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Root Is the bootloader, the be-all, end-all?

Palmetto Fellow

Palmetto Fellow

Android Expert
I was wondering what sorts of catastrophic events could take place rendering a phone useless. If your bootloader gets corrupted, or deleted, I assume it doesn't matter that you have a recovery does it? Do we need the bootloader in order to load up the recovery?

Obtaining S-OFF makes the bootloader writable, and once writable, that implies to me that data can also be lost. Is there a difference between S-ON and S-OFF with regards to bootloader integrity?

With S-ON is it possible to somehow lose the bootloader? I assume a strong magnet would delete the info either way, but what sorts of protections are in place with S-ON?

If I am not mistaken, any device that can at least load the bootloader is NOT a brick right? Everything can be fixed if you can get into the bootloader.

So what are all the implications to having a writable bootloader? if anyone loses the bootloader, is the phone a gone'r? Is there any way to connect to it and load a bootloader without first having a working bootloader?
 
Palmetto Fellow said:
With S-ON is it possible to somehow lose the bootloader? I assume a strong magnet would delete the info either way, but what sorts of protections are in place with S-ON?
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Can't answer the other questions as I'm not an expert on how Android works, but I can tell you a strong magnet wouldn't do anything. The bootloader (along with all other data on Androids) is stored on flash memory chips which are not magnetic and thus are not affected by them. The only storage mechanisms affected are ones that use magnetization to store data (ie hard drives, floppy disks, etc).
 
Brian706 said:
Read these two posts by Scotty85. Very good explanations about s-on/off that I think will answer all (or most) of the questions you asked. It's a little lengthy but full of good information.
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Thanks for the link.

His comment about the engineering (ENG) 1.04 hboot is the reason why I recommend the JBear 1.50.5050 hboot for those users that want to run GB and/or AOSP based ROM's:

*what is a patched hboot?

a "patched" hboot is simply an hboot that has been patched to provide some or all of the same commands as a real engineering hboot. They can be considered safer than a real eng hboot,since they are generally made of newer, more reliable hboot versions. eng hboots have generally been around since prior to the phones release. a patched hboot also can block itself from being overwritten by other hboots, which can be a huge advantage on phones where the radio secure flag is actually "on" as the s-off hboot will always remain,even if OTAs are taken,or RUUs run.

the thunderbolts revolutionary patched hboot is a prime example of a ship hboot patched for eng commands,and preventing itself from being over written.
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ramjet73
 
Any magnet strong enough to mess with flash memory would be dangerous in its own right, the kind that would crush your hand if it got caught between two of them. Even then it might not totally screw it over (the flash memory, I mean).
 
ramjet73 said:
Thanks for the link.

His comment about the engineering (ENG) 1.04 hboot is the reason why I recommend the JBear 1.50.5050 hboot for those users that want to run GB and/or AOSP based ROM's:



ramjet73
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ramjet, I've seen you post a lot about how the 1.50.5050 hboot is preferable to the 1.04 and I'm trying to figure out if it is worthwhile for me to change to the 1.50. When I made my phone s-off originally I downgraded to the 1.04 hboot and it's worked fine ever since. I'm very hesitant to "fix what ain't broke", is there any reason for me to upgrade? If I want to upgrade where can I find the 1.50.5050 hboot?

Thanks!
 
ochenta said:
ramjet, I've seen you post a lot about how the 1.50.5050 hboot is preferable to the 1.04 and I'm trying to figure out if it is worthwhile for me to change to the 1.50. When I made my phone s-off originally I downgraded to the 1.04 hboot and it's worked fine ever since. I'm very hesitant to "fix what ain't broke", is there any reason for me to upgrade? If I want to upgrade where can I find the 1.50.5050 hboot?

Thanks!
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Stick with what you have if it's working unless you start having issues with flashing or booting new ROM's. Being S-OFF you can easily flash the RUU and one of joe_blow's all-in-one files if you start having problems in the future.

I do believe the JBear 1.50.5050 hboot is a better choice for most users, but if you are not having any issues using the ENG 1.04 version stay with that until you do.

OTOH, I think it is better for users new to rooting and S-OFF to start with more current radio and hboot firmware since the original "fix everything" thread was only a band-aid until VM addressed the firmware issues.

ramjet73
 
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