use Windows professionally and if it didnt have easy access to the registry (like Mac), it would be a no go but windows is much more accessible for the IT professional.
I'd rather be creidble.
A.Nonymous
Extreme Android User
I'm an IT professional. I can't think of a single time recently when I had to get into the registry for any reason whatsoever. I'm an MCSE and have years of experience in both desktop and server support. I never, ever, ever get into the registry for any reason whatsoever. 99.9% of the time there is no reason to access the registry.
I'd rather be brilliant, wealthy, an incredible marketer and have my brilliance recognized in my own time.
Bob Maxey
Android Expert
The registry is a problem some times and be it a manual edit or a registry cleaner, at some point you must fool with the registry in one way or another. I guess that is why there are registry cleaners.
I have rarely directly edited the registry. I do occasionally have a look at it and remove stuff the cleaners miss. There are times when you might need to edit the registry, but that is not for careless people. Best advice is to avoid opening the registry.
I recall writing a guide to modifying some files like Win.ini that was a part of Windows 3.1/Windows for Workgroups. Mostly to add references to driver files and other files like batch files. Much easier to deal with than that blasted registry because it was readable.
As for hating Jobs or Gates or MS or Apple. . . it is envy pure and simple. You simply cannot argue that both fellers have made some of us a fair bit of change and many great corporations came to be because of Apple and Microsoft.
It's all good, regardless of the flavor.
Bob Maxey
Android Expert
He co-founded Pixar. No, wait . . . he did not design the hardware or hand build the monitors or put the trillions of billions of zeros and ones in proper order to generate Nemo. So he can't claim that as a success.
He largely failed with NEXT, but I always loved NEXT. Just a Bob thing, I suppose. Please no anti-Next statements.
Long, long ago, in a garage far, far away in Cupertino, he and Steve Wozniak founded Apple computers. Not a big deal, I'll give you that.
His name is on many of Apple's patents. Either as inventor or co-inventor. I'll let you all argue if he actually designed anything. I say he likely did and chances are, you will not agree.
I will suggest to those gathered here that Jobs might not have put pencil to paper and actually designed anything; or wrote software, for that matter. But I do not know for sure; smart guys tend to do smart things.
What he did do is build a vast corporation and I think Apple's success is due largely to Steve Jobs. So yes, he did innovate and invent...he innovated and invented a company called Apple Computers.
So tell me, what credit should Jobs or any other corporate visionary be allowed to claim? I just completed a project for a man that owns very large group of minor corporations in odd manufacturing sectors and the founder of the company did not design anything. He put ideas together, hired great people, and got out of their way.
Does he get credit for doing something amazing or must a CEO actually invent something before he or she is allowed to bask in success?
And you are absolutely correct. Apple under his leadership is an epic fail to be sure. All he did was start Apple, left Apple, co-founded Pixar, sold Pixar to the Big Mouse, came back to Apple, and grew it into the largest company on its kind on planet earth.
And his salary is a dollar a year, what a schmuck.
A.Nonymous
Extreme Android User
I just heard an interview Leo LaPorte did with Woz on TWIT this week. According to Woz, he was simply an engineer and Jobs brilliance was in being an idea man.
Bob Maxey
Android Expert
I can believe that. But it takes two to tango, I suppose. Engineers to make a particular vision happen and a visionary to drive the designers.
Bob Maxey
Android Expert
Some examples please.
I do not see Mr. Gates as elitist prick but I do see him as credible. What he did with Traf-O-Data and Altair led to something amazing, after all. I think Microsoft was a fairly successful venture.
I do see people complaining sans logic and reasoning, however. So tell me/us... why is BG a "prick."
Odd that Microsoft and Apple are so widely discounted on the Web. I think both corporations have done a good job. Be glad we are not living in the days of the Robber Barons. Now many of those folks were truly dastardly.
Traf-o-Data business card | Flickr - Photo Sharing!
I'm still trying to understand the part where you get easier access to the registry on Windows than on OS X, and I think I can help with that.
OS X doesn't have a registry, as that is easily the stupidest construct ever in the history of operating systems, and its folly is unique to Windows.
And Bob, shame on you. Jobs is the elitst one, Gates is the common one. Although I do like what some of the Gates Foundation has accomplished, as well as the Project Red pieces Apple has put out.
Wealth doesn't excuse dirty business dealings or a lack of couth.
OS X doesn't have a registry, as that is easily the stupidest construct ever in the history of operating systems, and its folly is unique to Windows.
And Bob, shame on you. Jobs is the elitst one, Gates is the common one. Although I do like what some of the Gates Foundation has accomplished, as well as the Project Red pieces Apple has put out.
Wealth doesn't excuse dirty business dealings or a lack of couth.
alostpacket
Over Macho Grande?
I know the Al Gore joke is an old ingrained one by now (heck I laughed at it a lot too) But the real history behind it is pretty interesting:
https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipe...mance_Computing_and_Communication_Act_of_1991
As for Jobs, he had a big impact on computing for sure. I can't help but think that a lot of that was being in the right place at the right time.
Apple may never have been fashionable if not for Windows being so business-y
I also think that a lot of Apple software is pretty mediocre, but the industrial/physical/product design is nothing short of top notch. That REALLY helped their image.
I forget the guy's name who does the product design there, but he's pretty well known and has been there a long time. He knows what's sleek and cool and he sticks to it. This is one guy I think responsible for a lot of Apple's successes. And that's not a diss on apple consumers saying they are buying shiny vanity products. Rather it's a compliment to how nice the products look, and that's important.
Still, there is no denying Jobs had a major impact on the tech world. I hardly think he invented anything, but he made an impact. Much like Maxley said above, it takes two to tango. Engineering + design & ideas = product.
I think the thing you can remember about Jobs is that his passion, drive, angry management style, and sheer determination shaped the industry, not his "inventions."
Anyways I wish him good health regardless of my thoughts about his accomplishments or paths that he took to achieve them.
https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipe...mance_Computing_and_Communication_Act_of_1991
As for Jobs, he had a big impact on computing for sure. I can't help but think that a lot of that was being in the right place at the right time.
Apple may never have been fashionable if not for Windows being so business-y
I also think that a lot of Apple software is pretty mediocre, but the industrial/physical/product design is nothing short of top notch. That REALLY helped their image.
I forget the guy's name who does the product design there, but he's pretty well known and has been there a long time. He knows what's sleek and cool and he sticks to it. This is one guy I think responsible for a lot of Apple's successes. And that's not a diss on apple consumers saying they are buying shiny vanity products. Rather it's a compliment to how nice the products look, and that's important.
Still, there is no denying Jobs had a major impact on the tech world. I hardly think he invented anything, but he made an impact. Much like Maxley said above, it takes two to tango. Engineering + design & ideas = product.
I think the thing you can remember about Jobs is that his passion, drive, angry management style, and sheer determination shaped the industry, not his "inventions."
Anyways I wish him good health regardless of my thoughts about his accomplishments or paths that he took to achieve them.
A.Nonymous
Extreme Android User
I personally think Jobs is an elitist prick. He's still absolutely brilliant IMO. Like I said earlier, if you're discussing who is the most influential person in the entire history of PCs, Jobs name is going to come up in that discussion. That says something right there about how brilliant the guy is.
The Apple designer you're thinking of alostpacket is Jonathan Ive.
Behind Apple's success is longtime designer Jonathan Ive | The Salt Lake Tribune
A.Nonymous, you raise an interesting point, intended or not.
How would we judge most influential in the PC world?
If it weren't for the business skills, we might never have heard of Apple or Microsoft.
Should we only count Wozniak and Allen, and not Jobs, Gates, Balmer, et al?
In such a case, the vote would go to the likes of Dr. Gary Kildall or Dr. Ed Roberts - but how influential can we say they are when no one has heard of them?
Jobs influenced the music industry and the pundits laughed at him, but like it or not, a lot of our digital media freedom came from that.
Gates influenced corporate IT and the pundits laughed at him, but a lot of our standard practices came from that.
Whose influence is greater? The inventor whose products you use but whose name you don't know? Or the business guy that gets it into the market and into your hands?
I respect both. I do keep them separate by type and haven't seen yet how one makes it without the other.
And I wonder if history won't remember a college student building custom PCs and advertising in small print in magazines that only the Bobs and Earlys remember - that kid, Michael Dell, as among the most important.
Behind Apple's success is longtime designer Jonathan Ive | The Salt Lake Tribune
A.Nonymous, you raise an interesting point, intended or not.
How would we judge most influential in the PC world?
If it weren't for the business skills, we might never have heard of Apple or Microsoft.
Should we only count Wozniak and Allen, and not Jobs, Gates, Balmer, et al?
In such a case, the vote would go to the likes of Dr. Gary Kildall or Dr. Ed Roberts - but how influential can we say they are when no one has heard of them?
Jobs influenced the music industry and the pundits laughed at him, but like it or not, a lot of our digital media freedom came from that.
Gates influenced corporate IT and the pundits laughed at him, but a lot of our standard practices came from that.
Whose influence is greater? The inventor whose products you use but whose name you don't know? Or the business guy that gets it into the market and into your hands?
I respect both. I do keep them separate by type and haven't seen yet how one makes it without the other.
And I wonder if history won't remember a college student building custom PCs and advertising in small print in magazines that only the Bobs and Earlys remember - that kid, Michael Dell, as among the most important.
SamuraiBigEd
Under paid Sasquatch!
Very well put, I was mulling over a similar post earlier but have been beaten to the punch by my esteemed colleague Early. And add my name to the list of "remembers Michael Dell", although I would like to forget his investment that brought Steak & Shake to Austin, blech!
The list of who you would have to thank is a long one, there are/were many very influental people both behind the scenes and in the public eye. I do have to give credit to Jobs for his marketing genius while disagreeing with his attitude towards fair competition. Similar statements could be said for Bill Gates, but they are both two of the most influental people in the computer industry, period.
This is an argument that could go on and on ad infinitum and can be extremely inflammatory, suffice to say none of the extreme success stories like Steve Jobs are perfect, they can't be, they are only human. Steve Jobs will probably be remembered for pissing people off as much as for what he accomplished, after all that gets you a place in history too.
alostpacket
Over Macho Grande?
So many interesting people that have had such a huge impact.
Sean Parker I think is important to remember for music too. I dont think Jobs could have saved music if it were not for Parker "destroying" it.
Jeff Bezos for e-commerce.
Who else... I dont know the name of the guy who started Friendster. I'd say Mark Zuckerberg but that train was rolling before he arrived.
Sergey Brin & Larry Page
Eric Scmidt
Andy Rubin....
Oh and of course...
Marc Andreessen
alostpacket
Over Macho Grande?
Oh and Linus Torvalds and Richard Stallman
Guys I've talked with, but who will remember?
SUroot
Extreme Android User
google "Bill gates depopulation vaccine"
Exactly, MAC doesnt have one. You think its a stupid construct? I disagree. As a Wintel system engineer I find it invaluable to circumvent the way certain things work. If you look at the registry, it is entirely logical.
I have found many uses for the registry. Most notabliy when needing to add NT4 emulation
Drhyde
Android Enthusiast
Uggghhh....even if you give him the benefit of the doubt about being altruistic, watching videos of him talking about shit he has no idea about, i.e. climate change, biology, etc, makes me cringe. Stick to the computers Billy. His foundation was already off to a rocky start with evidence surfacing that the companies his foundation "invested" in (what an un-charity-like word they used), were actually causing more damage.
As far as Steve Jobs, enough with the hero worship already. This guy has got to go. My understanding of the Apple situation circa late 90's, was his current successor (Tim Cook) was already on his way to eliminating Apple's hardware production to bring down cost and return profitability. I hate hearing people attribute these qualities to a guy who simply capitalized on everyone's stupidity.
Virtually everything Steve is supposed to have created already existed (front facing cameras were in Europe and Asia for a decade or more before the IP4, tablet computers existed in many facets of business, MP3 players were already on the market, capacitive touch screen phones were showing up at the same time as the original iPhone, etc.). He didn't innovate, he just used his business acumen to capitalize on low cost/high profit margin tech that you could sell to any imbecile. The largest problem was the American people's slow to adapt mentality. I hate to see the whims of our tech being dictated by a new-age dork in a turtleneck. I'm actually glad that Android has once again put the innovation back in the hands of the manufacturers and independent developers.
As a Windows developer, I stand by my assessment - it's a stupid construct.
I've developed for, and predate, Windows.
The registry is not even wrong.
SUroot
Extreme Android User
Thats fair enough, to each their own. Not looking to change any minds here. Just wanted to convey my belief.