Is it just me, or... (Android app/game quality)

[hrbib21]

No. Those are usually times I interact with other human beings.

WHAT?! You can actually interact with others? OMG! I didn't know we could still do that!

Seriously, great point. Put down the phone once in a while and live your life.

I like the way Japan deals with it. Talk on your cell phone on the plane/train/bus/etc. and you will be told that it is rude and that you should have more respect for those around you. It doesn't hurt to say "Hello. How are you today?" to others, you know.

 

[NewYorkLaw]

No. Those are usually times I interact with other human beings.

I was thinking the same thing!
Pete

 

[NewYorkLaw]

Aw shucks, my phone doesn't have great games! Better go complain! While I'm at it, I'll also complain that my PSP doesn't play blu-ray movies and my TiVo doesn't cook my dinner."

What do you have, an older Tivo, version 2? Version 3 DOES cook dinner.
Pete

 

[lekky]

That's fantastic for you, but it's a bit of a problem for Nexus One owners with only one hardware button and no multitouch.

Just to confirm, it DOES have multitouch capability.

 

[ShotSkydiver]

I had my rant machine all fired up ready to rip ShotSkydiver a new one for posting a thread that we've covered a kajillion times on here.

Then I thought.. why? Someone else is just going to come along and whine about the same thing (again).

Round and round and round we go.

Sorry about that... I hate when people do that as well. I'm new to the forum, and while I know that's not an excuse, I didn't see an open thread about it.

Perfect example of the instant gratification attitude of our populace. the phone JUST CAME OUT. Give it time.

I'm not complaining about not having it, I'm just saying that as of now Nexus One owners don't have the option to play emulators. Every time I've asked this question people have just told me to play emulators which I can't do and it's getting quite annoying.

Just to confirm, it DOES have multitouch capability.

Oh, I know, I just mean it hasn't been implemented yet.

 

[lekky]

Multitouch has been implemented, you have to be careful how you phrase this ok. The apps that come with the phone do not have multitouch, that apps that you can download from the market DO have multitouch.

 

[ShotSkydiver]

Multitouch has been implemented, you have to be careful how you phrase this ok. The apps that come with the phone do not have multitouch, that apps that you can download from the market DO have multitouch.

That's what I meant... it hasn't been implemented into the core apps yet.

 

[thecrazing]

Yeah, but.. What do the core apps matter for an emulator?

 

[miamicanes]

Agreed. I was hoping that now, being a year and a half after the first android device was released we would get some better applications.

One factor that gets often overlooked. In America, at least, Android barely mattered until ~3 months ago, because prior to early October there was only one way to get an Android phone: switch to T-Mobile.

I know for a fact that Sprint has traditionally been popular among casual software developers... mainly, because they've usually had better phones (especially with regard to the first Palm phones circa 2001-3), data service, rates, and TOS than the others (Verizon=expensive control freak Nazis, AT&T's phones just plain sucked pre-GSM, and T-Mobile's data network was a cruel GPRS joke until very, VERY recently). 2 years ago at JavaOne, I'd conservatively estimate that *at least* half the guys there had Sprint logos on their phones.

More purely anecdotal evidence: check out the explosive growth of Android-related topics at xda-developers.com, and other sites like it, that have become de-facto "Android sites" over the past 2-3 months as practically their entire user base (admins and all) have jumped ship to Android as it became available from their carriers. Even moreso, when you look at the boards for the highest-end WM phones (like the Touch HD) and see that the #1 topics everyone cares about are the ones like "does (the guerrilla) Android (port) support ${bluetooth|gps|camera|etc} yet?"

Put another way, by next fall, the Android software situation is going to be a LOT more mature than it is now. And Microsoft will be filling its drawers when they throw the release party for WM7, and nobody really notices or cares.

 

[TheAndroidWorks]

One factor that gets often overlooked. In America, at least, Android barely mattered until ~3 months ago, because prior to early October there was only one way to get an Android phone: switch to T-Mobile.

I know for a fact that Sprint has traditionally been popular among casual software developers... mainly, because they've usually had better phones (especially with regard to the first Palm phones circa 2001-3), data service, rates, and TOS than the others (Verizon=expensive control freak Nazis, AT&T's phones just plain sucked pre-GSM, and T-Mobile's data network was a cruel GPRS joke until very, VERY recently). 2 years ago at JavaOne, I'd conservatively estimate that *at least* half the guys there had Sprint logos on their phones.

More purely anecdotal evidence: check out the explosive growth of Android-related topics at xda-developers.com, and other sites like it, that have become de-facto "Android sites" over the past 2-3 months as practically their entire user base (admins and all) have jumped ship to Android as it became available from their carriers. Even moreso, when you look at the boards for the highest-end WM phones (like the Touch HD) and see that the #1 topics everyone cares about are the ones like "does (the guerrilla) Android (port) support ${bluetooth|gps|camera|etc} yet?"

Put another way, by next fall, the Android software situation is going to be a LOT more mature than it is now. And Microsoft will be filling its drawers when they throw the release party for WM7, and nobody really notices or cares.

Well put.

100% of your statements are 110% agreed upon.

The palm treo movement was a nice ripple, the WinMO phones became a bigger splash, the iphone movement was a wave, and Android will be an all out Tsunami. Blackberry is very noteworthy, but kind of its own thing due to certain reasons.

What we have here is an operating system war similar to when Amiga, OS2, Microsoft, and Apple, etc. all battled it out back in the day. We all know now how that ended up! The current field is NOT that dissimilar.

 

[trekgraham]

Quality is improving on applications, so is number of Apps. One thing I'd like to see is better keyboard to incorporate multitouch into their 3rd party softkey. Also want to see a usable second life client where one can see where there at fly,move,chat. All I gotta say is Google keeps making android better

 

[miamicanes]

We all know now how that ended up!

Yep... the Amiga's soul took over PCs (Comanche: Maximum Overkill was an Amiga game in PC drag), then MacOS secretly committed suicide & NeXTSTEP quietly assumed its public identity as OSX

Most people don't realize just how earth-shakingly disruptive and rule-changing the sudden influx of Amiga developers into the PC camp was.

Pre-'94, PC programming was dominated by people who grew up with the 8088, and treated the 80286 and 80386 like a faster version of it. They saw the world in terms of 64k segments with a 1-megabyte horizon. Amiga programmers might have spent their teens with a c64, but the moment they touched a 680x0, they ran with it and never looked back. Plus, DOS programmers viewed DOS as something holy and sacred. Amiga programmers, in contrast, had a long, proud tradition of chucking the OS and doing everything from scratch. So... when they were forced to start programming PCs, they picked up the 386 assembly language manual, realized it had perfectly good orthogonal registers & flat addressing (as long as you didn't care about DOS, tradition, or running on anything less than a 386SX), and proceeded to write games that literally leapfrogged a decade ahead of what the traditional PC developers were doing on the same hardware.

 

[trekgraham]

Funny, I grew up using commodore 64, owned two of them, then a 8088 followed by a tandy 286, skipped 386 went 486 then pentium,athlon,celeron and atom

 

[miamicanes]

Well, I think another part of it was the fact that realmode PC assembly language was so brutally ugly and painful, high-level languages never developed the early stigma on PCs that they did on the Amiga. During the late Amiga Era, there were maybe a dozen people on earth writing stuff in 386enh assembly... and most of them worked for Intel, in research positions. Everyone else used Turbo[C(++)|Pascal]. In contrast, one of the worst insults Amiga programmers could throw at your program was to sneer and say, "ewww... what did you do, write it in C?"

Thus, when the Amiga refugees ended up writing PC apps, their first instinct was to make PCs look like Amigas from a programming point of view. The moment we discovered 386enh mode, the genie was out of the bottle, and we would have slept in a cardboard box in a park before we willingly used realmode for anything.

The big irony is that most of us Amiga refugees totally overlooked Linux at the time, even though (in retrospect) it already had the development tools and OS to handle 386enh code. The problem was, the only thing Amiga owners were more prejudiced against than Macs and PCs was... Unix. Not because of Unix per se, but just because back then, "Unix" was basically a synonym for "boring charactermode apps running on a green or orange VT100 terminal". If Linus Torvalds spent the summer after he got his first kernel to work writing a kick-ass 386enh assembly megademo for a PC with ET4000 videocard & SBpro to show off what his "Linux" environment could do, history might have turned out a bit differently.

 

[ShotSkydiver]

Yeah, but.. What do the core apps matter for an emulator?

They don't, but it'd be great to have multitouch in the core apps as well.

 

[burley1]

Say what you will about Apple but as I type on my laggy keyboard to post this at least it is standard across the board. There are what 3 or 4 versions of android os now.
Plus add in handset makers and all of their variances for hardware as well as software and add to the mix the carriers who decide if phones get these updates it can be daunting and frustrating. Especially coming from Apple world. Yes they lock down their system but all handsets including Ipods get the software updates regardless of the carrier,ATT in this case.

How Google could limit app size and quality as well useability on handsets by not having standards as well as not allowing apps to be run from the sdcard is beyond me.

My carrier is not supposed to get 2.1 until late June or July for gosh sakes. I was shocked to find out we cannot update when we want. What If my carrier, or any carrier decides to not bother with all the updates for all the different phones ?

Could very easily happen. I am not so sure these mobile carriers really want to be In the software end of this. Not for the long haul anyway and It will be at the expense of consumers who money up big bucks for these devices.

Apple got it right in a lot of ways, why change what works. I would like to see a desktop program a la itunes and upgrades come straight from google, not the carrier or handset maker.

I would have to agree, It has been really tough switching from and iPhone to any other devise.

I bought an iPhone the day they cam out and switched before the 3Gs came out. I have had a Pre and a tour and now a hero.

 

[miamicanes]

Apple got it right in a lot of ways, why change what works. I would like to see a desktop program a la itunes and upgrades come straight from google, not the carrier or handset maker.

Agree, 100%. Google's NEXT big project needs to be figuring out how to abstract-out the way things like SenseUI and softkeys interface with the core OS, so they can take responsibility for core OS upgrades away from the carriers & handset makers.

Dell and HP might SAY you have to depend on them 100% for Windows upgrades, or claim Vista/Win7/Linux "isn't supported" for a specific model, but once you find out who made the peripheral chipsets, you can just go download the reference drivers from the chipset maker's website and upgrade to the next version of Windows on your own, Dell and HP be damned. Upgrades to your phoneOS should be the same way. If Sprint and/or HTC wants to make it user-friendly and easy to upgrade the OS, more power to them... but they shouldn't be allowed to stand in the way of users who'd rather upgrade early, often, and by themselves.

Using the Sprint Hero as an example, the biggest roadblock (besides the camera) has been SenseUI. HTC has it bolted onto Android so tightly, it's hard to cleanly remove it, and nearly impossible to tape it over a newer version of Android as a facade. Likewise, HTC's stupid keyguard is almost useless for people who like to carry their phones in a pocket, but it's impossible to selectively disable. There are a few programs that try, but because they're actively fighting with it to trick it into not working, the battery gets drained, and often the entire phone gets destabilized by the fight.

Android 3.x should have a clean, well-defined API for things like "desktop managers" (SenseUI)" and "keyguards/locks", to make it easy for companies like HTC to make a phone with something like SenseUI that isn't inextricably tied to a specific build of AndroidOS.

 

[alostpacket]

I just bought a new Mac and I'm really disappointed that there aren't that many games as there are for my PC, Xbox, Wii and PS3.

/sarcasm
//sorry


In a year I bet the platforms will both have very awesome games.

 

[QrafTee]

I just came from an iPhone to a Nexus One, and after browsing and downloading a lot of apps and games from the Android Market I've come to realize that the quality of iPhone games and apps is much better. Every Android game I've played has looked terrible and poorly made. It seems a lot more developers are putting more time and effort into iPhone apps. For example, The Sims 3 in the iPhone App Store is a really good game, with great graphics, yet the Android version looks terrible. Most iPhone apps I've seen have looked much nicer and more polished, too.

This is a pretty big dealbreaker, too. Will this situation ever change?

Keep in the mind the length of time the iPhone's been out and the Android phones have been out (keeps in mind the length of time the Android 2.0 phones have been out--which matters because these phones have higher specs which can support better apps) and I think you might just understand why the quality and quantity of apps differ so much.

 

[mejoyh]

I just came onto the Android platform after finally found a phone with a touch cap screen with a physical keyboard. I have to say, i am pretty disappointed so far. Before even talking about the total disparity in apps between apple and google, the touch interface is just not up to scratch (i am on the droid/milestone android 2.0). I mean, its google, not some 2nd rate OS company. They clearly know the competition and yet they managed to release such an inferior product.

Then the apps, lets not mention the difference in quality and quantity of the apps. I dont have a problem with this as i understand android is still 'young' but what about those which are available on both iphone and android? How is it possible the same app written by the same company handles so differently on 2 different OSs? My biggest annoyance is the difference between the facebook apps. I gave up with the android version after 2 days and just moved to the mobile browser version. The iphone one is awesome, so why the difference? Maybe Google should spend sometime defining some standards. Also i dont know if this is just me but the iPhone touch keyboard is also much more accurate for some reason . Also no pinch to zoom on maps? What's with that? Andy Rubin's answer for that was that he 'doesnt like 2-handed operation?'. Well there are plenty of us who do!

All in all i think android has great potential but it clearly lacks an edge. I mean i laughed when all the google ppl at CES were braging about the Nexus One being a 'superphone'. wtf..... they cant even meet current smartphone standards! Sorely disapointed with google so far.....

sorry for the rant
mejoyh

 

[tliebeck]

I dont have a problem with this as i understand android is still 'young' but what about those which are available on both iphone and android? How is it possible the same app written by the same company handles so differently on 2 different OSs? My biggest annoyance is the difference between the facebook apps. I gave up with the android version after 2 days and just moved to the mobile browser version. The iphone one is awesome, so why the difference? Maybe Google should spend sometime defining some standards.

This has absolutely nothing to do with the Android or iPhone APIs. It sounds as though you think you have established a scientific control by looking at one company's iPhone apps vs. their Android offerings. Nothing could be further from the truth. It's very likely that completely different teams wrote each version, under completely different management. In all likelihood the iPhone version had a substantially larger budget and more experienced coders, due to both its age and popularity.

Feel free to suggest that there are many half-arsed Android applications out there, but it's kind of disgusting to attack the platform design without knowing anything about it.

 

[mejoyh]

This has absolutely nothing to do with the Android or iPhone APIs. It sounds as though you think you have established a scientific control by looking at one company's iPhone apps vs. their Android offerings. Nothing could be further from the truth. It's very likely that completely different teams wrote each version, under completely different management. In all likelihood the iPhone version had a substantially larger budget and more experienced coders, due to both its age and popularity.

Feel free to suggest that there are many half-arsed Android applications out there, but it's kind of disgusting to attack the platform design without knowing anything about it.

Lol, chill dude, no need to get so heated. Yes i dont disagree that the apps may be written by different teams but i am not referring to small firms. My 2 examples would be

1) Facebook app written by Facebook. I find it difficult to believe that FB would not commit equal or similar resources or infact have totally unconnected dev teams developing their app for different platforms. Maybe you know indepth on this.
2) Google app written for iphone (cant find a comparison for android). I know its cosmetic but i really liked the voice searching thing that google released for iphone. Cant seem to find it on android.

Essentially, if you disagree with my statement that for like-for-like iphone vs android apps do not have any substantial difference then we will just have to agree to disagree. I am not dissing android, theres a reason why i spent money and signed myself to a long term contract for this phone and platform. I have never owned or expect to own an iphone but i have to honestly say the stuff on iphone is alot cleaner and professional.

 

[tliebeck]

Lol, chill dude, no need to get so heated. Yes i dont disagree that the apps may be written by different teams but i am not referring to small firms. My 2 examples would be

1) Facebook app written by Facebook. I find it difficult to believe that FB would not commit equal or similar resources or infact have totally unconnected dev teams developing their app for different platforms. Maybe you know indepth on this.
2) Google app written for iphone (cant find a comparison for android). I know its cosmetic but i really liked the voice searching thing that google released for iphone. Cant seem to find it on android.

Essentially, if you disagree with my statement that for like-for-like iphone vs android apps do not have any substantial difference then we will just have to agree to disagree. I am not dissing android, theres a reason why i spent money and signed myself to a long term contract for this phone and platform. I have never owned or expect to own an iphone but i have to honestly say the stuff on iphone is alot cleaner and professional.

I don't have any inside information on the Facebook app. But iPhone apps are written in Objective C, whereas Android apps are written in Java. So it's not a stretch to imagine you'll see different devs on each item.

Software companies really do put entirely different units on different platforms, and they often don't have adequate communication. As a for instance, look at the lack of commonality between MS Office for OS X vs. Windows (over the past decade). They have about as much in common with each other as they do with OpenOffice. Heck, I've seen OpenOffice do a better job of opening a Windows PPT file than Mac Office. I think this lack of collaboration within companies is completely insane, but it does happen quite a lot.

The only thing that actually bugs me is drawing the conclusion that Android has a bad design...I've seen plenty of horrible Android implementations of iPhone apps. Just go take a look at the reviews of "The Sims" for Android (and the screenshots). They didn't even try.

 

[mejoyh]

I don't have any inside information on the Facebook app. But iPhone apps are written in Objective C, whereas Android apps are written in Java. So it's not a stretch to imagine you'll see different devs on each item.

Software companies really do put entirely different units on different platforms, and they often don't have adequate communication. As a for instance, look at the lack of commonality between MS Office for OS X vs. Windows (over the past decade). They have about as much in common with each other as they do with OpenOffice. Heck, I've seen OpenOffice do a better job of opening a Windows PPT file than Mac Office. I think this lack of collaboration within companies is completely insane, but it does happen quite a lot.

The only thing that actually bugs me is drawing the conclusion that Android has a bad design...I've seen plenty of horrible Android implementations of iPhone apps. Just go take a look at the reviews of "The Sims" for Android (and the screenshots). They didn't even try.

I wouldn't disagree with your point on little communication between dev teams on different platforms but it does appear google has set the entry bar pretty low.

Perhaps this is small but for instance, a messaging app (messagenow) i downloaded for both iphone and android. I wont go into the cosmetic stuff but there was one function which is to delete a contact you have added. On the iphone, its standard, you have that delete logo that comes up on the left hand side (i assume this is part of the API definition, maybe i am wrong) and you delete a contact. Simple. On the android version, this wasn't enabled until 2 updates by the developer. Shouldn't stuff like these be defined as a minimum requirement? As this is small startup dev team of 2-5 ppl, i also guess they are all camped out in a room/garage/basement together somewhere in California. So i find the basis of lack of communcation difficult to see.

I see the argument that android is a totally open platform where everyone can develop anything (as long as its not malicious). But from a technologically uneducated end-user point of view, if you picked up an android and an iphone, it would seem as though the android platform is not as good as the iphone's. Again, I understand most of the arguments (i used to be a coder several moons ago) but isn't the final product what matters most in the end? Shouldnt google set the bar higher?

 

[trekgraham]

Only time will tell, developers need time to port games to 2.x, and create original games. Patience is good, I believe the advances android has made in OS, applications, and hardware has advanced quicker then the beginning of the first iPhone. Open source helps spread fast development.