Google data collection - can we fight it?

[DroidsIsPerfecked!!!]

Except that this isn't anything new. Servers have always kept logs and tracking cookies have been around forever.

Also
Opt-out of data collection by Google on my handset? - Android Help

Hoo-boy, tracking cookies have been around forever? Even if they were, then that would make them OK, son? I remember a world with no computers in any houses. I will never forget the shock when the world's first malicious virus attack was reported. The internet was still just a dream, and when it finally launched after a decade and a half of data dissemination through bendy floppy disks which were bigger than CDs, each with a total capacity of 360K, commerce had absolutely nothing to do with it's beginnings! It was at least five, close to 10 years later that we first started hearing about cookies, and saw targeted ads. Maybe this just had to happen, but if you weren't there, you wouldn't understand the feeling of something good having been lost. Then again, I suppose you wonder how I could remember all this, and not be too old to worry about my own future!

 

[dreamsensei]

Hoo-boy, tracking cookies have been around forever? Even if they were, then that would make them OK, son? I remember a world with no computers in any houses. I will never forget the shock when the world's first malicious virus attack was reported. The internet was still just a dream, and when it finally launched after a decade and a half of data dissemination through bendy floppy disks which were bigger than CDs, each with a total capacity of 360K, commerce had absolutely nothing to do with it's beginnings! It was at least five, close to 10 years later that we first started hearing about cookies, and saw targeted ads. Maybe this just had to happen, but if you weren't there, you wouldn't understand the feeling of something good having been lost. Then again, I suppose you wonder how I could remember all this, and not be too old to worry about my own future!

First of all, pulling the age card will do you no good. Do not refer to another human being as "son" unless they are related to you. It is disrespectful and condescending. There are also plenty of people who visit this forum that likely can match or beat the value of your age card.

Secondly, "Cookies" have been around since 1995, which easily qualifies them as "old hat" in terms of the Internet and mass consumption.

Thirdly, and most important : YOU HAVE A CHOICE. If you feel that your life, and the information revolving around it, are so important that the details of the aforementioned need to be safe and secure, then, by all means, stop opening yourself up to everyone. It is COMMON KNOWLEDGE that information about your browsing habits will be aggregated in an effort to refine a multitude of things ranging from simple searches to purchasing habits. The sacrifice of this freedom grants you the bounty that the Internet has to offer.

TLDR : Shit, or get off the pot.

 

[callmeox]

Someone has a bug up their butt about Google and they found a place to grind their personal axe. Bravo.

How has this thread survived in the Inc forum? Isn't there a general Android or "I want something for nothing" forum where it can be moved?

If anyone is surprised that Google collects data as a part of their business model, then they aren't paying attention.

 

[OfTheDamned]

Since this is more of a general topic I'm going to move it to the Android Lounge.

 

[Squintz82]

Yo, Squintz, if you are a web developer, and you think Google tracking is great, well that isn't surprising. But you also said that this spying is used to "protect our privacy"? Would you care to elaborate on that claim?

What I said is that similar technology is used in privacy protection efforts. No one is "spying" on you, but from the tone if your posts, it sounds like you have something to hide. Again, read the google privacy policy... or the privacy policy of any website you surf. As a matter of fact, this very website its collecting pretty much the same data from you right now, lol. So just relax

 

[kejlyCZ]

When I search Google, the only thing they are "spying" is what I type to search dialog (to offer relevant searches, which helps mostly).
The only "spy" thing on Android Phone is collecting data when Wi-Fi positioning is turned on (this can be avoided by using GPS). I think this data are used to determine your position by comparing (and some calculations) nearby Wi-Fi APs, there's not other way how to do it. Many phones do it.
Of course, if you use Google, cookies are collected. Have you ever acessed other websites? Most webs collect more informations (mostly in Flashcookies or Silverlightcookies, which are not so easy to delete) than Google.

 

[Weazol]

I think its really pointless to collect my search data to target ads..
almost everything I search is android related or p90x since I am doing that right now
So everytime I see an ad now it is to buy an android phone or p90x dvds...

 

[DroidsIsPerfecked!!!]

First of all, pulling the age card will do you no good. Do not refer to another human being as "son" unless they are related to you. It is disrespectful and condescending. There are also plenty of people who visit this forum that likely can match or beat the value of your age card.

Secondly, "Cookies" have been around since 1995, which easily qualifies them as "old hat" in terms of the Internet and mass consumption.

Well, exCUUUUZZZe me, sensei sir - from one new member to another!!!

Using the word "son" would have been out of line without the "forever" card having gone into play, and then none of my involvement in this forum has done me much good. In a world where people are duped into believing that some weak card, such as the 3 is powerful, so it is with "forever"! When somebody vindicates something which is controversial (or just plain foul) on the notion that it's been around "forever" (that being long as a kid can remember), this reflects a very immature attitude. It needs to be addressed, in the interest of the future direction of this world, which we all must live in!

Oh, by the way, son, "since 1995" is not anywhere close to "forever"!

Thirdly, and most important : YOU HAVE A CHOICE. If you feel that your life, and the information revolving around it, are so important that the details of the aforementioned need to be safe and secure, then, by all means, stop opening yourself up to everyone. It is COMMON KNOWLEDGE that information about your browsing habits will be aggregated in an effort to refine a multitude of things ranging from simple searches to purchasing habits. The sacrifice of this freedom grants you the bounty that the Internet has to offer.

That is just simple, unadulterated bullshit, and you know it! The average consumer knows what he wants, would sacrifice nothing other than the cost of his user account for the benefits which the Internet has to offer, and the only people who are poised to reap any "bounty" are the Google executives!

TLDR : Shit, or get off the pot.

That is just plain disgusting!

Someone has a bug up their butt about Google and they found a place to grind their personal axe. Bravo.<br />
<br />
How has this thread survived in the Inc forum? Isn't there a general Android or &quot;I want something for nothing&quot; forum where it can be moved?<br />
<br />
If anyone is surprised that Google collects data as a part of their business model, then they aren't paying attention.

Hey, lookie here, we got somebody with a bug up their ass against those who care more about a future NOT ruled completely by Google than Google's profits!

 

[callmeox]

If you think that trolling in an Android forum will change Google's business practices, then knock yourself out.

It is easy to avoid Google if you are so inclined.

 

[Niir]

I dont care what info google gather.

I dont click adds i know what i want and how to get it and if by chance an interesting ad does pop up thats fine.

Android wouldnt be free if Google didnt make a business of collecting information.

 

[contagous]

Well, exCUUUUZZZe me, sensei sir - from one new member to another!!!

Using the word "son" would have been out of line without the "forever" card having gone into play, and then none of my involvement in this forum has done me much good. In a world where people are duped into believing that some weak card, such as the 3 is powerful, so it is with "forever"! When somebody vindicates something which is controversial (or just plain foul) on the notion that it's been around "forever" (that being long as a kid can remember), this reflects a very immature attitude. It needs to be addressed, in the interest of the future direction of this world, which we all must live in!

Oh, by the way, son, "since 1995" is not anywhere close to "forever"!



That is just simple, unadulterated bullshit, and you know it! The average consumer knows what he wants, would sacrifice nothing other than the cost of his user account for the benefits which the Internet has to offer, and the only people who are poised to reap any "bounty" are the Google executives!


That is just plain disgusting!



Hey, lookie here, we got somebody with a bug up their ass against those who care more about a future NOT ruled completely by Google than Google's profits!

Ok now your just being a jerk, I suggest you unplug your internet cable from your computer wrap it around the monitor, now power off your computer and sit everything in a round garbage can big enough. Then light it on fire and dance round naked....

After this don't ever go online again, as you seem to scared to be doing so, Tape up your windows and doors and live in your dream world of safe and security

But serious stop effing trolling now, this is getting ridiculous, if you think Google is the devil, tell them, A android phone board is probably not the best place...

Have a nice day

 

[AndroidSPCS]

OP - no one's holding a gun to your head and telling you to use it. If you're paranoid about it then don't use it.

Simple answer.

 

[Slug]

If you're paranoid about it then don't use it.

This.

I'll also take this opportunity to remind everyone of the Forum Rules prohibiting disrespectful posts and personal attacks. Keep it clean and keep it civil, please.

 

[BobPaul]

It shouldn't matter whether you have anything to hide, .......................................search engines like Google record your every move, collect it into permanent, and highly personal files on all who use them, a........................

You are exactly correct. It saddens me to read all the replies that told you that your fears are without merit.

Seems that people such as yourself are in the vast minority of people, such as myself, that value privacy. Most people are brainwashed into just accepting that privacy does not exist. I find it funny that most of these same people uphold one of their pet laws, abortion, thru an argument that people have a fundamental right to privacy but get off that topic and they throw the right to privacy our the window.

A question to all, U.S. citizens, that say "if you've nothing to hide you've nothing to worry about", do you believe and would you exercise your 5th Amendment rights? Also, do you believe that Roe vs Wade was correct in its premise of privacy rights?

 

[gruss]

More of the Google-Is-God-On-Snark-Patrol mentality!

The basic reasons that business needs to be regulated, and then needs to be much, much more tightly than they are:
#1 - When one business makes, and controls too much money, they become either impossible for most consumers to avoid, or they all (all 2 or 3 of them) become unacceptably hostile for most consumers.
#2 - September of 2008!

So you want them regulated by who? The government? I'm patrolling for Google? Dude your going on ignore, you call android users ignorant, you obviously have an issue with Google but you use their services, and buy products using their software. Your like the people who complain about Walmart, want them to change their practices but shop their for everything.
I told you how to fight it, don't use/buy it, doesn't get any simpler.

 

[Demache]

You are exactly correct. It saddens me to read all the replies that told you that your fears are without merit.

Seems that people such as yourself are in the vast minority of people, such as myself, that value privacy. Most people are brainwashed into just accepting that privacy does not exist. I find it funny that most of these same people uphold one of their pet laws, abortion, thru an argument that people have a fundamental right to privacy but get off that topic and they throw the right to privacy our the window.

A question to all, U.S. citizens, that say "if you've nothing to hide you've nothing to worry about", do you believe and would you exercise your 5th Amendment rights? Also, do you believe that Roe vs Wade was correct in its premise of privacy rights?

I'm not here to say "you have nothing to worry about". It is very true that if that personal data is used incorrectly in the wrong hands, it can have very serious side effects.

However, you would have to take many measures to finding true privacy on the internet. Browse through a proxy (sort of iffy, since the proxy could log your info), never create an account for any site, create your own email server and etc. And data collection is something companies do, and is not exclusive to Google (but you probably already knew that). They generally use it to help the customer, or to help themselves by analyzing that info.

Sure its something I care about, and is sometimes troubling. But if I kept fretting over what Amazon would do with me buying a Linksys router a month ago, or that Wells Fargo knows I went to Burger King for lunch, it would surely drive me insane.

 

[Drhyde]

You are exactly correct. It saddens me to read all the replies that told you that your fears are without merit.

Seems that people such as yourself are in the vast minority of people, such as myself, that value privacy. Most people are brainwashed into just accepting that privacy does not exist. I find it funny that most of these same people uphold one of their pet laws, abortion, thru an argument that people have a fundamental right to privacy but get off that topic and they throw the right to privacy our the window.

A question to all, U.S. citizens, that say "if you've nothing to hide you've nothing to worry about", do you believe and would you exercise your 5th Amendment rights? Also, do you believe that Roe vs Wade was correct in its premise of privacy rights?

I have to say that privacy on the internet died the day it was born. I don't really see how abortion issues relate to Google data collection. Abortion is deeply personal choice created by circumstances possibly beyond your control whereas the internet is by choice. Just because the technology has become ubiquitous doesn't mean you have to use it. It has already been posted by others that virtually every site you visit grabs a bit of data (personal or otherwise). My 5th amendment right pertains to me being accused of a crime, not looking up information. The general consensus around here is if you don't feel comfortable with it, don't use it. There are a lot of older folks, senior citizen range, that won't even use a computer because they can't understand, don't understand, or don't trust it and they get by just fine in this world (and are also the primary targets of scams and identity theft). In an ironic twist, if you want to prevent sites from mining data, Google it. You'll probably find your answer.

 

[DroidsIsPerfecked!!!]

You are exactly correct. It saddens me to read all the replies that told you that your fears are without merit.

Seems that people such as yourself are in the vast minority of people, such as myself, that value privacy. Most people are brainwashed into just accepting that privacy does not exist. I find it funny that most of these same people uphold one of their pet laws, abortion, thru an argument that people have a fundamental right to privacy but get off that topic and they throw the right to privacy our the window.

A question to all, U.S. citizens, that say "if you've nothing to hide you've nothing to worry about", do you believe and would you exercise your 5th Amendment rights? Also, do you believe that Roe vs Wade was correct in its premise of privacy rights?

Thanks for your support!

As for people like us being alone, at this point (and sadly a few days beyond my 30-day return period), it seems that it's more true in the Android community than elsewhere. Anyway, there would be a disproportionate percentage Google employees trolling any Google-Droid forum, and the rest who follow tend to be younger, and much dumber about the world (if not tech) than most iphone users.

 

[DroidsIsPerfecked!!!]

If you think that trolling in an Android forum will change Google's business practices, then knock yourself out.

It is easy to avoid Google if you are so inclined.

Trolling? Who the hell is trolling? This is my OP! Which, btw, was posed neither on troll (necessarily an oxymoron when applied to the OP member) nor rant, but questions and solutions for those who understand just how good this world can be at using your collected data (no matter who you are) against you.

The problem is that most readers in this forum either haven't the attention span to read the OP all the way through, or they respond only for the purpose of trolling. Had one of the mods here even read my OP, rather than respond to the tone of all the negative responses,

Since this is more of a general topic I'm going to move it to the Android Lounge.

than this would not have been moved to "the lounge"!

Anyway, here's repeating the questions: Is there more than the Google site which is involved in user data collection? Dolphin, or the Android system? I need to know which level this is at.

If it's just the google site, I have already reset my homepage to ssl.scroogle.org, which does not collect your data - this is fairly easy for anyone to do in the Dolphin settings. If it's that simple, then great, but I still don't know that.

If data is transmitted back to Google at browser level, Dolphin is no longer the only browser available for Android, although Opera (which I can't stand anyway) is owned by Google. Firefox has always been the best browser for PCs, and has not been known to work for cyberspies. They have an Android app under development (testing versions are available at the Mozilla site, but it still may be awhile before it's ready for prime time). Anyone know of other browsers for Android which will run on HTC Inc?

If the data collection goes as high as the OS level, then there may not be much that I can do, other than throw the "do not collect my data" switch, for what it's worth. I took care of that first thing, but excuse me for not trusting a company which is already reputed for it's underhanded and hugely hypocritical ("don't be evil") business policies.

A shocking number of you responded as if the Google people (or anyone) has the absolute right to go behind my back and use ME, who paid for their product, to enrich themselves without my full, informed consent. They would track me everywhere I go, everything I do, and everything I say, if I weren't aware enough to take protective measures. If you believe this is their right, then maybe you could explain to me why it would truly be wrong of me to follow you around physically, spying on you from the shadows, and collecting enough information that I can mess with your mind (targeted ads from anonymous sources, or any con job, there's hardly a difference). What, there are laws against that?

 

[AndroidSPCS]

Trolling? Who the hell is trolling? ....A shocking number of you responded as if the Google people (or anyone) has the absolute right to go behind my back and use ME, who paid for their product, to enrich themselves without my full, informed consent. They would track me everywhere I go, everything I do, and everything I say, if I weren't aware enough to take protective measures. If you believe this is their right, then maybe you could explain to me why it would truly be wrong of me to follow you around physically, spying on you from the shadows, and collecting enough information that I can mess with your mind (targeted ads from anonymous sources, or any con job, there's hardly a difference). What, there are laws against that?

I do believe that you are trolling, whether you believe it or not.

Secondly, you didn't pay Google for their product. Android is FREE. You paid the manufacturer of the phone / carrier for a product and service, but Google got absolutely nothing from your purchase.

Thirdly, you CAN turn off the GPS, network tracking, so they can't track anywhere you go. Besides, who cares where you go? Are you somehow more special than the rest of us?

I'm scared that Google knows I went to the gym, or the Walmart, or to Burger King for lunch?

If anything, it's not google that I'm concerned about, it's 3rd party apps that potentially can exploit your information that I'm concerned about.

This is why I do not use 3rd party Facebook apps, or 3rd party RSS readers that require my gmail account login info.

Do you have an email account? If not with Google with what provider? Hotmail? Yahoo? Your own ISP hosted email? Someone somewhere always has some information about you, if you want to be on the internet.

Lastly, and this is the most important - using Google services is OPTIONAL. No one is telling you or anyone else that you HAVE to use their services. Most people are rational, intelligent human beings who can consider the pros and cons of using a service like Google, and decide if the Pros are worth the Cons to use.

Unlike what you presume, we are NOT blind to the ability of ISPs, search providers, websites, etc to collect data about us. We just choose to take reasonable precautions and use the service for the benefits they provide.

I am a paranoid person about security, this is why I have 4 facebook accounts (one real with no activity, one for just stupid FB apps so apps can't get data about me, one for casual acquaintances like people from the gym, and one with an alias for real use with friends / family to share / see photos, etc). I think I'm more paranoid than most people, but even for me, your stance is completely unreasonable and wrong.

If you're so paranoid, I suggest you follow the actions of this guy: The most isolated man on the planet. - By Monte Reel - Slate Magazine

Good luck being off the grid.

 

[CodeMonkey]

The more I post here, and the more posts I read here, the more I become sure that the Android community is one of ignoramuses and babies!

+

#1 - It's about respect - if you want to be treated with respect, you need to give it!

=

Does not compute.

 

[DroidsIsPerfecked!!!]

I do believe that you are trolling, whether you believe it or not.

Secondly, you didn't pay Google for their product. Android is FREE. You paid the manufacturer of the phone / carrier for a product and service, but Google got absolutely nothing from your purchase.

Thirdly, you CAN turn off the GPS, network tracking, so they can't track anywhere you go. Besides, who cares where you go? Are you somehow more special than the rest of us?

I'm scared that Google knows I went to the gym, or the Walmart, or to Burger King for lunch?

If anything, it's not google that I'm concerned about, it's 3rd party apps that potentially can exploit your information that I'm concerned about.

This is why I do not use 3rd party Facebook apps, or 3rd party RSS readers that require my gmail account login info.

Do you have an email account? If not with Google with what provider? Hotmail? Yahoo? Your own ISP hosted email? Someone somewhere always has some information about you, if you want to be on the internet.

Lastly, and this is the most important - using Google services is OPTIONAL. No one is telling you or anyone else that you HAVE to use their services. Most people are rational, intelligent human beings who can consider the pros and cons of using a service like Google, and decide if the Pros are worth the Cons to use.

Unlike what you presume, we are NOT blind to the ability of ISPs, search providers, websites, etc to collect data about us. We just choose to take reasonable precautions and use the service for the benefits they provide.

I am a paranoid person about security, this is why I have 4 facebook accounts (one real with no activity, one for just stupid FB apps so apps can't get data about me, one for casual acquaintances like people from the gym, and one with an alias for real use with friends / family to share / see photos, etc). I think I'm more paranoid than most people, but even for me, your stance is completely unreasonable and wrong.

If you're so paranoid, I suggest you follow the actions of this guy: The most isolated man on the planet. - By Monte Reel - Slate Magazine

Good luck being off the grid.

Wow!

Ask the wrong question, and 100 Google-programmed trolls will descend on you, accusing YOU of trolling!!! Get f&cking real - I do have the right to be critical of Google without being called a troll for it! The hypocrisy on this forum is so thick, you could cut a billboard banner out of it, and paste on some annoying (and much too personal) ad!

You don't care if Google knows that you went to Burger King for lunch, or whether or not you go to a gym? You will when your insurance company denies you treatment coverage when you get ill, based on your dirt which they bought from Google! I suppose you even think it would be fair, being all your fault for eating french fries and whoppers when you just couldn't make time to eat better, not excercising enough, spending too much time trolling on forums, or spending too much time in your car so that your kids can get to their soccer games! You would think it's fair if you never lived outside of his mother's house, or has inherited enough money to hire servants, not forced to work at a desk for a living, leaving you unlimited time to spend in the gym, and in health food stores! Sure, it's fair alright, in that Burger King is also buying Google data, for use in perfecting the ad techniques which started, and now sustain your junk food addictions! Information is power - if it wasn't, then Google wouldn't be spending the money to log it all. It's the power to make someone's money, to take someone's money, or to deny someone money which is due, no matter how much money they already took as insurance premiums. This ain't hypothetical, it's being used like this in the world right now, and then I'm sure you have heard of how Google's half-baked info is used by ignoramus employers. If you aren't concerned with any of the above, then maybe you will change your mind when you get to experience some of it first-hand.

I have repeated my questions for the second time, and while there have been many responses, not one of my questions was answered. Plainly, there is a lot more interest in SUPPRESSING questions in this forum than in answering them!

I'm not paranoid at all, I just don't like being used in some sneaky, creepy fashion, and being known by ad-spewing bots by my first name (I have actually seen such ads before)! I doubt that my own career could easily be impacted by anyone who would use my online tracks against me, although there are some where I would definitely be sweating it.

I do believe I am truly wasting my time discussing personal security issues here - most of you, just like so many mindless, brainwashed "droids", have made it clear that you think sneaky, creepy online stalking is just perfectly OK! I have better things to do, and unfortunately more now that I'm stuck with Google spyware for my phone OS, but there are wiser people elsewhere who never lose their will to fry your Google circuits! I've had enough of this - good bye!

 

[OfTheDamned]

The problem is that most readers in this forum either haven't the attention span to read the OP all the way through, or they respond only for the purpose of trolling. Had one of the mods here even read my OP, rather than respond to the tone of all the negative responses,

than this would not have been moved to "the lounge"!

Just to make things clear, I did read your original post and I moved it because it is a general Android question and not something specific to the Incredible.


As far as the rest of this thread goes,


Some of you really need to relax and realize that not everyone making a comment against Android, Google or the specific phone you carry is a troll. There are people with legitimate concerns about their privacy. While many will agree that true privacy is more or less a thing of the past, there are those that would like to remain as anonymous as they can while online. This doesn't make them the butt of every tinfoil hat joke you can think up.

Please remember the rules as well as the zero tolerance policy when posting. There is no reason at all for a majority of the comments made in this thread. A very interesting discussion could have come from this thread if most of you had not decided to call the OP and others trolls in every single post.

 

[DroidsIsPerfecked!!!]

Just to make things clear, I did read your original post and I moved it because it is a general Android question and not something specific to the Incredible.

This may be true, but the "lounge" environment invites trolls everywhere - people go there to sound off, not deal with questions! I do appreciate what you said just now, but it really didn't help the purpose of getting questions answered by moving this thread here.

 

[AndroidSPCS]

This thread has really run its course. There is nothing that can be said. This is painfully obvious to everyone but one or two individuals out there.