iPhone OS 4.0

[IOWA]

Can't anyone here have a discussion without resorting to veiled insults or name-calling?

Btw, a post from an Android user daring to give Apple a modicum of credit is no more of a troll than another Android user posting anti-Apple threads.

@justin


I did not call you a troll, I made a general statement. My apologies if that wasn't clear.

And to slug, I give credit where credit is due. My "anti-apple" threads have been nothing but truthful, have they not?

 

[moijk]

lol... all I have to say is apple tried the same approach in the 80's. They lost. Winmo/palm are the ones who truely innovated the smartphone market, not apple. Funny part is, I had a sanyo mm8300. That flipphone, could do what most of the original iphone could do. Hell it even had 3g. I hate how people are so blinded by apples media crap as innovation. Apple didn't innovate anything for a phone. They took already exisiting things, and used them and rode the success of the ipod. The ipod was and is the only product from apple worth buying, but they are losing that marketshare too. Iphone will go dead, android is the iphone killer. Android currenty has a higher app store growth rate and adoptions than iphone did in the same time frame.

Newton entered the marked a bit too early, the technology wasn't mature enough to be sold at the right price.

Palm however was more right, and yes, the iPhone (and android) have much to thank the experience gained by Palms products. Your old mm8300 however was a strange comparison. If you have said Treo you're in the right category however. But it's not the form factor or the idea of a smartphone. It's the complete package.

I'm quite sure android will be the dominant mobile platform just by the sheer amount of companies taking it in use, but I doubt anyone will die anytime soon. Blackberry OS, WebOS, Symbian and the new Bada from Samsung will live on in their respective handsets. But at one point the number of OSes will have to go down because iphone os, WinMo and Android will attract the biggest number of developers making those platforms more and more attractive towards the end users. And of those Android has a head start. WinMo 7 is a fresh start and will count on .NET developers targeting that platform, and iphone os has a good foundation.

So no, Android is no iphone killer. It is the biggest rival to iphone. The difference is that both will prevail.

 

[JustinL]

@justin


I did not call you a troll, I made a general statement. My apologies if that wasn't clear.

And to slug, I give credit where credit is due. My "anti-apple" threads have been nothing but truthful, have they not?

IOWA,

Thanks for clearing that up. I guess we can move on now

 

[IOWA]

Newton entered the marked a bit too early, the technology wasn't mature enough to be sold at the right price.

Palm however was more right, and yes, the iPhone (and android) have much to thank the experience gained by Palms products. Your old mm8300 however was a strange comparison. If you have said Treo you're in the right category however. But it's not the form factor or the idea of a smartphone. It's the complete package.

I'm quite sure android will be the dominant mobile platform just by the sheer amount of companies taking it in use, but I doubt anyone will die anytime soon. Blackberry OS, WebOS, Symbian and the new Bada from Samsung will live on in their respective handsets. But at one point the number of OSes will have to go down because iphone os, WinMo and Android will attract the biggest number of developers making those platforms more and more attractive towards the end users. And of those Android has a head start. WinMo 7 is a fresh start and will count on .NET developers targeting that platform, and iphone os has a good foundation.

So no, Android is no iphone killer. It is the biggest rival to iphone. The difference is that both will prevail.

I actually did have a treo 650 and a centro =P

 

[moijk]

I actually did have a treo 650 and a centro =P

Pity Palm is up for grabs now. Wonder what happends to WebOS.

Palm Said to Tap Goldman, Quattrone to Find Buyers (Update3) - Bloomberg.com

 

[IOWA]

Pity Palm is up for grabs now. Wonder what happends to WebOS.

Palm Said to Tap Goldman, Quattrone to Find Buyers (Update3) - Bloomberg.com

Thats only speculation thus far.

 

[fatflatfly]

Android currenty has a higher app store growth rate and adoptions than iphone did in the same time frame.

Yeah but where is the quality, all i see is ports of java games,themes,and naked picture apps. Higher growth of crap

 

[Zenstrive]

I will go on tangent here and say this:

ASIANS are SMARTER and less brainwashed than AMERICANS when choosing their smartphones. We have choices of locked and unlocked cool smartphones for ages now, we look at iPhone with a "what the heck is this limited one trick pony doing here?" and only the stupidest rich guys among us buy the iPhone for "the glitters"

Android? Oh boy, just mention HTC (loved brand) and Google (loved brand) are marrying and we are marching toward them, wallet open and heart pounding. Now Sony Ericsson and Samsung too? Wow, we are elated.

Apple iPhone got multitasking? Huh? That supposes to be revolutionary? Oh boy oh boy, now everyone wonders why the Americans are considered Superpower.

Google is stupid not to focus on ASIANS to spread their ANDROID.

I (an Indonesian) for one love to have Nexus One, but the thing is not available here legally! Stupid, stupid Google. Now the biggest carrier here have been (failingly) peddling locked iPhone 3GS. No one with sane mind here buy that. Only the stupidest among us do.

So Google: Asians, okay?

 

[IOWA]

I will go on tangent here and say this:

ASIANS are SMARTER and less brainwashed than AMERICANS when choosing their smartphones. We have choices of locked and unlocked cool smartphones for ages now, we look at iPhone with a "what the heck is this limited one trick pony doing here?" and only the stupidest rich guys among us buy the iPhone for "the glitters"

Android? Oh boy, just mention HTC (loved brand) and Google (loved brand) are marrying and we are marching toward them, wallet open and heart pounding. Now Sony Ericsson and Samsung too? Wow, we are elated.

Apple iPhone got multitasking? Huh? That supposes to be revolutionary? Oh boy oh boy, now everyone wonders why the Americans are considered Superpower.

Google is stupid not to focus on ASIANS to spread their ANDROID.

I (an Indonesian) for one love to have Nexus One, but the thing is not available here legally! Stupid, stupid Google. Now the biggest carrier here have been (failingly) peddling locked iPhone 3GS. No one with sane mind here buy that. Only the stupidest among us do.

So Google: Asians, okay?

What's with the name calling bud? Trying to start a race war? Sheesh.

 

[bbrosen]

I'm sure it is amusing to non-geeks, but I find the approach Apple has quite intruiging.

Folders and wallpapers might not be very groundbreaking - to Android users it sounds very trivial.

But I like the local and remote push notifications, the limitations in which the apps can be written and the approach towards multitasking.

When you limit the languages the apps can be written in to C/C++/Objective C written towards the device apis and not any third party ones, you got the right tool for the job. You don't get some quick and dirty port or created with generators that might not end up with an optimized experience. And even how much that might pain some developers, it'll be all good for the end users.

Same goes for the multitasking. Only certain kind of software will be able to multitask, and only the processes needed will remain in memory when the task is switched away. This will minimize the memory footprint of the background app(s).

I've never head of any public development platform ever beeing enforced such rules, but I'm impressed by the balls that Apple has with doing so. After growing up with the vic 20, c64 and the amiga I look back in retrospect in amazement on what they managed to get out of the limited resources. Apple seem to be very protective of the quality and resources of the iphone experience by enforcing such rules, and I find that a good thing.

Not that it'll make me consider switching to an iphone. I'd rather write java apps and live with the possible bloat it adds by beeing a higher level language than c/c++/objective c. Maybe in some years, if Android haven't squished iphone os into an computer historic event that happened around the end of the first decade of the new millenium.

Well said!

 

[AndroFan]

Apple is just playing catch up now.

 

[IOWA]

Apple is just playing catch up now.

Agreed. At the pace android is moving, it won't be long before iphone os is not only left in the dust, it'll be buried paved over and stomped on.

 

[TheBrit]

What's with the name calling bud? Trying to start a race war? Sheesh.

Without the name-calling what he is saying is true.

 

[IOWA]

Without the name-calling what he is saying is true.

Not really. Its still a fact the majority of iphone owners are kids in their tweens trying to look cool. most rational adults have blackberries winmo or android. Or a dumbphone.

 

[TheBrit]

Not really. Its still a fact the majority of iphone owners are kids in their tweens trying to look cool. most rational adults have blackberries winmo or android. Or a dumbphone.

I was teasing.

I expect iPhone will go the way of Apple Macintosh in the 1980's and 90's being such a closed eco-system. There's a lot of WTFs in the news right now (in the UK) with developers saying they will abandon iPhone over the new OS4.0 T&Cs.

 

[IOWA]

I was teasing.

I expect iPhone will go the way of Apple Macintosh in the 1980's and 90's being such a closed eco-system. There's a lot of WTFs in the news right now (in the UK) with developers saying they will abandon iPhone over the new OS4.0 T&Cs.

Yep yep. A lot of devs are flat out gone now. Including quite a few big names, like firefox, ea, and a couple others.

 

[moijk]

Not really. Its still a fact the majority of iphone owners are kids in their tweens trying to look cool. most rational adults have blackberries winmo or android. Or a dumbphone.

4 of 10 BlackBerry owners want iPhone next | Electronista

Shows the loyalty and platform vs platform. Android users seem to dislike iphone more than iphone users dislike android. Probably more than one IOWA around.

iPhone owners more likely to recommend than Android, webOS | Electronista

But iphone users are more likely to recommend the platform than say android users. How come? (reasoned answers preferred. not "because they are raging fanboys")

What is impressive is that the downloads on Android is just as high as with iphone. that is good news for android developers.

 

[IOWA]

4 of 10 BlackBerry owners want iPhone next | Electronista

Shows the loyalty and platform vs platform. Android users seem to dislike iphone more than iphone users dislike android. Probably more than one IOWA around.

iPhone owners more likely to recommend than Android, webOS | Electronista

But iphone users are more likely to recommend the platform than say android users. How come? (reasoned answers preferred. not "because they are raging fanboys")

What is impressive is that the downloads on Android is just as high as with iphone. that is good news for android developers.

Why do people continuously submit flawed surveys as some sort of proof?

Android owners dislike iphones, and apple in general, because they see they are a totalitarian company who lies boldly in your face without flinching.


A whole 7% difference on that survey, well, given the acceptable margin of error, and that android is still a toddler, iand 95% of iphone owners only own the phone because it "looks cool", id say android definately has the upper hand here.

For the apps thing, android is going to pull far ahead of iphone in that category. Especially with the new ridculous tos on the sdk.

 

[moijk]

Why do people continuously submit flawed surveys as some sort of proof?

Android owners dislike iphones, and apple in general, because they see they are a totalitarian company who lies boldly in your face without flinching.

So, what have apple lied about?

totalitarian.. Thats Microsoft. Their new WinMo 7 with the two new Kin One and Kin Two. Microsoft os and only Microsoft applications, every photo you take is stored on their servers, and its only connected to the zune services.

A whole 7% difference on that survey, well, given the acceptable margin of error, and that android is still a toddler, iand 95% of iphone owners only own the phone because it "looks cool", id say android definately has the upper hand here.

In other posts, you claim iphone os beeing a blatant android copy. In this discussion android is a toddler.

Beside that, I'd like to see a survey that says 95% of the iphone owners bought it because it "looks cool". In fact, I'd love to see any proof for your arguments here. Like that EA is leaving because of the new 4.0 sdk?

 

[SithSurfer]

And since when did you NEED a mac to do work, when you can get a PC that costs less and is equal to or BETTER then mac software.

I have to use a current gen imac in class, I have to use an 8 year old pc at home and when I am running photoshop, dreamweaver, indesign, or illustrator I have zero problems with the programs running at home. At school the programs freeze hourly.

If it were not for adobe, mac would not have been the preferred computer of choice for designers. Now that Apple err Steve Jobs wants to have a pissing match, Adobe should not let their products work on a mac....apple started it, Adobe should finish it...

Surely you will be happy to compensate my and other studio's to buy PC's? Or maybe Adobe which makes loads on Mac apps? How do you imagine that happening? Hey lads, we don't need Apple customers money anymore, let's give our share of that market so someone! There is a constant battle over the design software and if Adobe will pull out someone else will take its place.

I've never said that Mac's are better than PC's, bleah, I use PC and quite a few laptops running Win7 at home myself (+1 MacBookPro which I've got from my work). I don't see a point of paying

 

[IOWA]

So, what have apple lied about?

totalitarian.. Thats Microsoft. Their new WinMo 7 with the two new Kin One and Kin Two. Microsoft os and only Microsoft applications, every photo you take is stored on their servers, and its only connected to the zune services.

Please find where microsoft said that. They didn't. Now your just making stuff up. As far as I'm concerned both apple and microsoft are becoming totalitarian so your point is moot anyway.

In other posts, you claim iphone os beeing a blatant android copy. In this discussion android is a toddler.

Beside that, I'd like to see a survey that says 95% of the iphone owners bought it because it "looks cool". In fact, I'd love to see any proof for your arguments here. Like that EA is leaving because of the new 4.0 sdk?

Here's a new term for you. Google. Search. And to this day, everytime I've asked iphone owner why they bought an iphone, all they said, was I don't know, or "its an iphone everyone has one". Try it yourself.

 

[moijk]

Please find where microsoft said that. They didn't. Now your just making stuff up. As far as I'm concerned both apple and microsoft are becoming totalitarian so your point is moot anyway.

Microsoft Kin One and Kin Two announced: Windows Phone roots with a social slant (updated with video) -- Engadget

"and surprisingly, zero support for third-party apps. The displays are capacitive with support for multitouch (yes, you can pinch and zoom in the browser), but there's no support for in-browser Flash or Silverlight."

Well, they are probably not prime example of what winmo7 will be like. But it's the same underpinnings.

Here's a new term for you. Google. Search. And to this day, everytime I've asked iphone owner why they bought an iphone, all they said, was I don't know, or "its an iphone everyone has one". Try it yourself.

So when you say something like 95% something, I have to google that to try find anything that validates your very specific claim? You would be a hoot in political debates. Someone question your arguments? "Google it!"

So, since you are too lazy, I googled it:

GameSpot Forums - iPhone and Mobile Gaming - why did you buy and ipod touch or iphone

you have your "i bought my iphone because it just looks so cool.", and you have the more well thought of reaons like this one:

"I basically cover both the marketing and communications divisions at my company, so I found the iPhone to be a great way to keep up with my e-mails that I constantly receive.


I actually find the touchscreen keyboard better than what I previously had on my Blackberry, and these days (since they now allow you to rotate the screen), I can type with both of my thumbs almost as quickly as I can on a real keyboard. It's great for work.


I also loved the music quality and ease of use of the iPod portion, which is particularly nice since every day I ride to work on a noisy train, and drowning out that noise is nice. I also do photography as a hobby, and the iPhone has a tremendously easy and elegant way of showing photos I've taken with my other camera to other people in interviews--not to mention the photo quality of the screen (even if the camera itself is lacking).


Most of all, I wanted to be able to read on the train. It's often crammed full of people on my commute, but the Kindle app on the iphone allows me to read whatever book I want without the other people getting annoyed by me accidentally hitting them while turning the pages or something. Even the Kindle proper falls short of the iPhone in these conditions.


I have a lot of games, but they never really factored in to my purchase. Although my wife and I enjoy playing games like Scrabble back and forth when we're in a waiting room or something.
Oh, and it looked cool."

Seem perfectly happy, just as there are many perfectly happy android users here. I can't see why you keep saying users like this one has in some way made a bad choice.

 

[PurpleSkyz]

Microsoft Kin One and Kin Two announced: Windows Phone roots with a social slant (updated with video) -- Engadget

"and surprisingly, zero support for third-party apps. The displays are capacitive with support for multitouch (yes, you can pinch and zoom in the browser), but there's no support for in-browser Flash or Silverlight."

Well, they are probably not prime example of what winmo7 will be like. But it's the same underpinnings.



So when you say something like 95% something, I have to google that to try find anything that validates your very specific claim? You would be a hoot in political debates. Someone question your arguments? "Google it!"

So, since you are too lazy, I googled it:

GameSpot Forums - iPhone and Mobile Gaming - why did you buy and ipod touch or iphone

you have your "i bought my iphone because it just looks so cool.", and you have the more well thought of reaons like this one:

"I basically cover both the marketing and communications divisions at my company, so I found the iPhone to be a great way to keep up with my e-mails that I constantly receive.


I actually find the touchscreen keyboard better than what I previously had on my Blackberry, and these days (since they now allow you to rotate the screen), I can type with both of my thumbs almost as quickly as I can on a real keyboard. It's great for work.


I also loved the music quality and ease of use of the iPod portion, which is particularly nice since every day I ride to work on a noisy train, and drowning out that noise is nice. I also do photography as a hobby, and the iPhone has a tremendously easy and elegant way of showing photos I've taken with my other camera to other people in interviews--not to mention the photo quality of the screen (even if the camera itself is lacking).


Most of all, I wanted to be able to read on the train. It's often crammed full of people on my commute, but the Kindle app on the iphone allows me to read whatever book I want without the other people getting annoyed by me accidentally hitting them while turning the pages or something. Even the Kindle proper falls short of the iPhone in these conditions.


I have a lot of games, but they never really factored in to my purchase. Although my wife and I enjoy playing games like Scrabble back and forth when we're in a waiting room or something.
Oh, and it looked cool."

Seem perfectly happy, just as there are many perfectly happy android users here. I can't see why you keep saying users like this one has in some way made a bad choice.

Read all his posts (he is on all day, plenty of posts...) you will see all he spreads is heavy hatred towards anything apple. The dark side of the force is strong with this one.

While my own post might actually get me banned, people like IOWA spreading their venom all day long on forums just drive quite a few people away, me included. I mean I come here to read anything android and on 1/3 of the posts theres this guy spreading his hate on here.

So before I get a delete and or a ban, just for the love of god, stop arguing with this guy! there is not constructive or interesting debate to be done here.

Peace out.

 

[IOWA]

Read all his posts (he is on all day, plenty of posts...) you will see all he spreads is heavy hatred towards anything apple. The dark side of the force is strong with this one.

While my own post might actually get me banned, people like IOWA spreading their venom all day long on forums just drive quite a few people away, me included. I mean I come here to read anything android and on 1/3 of the posts theres this guy spreading his hate on here.

So before I get a delete and or a ban, just for the love of god, stop arguing with this guy! there is not constructive or interesting debate to be done here.

Peace out.

No, my pc(s) are on all day and I don't close the browser window =) the admins can tell you I access from several, consistant ip addresses.

I also find it funny you equate someone who comes against draconion business methods and defends open practice to the "dark side" kind of an oxymoron there.


That being said, to address mojik, winmo7 has already been announced they will support third party apps, but no installing outside their version of the market =(

If microsoft continues like this, I will come against their mobile platforms as well. And yes mojik, I will concede to you the fact that I overgeneralized and exaggerated my "95%" comment, so that is withdrawn. But you must agree there is a rather good percentage of people who got the iphone, (and even blackberries) just because its a brand name.

I know sometime you guys may think my posts are completely biased, by try to think of why. If you realy take a look at the business practices of apple, and now microsoft for that matter, how ccan you ethically support them? Being a (future) business owner,(family business) these kinds of methods do directly impact me. And make no mistake, I will come against and company, government, or individual who thinks doing things that way is the right way. And regardless of what you guys may think, I do appreciate each and every one of your posts. Sometimes I learn things, and knowledge is my achilles heel of sorts. I will continue, however, to debunk false facts, and I hope you all will too. A collective knowledge is better than any given individual any day. so I do encourage everyone to participate in the conversation, and I appreciate (most) of you keeping this civil, (and I now we all fly off the handle sometimes, it just happens) and let's please continue to do so.


Sincerely, IOWA.

 

[lekky]

IOWA, I've read your posts in this thread and others, it seems to be you are letting some personal hatred rule your head. Your arguments are all over the place to be honest, and the underlying theme is a sort of deep hatred of Apple.

You have made some good points however, but then go and spoil it by reffering to others posts as having no proof, yet the majority of your arguments have no proof, and are based on purely your opinion.

Listen, I agree ok, I don't like what Apple is doing, I think a lot of iPhone users simply don't know better. When they see my Desire, and what I can do with it they don't ever look at their iPhone the same.

Your arguments (you make some very good ones) would stand up a lot better if you took a step back and read your posts before pressing submit, sometimes you go too far without thinking.