• After 15+ years, we've made a big change: Android Forums is now Early Bird Club. Learn more here.

Is There Real Difference Between Ease of Use on Android and iPhone

Being a user of both, I can give a little more insight than those who have not used both. But this is just my experience and your mileage may vary.

I'm also a new user of a Droid X. This is my first Android device. Overall I like it. It is a good phone. It's so much better than my previous Blackberry. Its not as good as my wife's iPhone.

For me, the iPhone is much easier to use. I like a phone, or other consumer device that I can just fire up and use. It already looks good, its responsive and it's secure. I don't want to worry about downloading malware when looking for apps. I don't want to have to worry about my wallpaper app stealing my private data and shipping it to a nefarious server in Shenzen. I like the fact, as a consumer, that the apps I've downloaded have been tested for stability, usability, and security before they are sold in a store. I like the fact, that I don't have to worry about porn when looking for apps. If I was a developer, I might not like those things as much. But as a consumer, they are great!

I don't want to have to customize my phone bc the stock OS looks like total crap. Or have to rely on a carrier to provide a good looking UI. Bc then I have to wait on that carrier to get its act together before I can get the latest update. And I have to learn about an app like BetterCut, or learn how to follow a 6 step process for changing icons, setting up LauncherPro, etc.

You may not like having to tether your phone to a computer to get it working. You may like to manage your own file system on your phone. I do not. I don't want to have to learn the file system. I don't want to have to set my phone as a USB connection type before my computer will let me connect to it. I don't want to have to learn what an apk file is and what folder to move it to. I don't want to have to manage all of my photos, music, videos on the actual phone. I want to do that with an integrated program on my computer. I want to have it set up so when I plug it in, the syncing just happens. Backups are seamless, music is appropriately copied over, and my already organized photo library is in place.

Looks matter to me. And on some level it matters to all of us. None of us like to look at shitty graphics and horrible color/font choices in our applications. But that's what I'm dealing with while using my Droid X. If anyone has ever used an iPhone you know the stark differences between the design quality of Cocoa Touch apps and Android apps. It's huge. iPhone developers care a great deal about how they apps look and feel. I don't get that same feeling with using an Android App.

For example, I'm a huge RSS reader. I spend a lot of time reading various blogs on design, film, tech, etc. I have yet to find a good RSS app on the Marketplace for this. There is no peer to Reeder on the iPhone in the Marketplace. Not only is its UI exquisite, but it's about 100 times more functional than the best alternative I can find on Android (either NewsRob or A Good Reader).

iPhone apps all work the same way. You download them, they install onto your home screen. You touch them to open them up and interact with them by using the screen. And only the screen. this consistency means that the learning curve is extremely low. All of the commands are on the screen. You only have to touch the screen to navigate the app. This is very easy to use and very intuitive. If I don't want it anymore, I simply long press and delete it.

Android apps work differently. You may download an app, and it'll go into your app drawer. Unless its something like LauncherPro, in which case I'm not sure where it goes. If I wasn't a techie, I'd be confused. Beautiful Widgets. And they are beautiful, if I can find them. But it doesn't behave like an app bc its a widget and you create/access widgets in a different manner than apps. So now I have 3 different types of applications with 3 different ways to access them and use them. Is it mind-boggling? Of course not. But its not simple either.

How do I delete an app? Simple, I just click the menu hardware button, select Manage Applications find the app I'm looking for and click Uninstall. Unless it's a totally stupid app that I don't want taking up space on my phone. Those I can't delete. Motorola/Verizon has decided that I need those to help make them money. This is an open phone, except when it comes to bloatware. Then it's not.

How do I navigate inside an app? Well it depends. Most of the time I use the hardware buttons. Basically, you use the back button to move between areas of the application. Its like a browser. Which can be efficient if used properly. But most times its like a poorly deisgned web app where instead of solving a complicated UI problem, the designer just tells you to hit the back button. I'm listening to my music, I like the artist, but I can't jump to taht artist. No, I have to hit back 3 times before I'm presented with an option to scroll through my artists since I'm in a playlist. Or, if I'm in the camera app, I actually touch on the screen to get some menu options. So I do that, and then I can get to some pictures I've taken before. How do I get back to the camera? That's now the back button 3 times again. That's pretty arbitrary. And that is in the same app!

I have an 8 MP camera! Except it defaults to 6 MP. I didn't even know that until I was writing this post and went into the settings and saw that it was set for 6 MP. I thought the face detection was broken. The little reticule didn't pick up the faces no matter how often I touched them. Oh but that's a setting too. I need to go into it Settings and turn that on.

You see how this could be confusing to a non-techie, or even a techie. The iPhone may not have as many features (I wish it had different effects like my Droid X) but the features it does have just work. I don't need to tinker with them to turn them on. It has a 5 MP camera and it shoots in 5 MP. It doesn't start with 3 and wait for me to turn it up to 5.

This is just a few examples. I'm finding more every day.

Now, don't get me wrong. I really like my Droid X. I think like an arranged marriage (afterall it was issued to me by work) I'll grow to love it. But is it as easy to use as an iPhone? No it is not.
 
^^ Interesting points.

I think you may be equating your preferences with "ease of use." Respectfully, familiarity does count for a lot, but tradition does not necessarily equal ease.

For example, the need to continually tether to a desktop would infuriate me beyond measure. Some folks like the security (I know I did back in my Palm days). I also have had the absolutely disconcerting issue of losing everything in a computer crash, so I am a big proponent of cloud computing.

Call me stubborn, but I still don't see using the iPhone being easier than using the average Android device.

Now... I'll give you the bloatware argument. No bloatware on the iPhone is a positive part of the control Apple demands. The thing is, if I want to get rid of those apps, I can. I'd take that over control. I readily concede that I am not the average cell-phone user, and Apple's approach is successful for most people. One counter-point: I hold that most people couldn't careless with regards to bloatware.

Also, with regards to your camera dilemma: I fail to see what is wrong with a hardware manufacturer setting the device below the stated maximum spec? How is that a bad thing?
 
Now... I'll give you the bloatware argument. No bloatware on the iPhone is a positive part of the control Apple demands.

Well, they don't have bloat but I've been noticing the 3rd party apps are getting big in size. All the 3D iP4 games are now like 150-300 megabytes. Are there any apps that big on Android? I'm not a gamer but I downloaded a few to check the 3D engine and I was surprise to see how the immersive apps are that big.

The thing is, if I want to get rid of those apps, I can. I'd take that over control.

Tell that to all the Droid Incredible owners who want to get rid of that malfestation of an app called CityID. Only way to do that is to root.



Also, with regards to your camera dilemma: I fail to see what is wrong with a hardware manufacturer setting the device below the stated maximum spec? How is that a bad thing?

They do this because at the highest settings, you don't always get the best results. At the highest settings, you tend to get more camera and picture noise. To the consumer, it looks grainy. Same thing with video, the EVO 4G 720p HD video looks like turd.The WVGA is much better so it is set at default.
 
Uh... huh? You can put media into different folders/sub-folders. They will then show up in the gallery as different, well, folders.

Apparently you don't know what "hierarchy" means.

My photos are organized like this, for example:

Family Pics is the top level

Jon, Bob, Jane, Mary, Jill, Paul, etc are the next subfolders

Or I might have "Car Pics" as the top level folder.

In that directory, I'll have "Car Audio Pics", "Engine Pics", Exhaust Pics", etc

In "Car Audio Pics", I want folders called "Custom Wiring", "Head Unit Install", Subwoofer Building"


Sure all of those folders show up, but NOT in proper hierarchy so it's a total disaster trying to find them. Instead all of the folders show up in a single list and the topmost level. So the folder "Custom Wiring" will appear by itself, next to "Cooking" pictures.

Completely stupid.
 
I don't want to worry about downloading malware when looking for apps. I don't want to have to worry about my wallpaper app stealing my private data and shipping it to a nefarious server in Shenzen.

Spending two seconds glancing over app permissions before installing is hard, I know. Oh, and you think iOS isn't subjected to malware? Heh heh heh. That's funny. Hello hidden code in a flashlight app getting past Apple.

I like the fact, that I don't have to worry about porn when looking for apps.
...how old are you? You really need the Internet filtered for you?

I don't want to have to customize my phone bc the stock OS looks like total crap.
Funny. I think iOS looks like shit. Vanilla Android 2.2 looks perfectly fine.

And I have to learn about an app like BetterCut, or learn how to follow a 6 step process for changing icons, setting up LauncherPro, etc.
Launcher Pro is incredibly easy to set up and transparent.

If I wasn't a techie, I'd be confused.
Judging from what you've posted, you aren't a techie. You're tech-illiterate and one of those users who bawl that things ought to simply "just work." You're the kind of user tech support people desperately, utterly loathe. The kind they tell horror stories about and laugh at behind your back. Can't say I blame them, either.
 
BTW, the file system on Android is a joke as well. It's a totally asinine cluttered mess. Apps can place folders and temp files wherever they want, and if you move them it breaks half the apps.

How come I have half of my apps putting crap on the root of the drive, I have several apps putting stuff into an "apps" directory, have another few apps putting them into "android.apps" directory (talk about redundant), have some apps putting their cache in totally separate folders from their program files, have some apps simply ignoring the "app" directory and creating their own directory like "dropbox"?

Hell, it's ten times worse than windows mobile. At least there apps defaulted to a common program files like directory (and at least you could choose what directory to install them to).

Drag and drop and direct file system access is a great concept, when your actual file system doesn't totally blow for organization. As it is now, it's all but useless to the common person and at the very least frustrating to the tech savvy individual.

Try telling my girlfriend, "Oh honey, all you have to do to update your album art is open up Astro, rename the directories you want it to ignore from scanning with a "." in front of it, locate the folder where the cache is stored, download your .jpg's, rename them to be identical to the music file, plug your phone in to the computer, go into the removable drive, navigate to the cache file, drag and drop the JPG's in, restart your phone, AND you might have to pop the SD card in and out a few times to get it to rescan and update the info"

Good frigging luck!
 
Judging from what you've posted, you aren't a techie. You're tech-illiterate and one of those users who bawl that things ought to simply "just work." You're the kind of user tech support people desperately, utterly loathe. The kind they tell horror stories about and laugh at behind your back. Can't say I blame them, either.

All too often on these forums, and other technical forums that I'm on, I see people defending inferior and inefficient ways of completing a task because they are "techies".

One thing that these "techies" don't seem to understand is the following:

Take a task, any task. There are two methods of doing it. One requires a single button press. The other requires five presses, directory navigation, and using an external app to accomplish.

NEWSFLASH: If the second method offers no benefits over the first method, it's not "cool" or "techy" to do it. It's simply inefficient and stupid. And gloating that you do it the second way because you are somehow more "advanced" makes the rest of the people that live in the real world simply laugh at you. Why? Because those non techy people that choose the superior method get more done and enjoy their devices more than you will. That's right - those non techies are MORE productive than you because they understand the value of effeciency.

Of course, if that more complex option gives you more flexibility that's totally different and it may be worth checking out that second option. But with several of these flaws of Android, such as media organization, ID3 tag editing, and not recognizing folder hierarchies, there is simply no benefit for being more complex. Put simply, it is objectively worse than the iOS way of doing things, whether you like it or not.

Don't make the mistake of professing a more complex method of accomplishing a task as the superior one when there is no actual benefit for the complexity.
 
Try telling my girlfriend, "Oh honey, all you have to do to update your album art is open up Astro, rename the directories you want it to ignore from scanning with a "." in front of it, locate the folder where the cache is stored, download your .jpg's, rename them to be identical to the music file, plug your phone in to the computer, go into the removable drive, navigate to the cache file, drag and drop the JPG's in, restart your phone, AND you might have to pop the SD card in and out a few times to get it to rescan and update the info"

Good frigging luck!


LMAO off...

That has happen to me. Especially with HTC Sense bullshit.
If you sync your music a lot and swap out microsdhc card a bit, your music media database gets corrupted. This is one of the problems of fragmentation.
Album Art are gets lost (even though they are embedded in the ID3 tag and purchased off amazon.com).

You have to be really techie and pull up the SDK debugger to debug your OS.

No normal person needs to tether his phone to a SDK debugger to find problems as simple as mangled music playlist or corrupted files

No normal person needs to open up a SQLite3 db files and run SQL queries to see what their music player is ****ed up. I'm technical enough where I actually had to
trouble shoot my problem.
See picture below.

It loses the file path, the media player can't store the album art because the file name has an illegal character or is too long to fit in the insert statement.


Picture7.png

Picture3.png


Look at line 8 on this one:

Picture3.png


LMAO, it couldn't recognize a mp3 with a 40 length string UTF8 file name.. So it it just ignored it and placed a different album art in its place.. Again, LMAO.'




Well, I just have to say, Samsung took care alot of this bullshit. Hate on touch-whiz all you want guys, it fixed a lot of inconsistency bullshit on Sense.
 
LMAO off...

That has happen to me. Especially with HTC Sense bullshit.
If you sync your music a lot and swap out microsdhc card a bit, your music media database gets corrupted. This is one of the problems of fragmentation.
Album Art are gets lost (even though they are embedded in the ID3 tag and purchased off amazon.com).

You have to be really techie and pull up the SDK debugger to debug your OS.

No normal person needs to tether his phone to a SDK debugger to find problems as simple as mangled music playlist or corrupted files

No normal person needs to open up a SQLite3 db files and run SQL queries to see what their music player is ****ed up. I'm technical enough where I actually had to
trouble shoot my problem. See picture below.

It loses the file path, the media player can't store the album art because the file name has an illegal character or is too long to fit in the insert statement.


Picture7.png

Picture3.png


Look at line 8 on this one:

Picture3.png


LMAO, it couldn't recognize a mp3 with a 40 length string UTF8 file name.. So it it just ignored it and placed a different album art in its place.. Again, LMAO.'




Well, I just have to say, Samsung took care alot of this bullshit. Hate on touch-whiz all you want guys, it fixed a lot of inconsistency bullshit on Sense.

Maybe it's just because I have a samsung phone, but I have not encountered any of these problems and and embedded id3 tags work just fine. Granted I am very meticulous with me my Music organization.
 
All too often on these forums, and other technical forums that I'm on, I see people defending inferior and inefficient ways of completing a task because they are "techies".

One thing that these "techies" don't seem to understand is the following:

Take a task, any task. There are two methods of doing it. One requires a single button press. The other requires five presses, directory navigation, and using an external app to accomplish.

NEWSFLASH: If the second method offers no benefits over the first method, it's not "cool" or "techy" to do it. It's simply inefficient and stupid. And gloating that you do it the second way because you are somehow more "advanced" makes the rest of the people that live in the real world simply laugh at you. Why? Because those non techy people that choose the superior method get more done and enjoy their devices more than you will. That's right - those non techies are MORE productive than you because they understand the value of effeciency.

Of course, if that more complex option gives you more flexibility that's totally different and it may be worth checking out that second option. But with several of these flaws of Android, such as media organization, ID3 tag editing, and not recognizing folder hierarchies, there is simply no benefit for being more complex. Put simply, it is objectively worse than the iOS way of doing things, whether you like it or not.

Don't make the mistake of professing a more complex method of accomplishing a task as the superior one when there is no actual benefit for the complexity.

I cannot argue with your main point. Simplicity is priceless. Period.

However, when we look into the specifics of music management, we have to admit that all simplicity is tied into the iTunes ecosystem. So, I could make an arguable case for the dependence of iOS on iTunes.

Now, I feel iTunes, as a hub, is horribly inefficient, which renders the whole system somewhat so. I cannot argue about the ease of use within the system, so I readily admit my core argument might be moot for most smartphone users.

I also readily admit that I am NOT a fan of iTunes at all.
 
Spending two seconds glancing over app permissions before installing is hard, I know. Oh, and you think iOS isn't subjected to malware? Heh heh heh. That's funny. Hello hidden code in a flashlight app getting past Apple.

An app that says it can access your contact information has no business taking your telephone number and sending it to China. Period.

The flashlight app had a hack in it that let you tether. I wouldn't call that malware. It certainly didn't endanger anyone's privacy. There really is no argument that the App Store is more safe than the Marketplace. That's just part of the territory of being more open.

...how old are you? You really need the Internet filtered for you?

An app store isn't the internet. But I don't expect an attention to detail from someone like you. I'm 30 years old, but my children are a different story. I try to make sure their access to porn is as limited as possible.
 
However, when we look into the specifics of music management, we have to admit that all simplicity is tied into the iTunes ecosystem. So, I could make an arguable case for the dependence of iOS on iTunes.

Now, I feel iTunes, as a hub, is horribly inefficient, which renders the whole system somewhat so. I cannot argue about the ease of use within the system, so I readily admit my core argument might be moot for most smartphone users.

I also readily admit that I am NOT a fan of iTunes at all.

You are 100% right. iOS is dependent on iTunes. But I don't count that as a negative. It makes it a lot easier to manage large amounts of media.

And for the record, iTunes on a PC is an entirely different experience than iTunes on a Mac.


BTW, the file system on Android is a joke as well. It's a totally asinine cluttered mess. Apps can place folders and temp files wherever they want, and if you move them it breaks half the apps.

If you are having to deal with a filesystem at all, its not easy to use. I know that I'm talking to a bunch of geeks here, but file systems are not easy to use for the vast majority of consumers. And remember we aren't talking about what makes a phone more powerful or customizable, but easier to use.
 
And you are exactly the reason the Marketplace sucks overall. You have no taste.

Maybe it's because android can look like what he wants it to look like, instead of just a 4x4 grid of icons.

I have a theory though that one of the reasons ios appears to be easier to use is because it looks inviting and not necessarily because it is provably easier to use. If you are with an attractive girl, you'll have the same kinds of issues and problems you have with an unattractive girl but you'll ignore those issues and try to make the relationship work because she's so prtty. Apple has its issues but their fans ignore them because of the default look. Android has its issues but its fans go through the trouble because they like to have fun customizing to make it look just the way they want it.
 
One thing that needs to be mentioned is sycing. Iphone syncs with outlook, or contacts on a or a mac. Same thing for the calendar. Blackberry will do the same. Android from what I have heard and again I am new to andriod but I hear you can only sync with your google account not via standard usb. Google from what I hear doesnt sync to easy with a mac. So with that said it looks like the iphone or the blackberry is easier to sync which is quite important within the business world. Please correct me if I am wrong, because god I hope I am wrong!
 
One thing that needs to be mentioned is sycing. Iphone syncs with outlook, or contacts on a or a mac. Same thing for the calendar. Blackberry will do the same. Android from what I have heard and again I am new to andriod but I hear you can only sync with your google account not via standard usb. Google from what I hear doesnt sync to easy with a mac. So with that said it looks like the iphone or the blackberry is easier to sync which is quite important within the business world. Please correct me if I am wrong, because god I hope I am wrong!

In my limited experience, I've had a much easier time syncing on Android than I had on my BB. I hated my BB. Android is far and away better than BB at so many things it's not even close in my book.

I had major issues with any sort of Google sync. If the sync didn't fail outright, then it created a lot of duplicates. In fact, it was so bad there for a while that it was better when it didn't sync.

I also had issues with my corporate outlook sync. There were way too many times when I'd read an email on my PC but it'd still show unread on my BB and vice versa. I get a bunch of data notices for a nightly process that runs and I have those set to file automatically out of my Inbox. On my Droid X those will show up, until I access my Inbox on my PC. Then that seems to trigger my Droid to sync and they go away. They never did that on my BB so I literally had 3000 or so unread messages every month that I'd have to delete to clear room on the BB.

The only syncing issue I've had with my Droid X is with the default behavior of Google Contacts. It brings in All Contacts, instead of just my contacts so it includes all those email addresses that I've corresponded with 5 times or more but never added to my address book. Kind of a pain. Does anyone know how to select it to sync just the "My Contacts" group?
 
OK let's say you have a doc file on your PC and you want it on your iphone. how do you do it?

You download the Documents to Go app, then you use Google Docs, Dropbox, Box.net, MobileMe iDisk, or SugarSync.

Or you can email it to yourself, and Mail will know to open it in Docs to Go. Or you just use iTunes to move PDFs it to your iPhone, or more document types to your iPad if you have iWorks.

Or you can download Air Sharing and grab them off of your desktop when you are on the same WiFi network.
 
If iTunes could be removed from the equation, it would be more palatable. But, as another poster noted, iTunes is an integral part of the system, and it keeps people in the ecosystem.

It would take a lot for me to go back from cloud computing.
 
OK let's say you have a doc file on your PC and you want it on your iphone. how do you do it?

There are 3rd party apps that allow you store files on the iPhone and OS will open up the files if the operating system recognizes it. It uses the Quartz engine so Word, Excel and PDFs are all supported.
You can copy files via iTunes or via WIFI webdav. There is also DropBox.
Most people just email themselves the files. Viewing word and excel files have been supported since day 1. It is just the issue of getting it on the iPhone.

I'll grant that and prefer the Android model. But there are negatives as the one poster noted.

The filemanagers on iPhone are sandbox for security and there is one plus. You can hide files easily like hiding porn from the misses. In Android, you have to make hidden files with a . like .hideme otherwise the default Android photo and media players will pick them up.

Windows Mobile had the best file managemen system where things were better organized,. The SD card on my Android devices are full of gazillion folders.

Lastly, jailbreaking is the same as rooting. They both give you R+W access to the system filesystem. With a stock Android, you can't mount the root drive as writeable
 
Windows Mobile had the best file managemen system where things were better organized,. The SD card on my Android devices are full of gazillion folders.

yeah unfortunately WP7 won't have a file system so android will be the only one out there. It will also lose all of winmo's apps.
Speaking of such winmo apps...I just discovered that Softmaker office (SoftMaker : Homepage) has plans to port to Android. I would like to do some real work with a smartphone and I don't think the mini suites (docs2go, quickoffice, etc) will cut it.
 
yeah unfortunately WP7 won't have a file system so android will be the only one out there. It will also lose all of winmo's apps.
Speaking of such winmo apps...I just discovered that Softmaker office (SoftMaker : Homepage) has plans to port to Android. I would like to do some real work with a smartphone and I don't think the mini suites (docs2go, quickoffice, etc) will cut it.


Which, IMO, is a good thing. Users don't need to see the file system. Companies need to do the hard work of hiding the file system, while still giving the user access to the files.
 
There are 3rd party apps that allow you store files on the iPhone and OS will open up the files if the operating system recognizes it. It uses the Quartz engine so Word, Excel and PDFs are all supported.
You can copy files via iTunes or via WIFI webdav. There is also DropBox.
Most people just email themselves the files. Viewing word and excel files have been supported since day 1. It is just the issue of getting it on the iPhone.

I'll grant that and prefer the Android model. But there are negatives as the one poster noted.

The filemanagers on iPhone are sandbox for security and there is one plus. You can hide files easily like hiding porn from the misses. In Android, you have to make hidden files with a . like .hideme otherwise the default Android photo and media players will pick them up.

Windows Mobile had the best file managemen system where things were better organized,. The SD card on my Android devices are full of gazillion folders.

Lastly, jailbreaking is the same as rooting. They both give you R+W access to the system filesystem. With a stock Android, you can't mount the root drive as writeable

You older people seem to forget, my generation(and the one behind me) are used to dealing with filesystems and the like. And that's a good thing..

A messy filesystem is better than no file system any day. Would you prefer a beater car or no car if you worked 10 miles away...
 
Which, IMO, is a good thing. Users don't need to see the file system. Companies need to do the hard work of hiding the file system, while still giving the user access to the files.

The ideal situation is to let users see the sdcard or dedicated partition while hiding the system files. Applications should write to hidden directories on a system partition so if you swap out sdcards, the apps don't break. That is not the case on Android. There should be standard shared directories because there are too many duplicates. I have download, downloads, rn-downloads used by different apps.Same for Aldiko, e-books, ebook.

Android you can see the system files but you cant write to it, so what is the point. You have to root to mount r+w / the root filesystem. That is the equivalent of jail-breaking. In both cases, root& jail-break accomplish to the same thing. But for standard users, they don't need to see the system partition unless they can do something to it.

The iPhone should have a My Documents folder that is accessible to the user and accessible by all the apps. This would be the equivalent of a sdcard. Right now, there is an app called Files that give you user-accessible storage on the IP.
 
Being a user of both, I can give a little more insight than those who have not used both. But this is just my experience and your mileage may vary.

...
For me, the iPhone is much easier to use. I like a phone, or other consumer device that I can just fire up and use. It already looks good, its responsive and it's secure. I don't want to worry about downloading malware when looking for apps. I don't want to have to worry about my wallpaper app stealing my private data and shipping it to a nefarious server in Shenzen. ....
Amusing.

As a user of both iPhone & Android (plus Blackberry, Palm, Windows, etc), you have some misperceptions about the security of the iPhone. It has more vulnerabilities than Android.

Take for example: Security breach gives complete access to iPhone - Technology & science - Wireless - msnbc.com

Security breach gives complete access to iPhone
iPhone and iPod Touch running iOS4
 
Back
Top Bottom