-
After 15+ years, we've made a big change: Android Forums is now Early Bird Club. Learn more here.
Why do some carriers charge for tethering??
- Thread starter landovr
- Start date
Medion
Android Expert
Up until recently, most carriers within the US offered an "unlimited" data plan. However, these plans didn't keep up with the times. As people went from dumb phones to feature phones, to ever more powerful smartphones, they were consuming more and more data. When these "unlimited" data plans came out, most users were expected to use <25MB of data, not in excess of 5 gigs.
So, the idea was to tack on a tethering charge for those who would use the feature. After all, people who used laptop connect cards often paying $50/month for unlimited data (later capped), so why should a smartphone user get that AND smartphone data for only $50?
I was hoping that as carriers moved to tiered data, they would eliminate tethering charges. There really is no point if they're going to charge for the data used, other than to gouge the consumer.
So, the idea was to tack on a tethering charge for those who would use the feature. After all, people who used laptop connect cards often paying $50/month for unlimited data (later capped), so why should a smartphone user get that AND smartphone data for only $50?
I was hoping that as carriers moved to tiered data, they would eliminate tethering charges. There really is no point if they're going to charge for the data used, other than to gouge the consumer.
A.Nonymous
Extreme Android User
All carriers that I'm aware of charge for tethering. At least the ones in the US do.
As I understand the carriers in the United States. They've got like a pricing cartel, and will try and gouge their captive subscribers for every dollar, nickel and dime, including charging for tethering and draconian two year contracts. Fortunately it's not like this in other countries. Telus is a Canadian carrier, and so is not part of any US pricing cartel.
Mostly Harmless
Android Expert
Simple put: They are a-holes ripping the consumers off. The problem is that no one offers an unlimited plan with data+tethering so there is no competition to compete with. We are all being screwed royally.
A.Nonymous
Extreme Android User
That hits the nail right on the head. I don't think there's really much more to add to the conversation.
krouget
Android Enthusiast
It all traces back to the $$.
It's the same reason they charge for SMS services, which behave no different than other data. They create an artificial distinction, in order to charge the consumer for something they've already payed for.
However, this is why competition is good, and why I don't want to see any merging of carriers. So long as they compete against each other, one will try to undercut the other, and at least provide an avenue out of these types of practices (in theory, anyway).
It's the same reason they charge for SMS services, which behave no different than other data. They create an artificial distinction, in order to charge the consumer for something they've already payed for.
However, this is why competition is good, and why I don't want to see any merging of carriers. So long as they compete against each other, one will try to undercut the other, and at least provide an avenue out of these types of practices (in theory, anyway).
Roze
Hiding behind a mystery
Most of the Canadian carriers have tiered data plans that is VERY expensive. The cheapest for most is $25 for 500MB. One thing that the Canadian carriers got right: you paid for your (limited) data, you get to use it however you like. So tethering is free for them.
What's sad is that in the US, the carriers are going towards tiered data (AT&T and Verizon) but it doesn't seem like they are getting rid of the tethering plan
shawn1224
Ex CEO-DNPSEA foundation
It's not really a big issue if you ask me. Most tethering plans can be circumvented with a 3rd party wi-fi tether app or by rooting your device and editing the APN settings.
It's not mandatory that you fork over your hard earned money to these greedy corporations.
It's not mandatory that you fork over your hard earned money to these greedy corporations.
Medion
Android Expert
Sort of. By circumventing, you are violating the terms of service with that provider. The provider has the right to cancel your account, charge for the service, and/or require that you pay back money owed for the services that you essentially stole. However, there is no reliable means of telling who is tethering and who isn't, which is why most of the notices they've given are just to high bandwidth users (some of whom don't actually tether).
Don't get me wrong, I'm on a grandfathered unlimited $10/month data plan with Verizon, and I tether. But, if they came to me and told me that I'd have to pay up, I'd make the decision between paying for it, or discontinuing its use. I'm unlikely to get caught though as my highest monthly usage since I bought the phone in August was 1.4GB, with only three of those months being 1GB or higher.
A.Nonymous
Extreme Android User
No, it's not mandatory, but if you don't you are violating the TOS you signed with them and they can terminate your service and charge you an ETF on top of that.
shawn1224
Ex CEO-DNPSEA foundation
Exactly my point. They have no methods to tell who's tethering and until they do, I see no reason for people to willingly sign up for a tether plan. I have a $30 unlimited plan with AT&T and use upwards of 6 to 10 GBs a month and I tether a lot. Of course if they back date my account and charge me accordingly, I'm on the hook for it, but until then I don't feel obligated that I owe them anything. They're gouging us enough as is.
Medion
Android Expert
I don't feel that all carriers are gouging us yet (going by the actual profit margins of Verizon, Sprint, and T-Mobile). AT&T, on the other hand, does similar markup as Verizon, but doesn't invest nearly as much in infrastructure. This is why Wall Street loves them so much. They have much larger profit margins than the other guys.
Also, I understood the tethering charge on unlimited data. Tethering charges on tiered plans are a flat out money grab, nothing more.
AndroidSPCS
Android Expert
I have read in other posts that the carriers can easily tell if you're tethering.
This is because if you're tethering a Windows device, the PC generates all kinds of Windows type traffic, to windows updates services, internet explorer signatures, etc. Other OS probably do the same thing - Linux sends traffice to / from the update repositories, Mac with Safari, etc etc.
So if a carrier really wanted to, they could send notices to anyone who they detect is tethering illegaly to tell them to knock it off.
Medion
Android Expert
Huge problem with this. It requires packet-sniffing, and that is illegal. The carrier can't admit to doing this (though I'm sure they are). If I connect to a website, they can use my cookie to display what browser and OS I'm using. That's legal as it's communication between myself and that website. However, the ISP cannot packet-sniff, or eavesdrop on the conversation between these two devices.
So, I'll rephrase. Currently, there is no legal way for the carriers to determine if you are tethering outside of their terms of service.
AndroidSPCS
Android Expert
I don't think the ISPs have to do packet sniffing. They can review traffic logs on the servers to see what traffic is being generated, where it's sent from, where the traffic is going, etc.
It would be mighty suspicous to see John Smith's HTC Evo generating traffic to Windowsupdate.com, checking anti-virus updates at avast, etc every 30 minutes, etc.
The only way you can secure against this is by using a VPN, although depending on the type of VPN you use, that can be a tell tale sign of a PC being used as well.
Also, with the Patriot Act in the US, there are lot more things the gov't and the ISPs can do without user consent, who knows what they can or cannot do with your traffic... http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-isp-snooping.htm
Medion
Android Expert
I agree with you here, IE, if MS just released a 12MB patch, and the user just downloaded 12MB of data from that domain, they were likely tethering. However, the user can argue that he or she navigated to the website and merely downloaded the executable to his SD card to transfer via USB later.
So, I'll re-clarify - the carriers currently have no way to legally and definitively tell if you are tethering.
AndroidSPCS
Android Expert
I think the "no way to legally and definitively tell" is a bit troublesome. Unless you're an expert in network technologies / traffic, I don't think you can state that.
With regards to Windows Update - it requires internet explorer (MS active X control) to download updates, and it's not just an .exe file either. So if someone downloads Windows updates, chances are 99.99999999% that person is tethering. Same thing with downloading virus definitions from Windows anti-virus software as well.
I have studied networks and know enough about servers and traffic to be dangerous, even I don't profess to know it all and say with confidence that this is true.
I believe if the carriers wanted to, they can easily find out who is tethering, and put a stop to it. They are probably too swamped with other priorities, and the cost to pursue is prohibitive relative to the benefit, so they'll just cancel someone's account if their overall traffic becomes too high.
In the case of AT&T, I've read that they are starting to detect who is tethering, and will automatically add a tethering plan to the user once tethering is detected. It was one of the news stories I read (I've been reading a ton lately), so I'm sure the link is out there somewhere.
shawn1224
Ex CEO-DNPSEA foundation
I can see that but how would that account for other tethering options, like tethering your xbox360 and/or playstation. These are the items I mainly tether, and one 30 min TV show on Netflix consumes at least 1 to 2GB. Are there ways to track that?
AndroidSPCS
Android Expert
Good question. I am not an expert on this by any means, don't know what type of traffic xbox360 or PS3 generates. Perhaps someone more familiar with these services can interject.
Medion
Android Expert
While you do need IE to get the update straight from update.windows.com (65.54.51.253), you do not need it to get the same updates from support.microsoft.com (65.54.166.122).
But, I'm glad you pointed this out. Via DNS, they can see the difference. They USED to be on the same server. Clearly that has changed.
But, I'm glad you pointed this out. Via DNS, they can see the difference. They USED to be on the same server. Clearly that has changed.
wmurphy1975
Member
Is this really true? I've been with T-Mobile for years now and have occasionally used my phones as wifi hotspots. I've done it with a Nexus One, G2x, and HTC Sensation but have never had to pay any extra charges.
Granted I don't do it very often and not for very long but I've never seen any notification regarding extra charges.
Roze
Hiding behind a mystery
I don't think the carriers care if you are a small time tetherer. It's when you use dozens upon dozens GB of your data plan with tethering. Well that's who I have read that got notified by the other carriers