The father can sue for child support in this instance.
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Men's Rights in Terms of Child Support and Abortion
- Thread starter lordofthereef
- Start date
The father can sue for child support in this instance.
Knewz
Android Expert
He's got no grounds. Thats the issue being discussed here. The guy basically has no decision making power. The courts will leave it up to the woman to have/not have the baby and what to do with it afterwards. You can't sue someone for child support who doesn't have a child and technically since the mother gave it up for adoption its almost like she never had the child in the first place.
It would be different if the mother did not give the child up for "adoption" but the father took custody. It's all a matter of legalities
Exactly. The child would never make it to "adoption" if the father decides he wants to take it. In which case, he can get child support from the woman.
D
Dark Jedi
Guest
Our country is full of double standards. So why should this be any different.
Knewz
Android Expert
Technically a father can adopt his own. If the child is given up for adoption, and once they are in the system, the pretty much are free to anyone looking for a child. Say for example the mother gives the child up without informing the father. This is not illegal as long as his name isn't on the birth certificate. Then he finds out later. He can't assume custody. The child is already in foster care and he would probably have to go through the extensive process known as Adoption to (re)claim his own child.
But to your point IF the father has Custody, he is entitled to support.
Actually, if a father finds out his biological child is in foster care, he can gain custody without adopting. And, in some cases, even if the child has already been adopted, the father can overturn the adoption, and regain custody. Like I said earlier, if you have sex with a girl, and would actually care if you had kids, keep tabs on her for a little while. Kinda hard to adopt out a child, without the father knowing, if the father knows there is a baby. And, it doesn't take long to know there might be a baby.
lordofthereef
Android Expert
The issue I have here is entirely with how the law works. Sure, I can keep tabs on her. If she gets a whiff that I want to keep the child and have intentions of trying collecting child support you can bet she is going to go for the abortion clinic.
My issue was never about what I would do in this case. My issue lies in the fact that woman have more legal options than men do in this case.
lordofthereef
Android Expert
Well, I talked to my friend who works for the gov in Sacramento. He had the following to say:
That's I think completely dependent on the mother. Since it's her child to bring to term, ultimately, I think that if the father wants complete custody, she can sever all rights to the child and surrender him/her to the father
and
I think the state will not force a mother to pay child support if the father wants to take the kid, because the state interest is to not have the child burden the adoption system
He is going to look for me. I told him we were having a small debate.
That's I think completely dependent on the mother. Since it's her child to bring to term, ultimately, I think that if the father wants complete custody, she can sever all rights to the child and surrender him/her to the father
and
I think the state will not force a mother to pay child support if the father wants to take the kid, because the state interest is to not have the child burden the adoption system
He is going to look for me. I told him we were having a small debate.
lordofthereef
Android Expert
Well he sent me this:
B2L
Android Expert
On this topic i am going to have to agree with RiverOfIce. I am a man, and i feel that things are perfectly fine with how they currently are. Just think of it this way, you made the decision to have sex. Therefore you should be responsible for your actions. The reason the laws are like this is because there are a lot of deadbeat guys out there that just aren't willing to pay for their actions. So many guys are willing to have sex unprotected and think that there will be no consequences.
If you aren't willing to pay child support for the next 18 years, don't have sex, or take the actions necessary to prevent it from happening. I mean come on you know what your getting yourself into when you have sex in the first place.
On the other hand i do think that it's wrong that guys don't have more of an option to support their child, when they really want to.
If you aren't willing to pay child support for the next 18 years, don't have sex, or take the actions necessary to prevent it from happening. I mean come on you know what your getting yourself into when you have sex in the first place.
On the other hand i do think that it's wrong that guys don't have more of an option to support their child, when they really want to.
ElasticNinja
Android Expert
I don't know if its been said, but if the condom fails, and the girl doesn't take her pill... should it be the guys problem.
Also, the mother usually gets custody even in equal custody cases. A few of my friends have separated parents and its always the mother who gets them for 4/5 nights and the father for 3/2 nights.
That said there is only 7 days in a week.. flip a coin?
Also, the mother usually gets custody even in equal custody cases. A few of my friends have separated parents and its always the mother who gets them for 4/5 nights and the father for 3/2 nights.
That said there is only 7 days in a week.. flip a coin?
D
Dark Jedi
Guest
What gives the woman the right to play God? They both consented to mutual sex. So if a child is created isnt it 50% hers and 50% his? If she didnt want to get pregnant then I guess she should of taken better precautions or not have sex period. Using abortion as birth control is not right no matter how you look at it. SO if the woman dont want the child but the man does. Then he should be able to get his child. She can look at carrying the child for 9months as a reminder of what can happen when you have sex. I bet next time she wont be as willing to throw caution to the wind.
lordofthereef
Android Expert
Also, the mother usually gets custody even in equal custody cases. A few of my friends have separated parents and its always the mother who gets them for 4/5 nights and the father for 3/2 nights.
That said there is only 7 days in a week.. flip a coin?
This is a problem too, and I have seen it happen. I guess you have to hope that the parents can set aside their differences and get as equal visitation as is possible for the kids. The issue is with school, mostly, I think. It's a bit rough on a kid to be popping back and forth from one parent's house to the other's mid school week.
ElasticNinja
Android Expert
^The school issue is a big issue.. don't know how i forgot that :S
It also takes them away from their friends, and idk if a revolving system (one week on, one off) is practical, going to the same school.
It also takes them away from their friends, and idk if a revolving system (one week on, one off) is practical, going to the same school.
lordofthereef
Android Expert
I think this is entirely dependent on the location of each parent's house.
ElasticNinja
Android Expert
Hence the word, practical 
I know people whose fathers are ageeess away and its not practical at all
I know people whose fathers are ageeess away and its not practical at all
lordofthereef
Android Expert
Hence the word, practical
I know people whose fathers are ageeess away and its not practical at all
There is, of course, the age old notion that a mother can better take care of her child than a father can. Biologically, this may be true with infants, but not so with older kids. This is probably still left over from the archaic thinking that a man provides for the family while the woman cleans the house and takes care of the kids.
The law makes no distinction between maternity/paternity in custody matters. Statistically, men getting custody is becoming more prevalent. I am a father with custody. I receive child support.I don't know if its been said, but if the condom fails, and the girl doesn't take her pill... should it be the guys problem.
Also, the mother usually gets custody even in equal custody cases. A few of my friends have separated parents and its always the mother who gets them for 4/5 nights and the father for 3/2 nights.
That said there is only 7 days in a week.. flip a coin?
Isthmus
Android Expert
Interesting discussion, but it seems to me that it is missing the forest for the trees. a lot of what is being discussed here are relatively unique and not necessarily frequent instances. To address the original poster, the law is what it is. children do not raise themselves, and after insemination, their gestation is 100% done by the mother, at her expense (physical, social and professional). If your intent when having sex is fun and not procreation, then make the choice from the get go and wrap that rascal or get a vasectomy. in that way you know that you will be safe from unwanted pregancy. If not then educate yourself and understand the law and be prepared to live with the consequences of your actions.
Lets not forget that regardless of the actions and intentions of the parents, no child that makes it to birth asked to be there, nor is it his fault that his parents might be good people, douchebags or anything in between. the laws are there to try and protect them, even when parents might not have that as their main priority. It's not perfect and often fails, but at least that's what it tries to do.
Lets not forget that regardless of the actions and intentions of the parents, no child that makes it to birth asked to be there, nor is it his fault that his parents might be good people, douchebags or anything in between. the laws are there to try and protect them, even when parents might not have that as their main priority. It's not perfect and often fails, but at least that's what it tries to do.
lordofthereef
Android Expert
Isn't this sort of the point of laws or at least the point of being able to challenge them? Laws are not only there to protect frequent happenings but the infrequent ones. My intentions all along was to discuss why the playing field isn't equal between mothers and fathers. I am fully aware why these laws are in place, but if the mother can skate, so should the father be able to.
Abortion is pure selfishness. I personally believe that abortion is not right to use as a birth control. If a woman has a child and then leaves it with the father for him to raise on his own, he can legally ask her for child support.Both are legally financially accountable for the child.
I really don't know what to say. Honestly.
IF they both consented to mutual sex, you are saying that the male has zero risk to his job, his life, and his relationships should be some how equal to a female that has to risk her life, her job, and her relationship.
Not looking at it from a child support, just looking at it from 100% purely physical stand point.
From a straight physical point of view, the male risks nothing from sex if a pregnancy happens. A woman on the other hand can die from a pregnancy. But just physically having the kid, there is a huge emotional, physical, and finical toll the mother is forced to pay. The male physically suffers nothing.
But what you just said is slavery.
slave –noun
1. a person who is the property of and wholly subject to another; a bond servant.
2. a person entirely under the domination of some influence or person.
So when the woman is being forced as a slave to carry a child for 9 months as a punishment for having sex. What happens to the male? How is he going to be punished? The law requires equality or at least fairness.
How is it selfishness to say " I can never give that child a life that it deserves, so I am going to let that soul be born to a family that will love it." How is knowing that you would be a horrible parent, and not having that child, selfish?
You know what a emotionally disturb mother can do to a child in the womb?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/health/physical_health/pregnancy/pregnancy_emotionalhealth.shtml
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/releases/96437.php
Is it really selfish to not want to have a child that you could inflict schizophrenia on because of your emotional state?
Once again, if the man wants the child, then we need to make a way to remove the fetus out of the woman an insert into a male, let the male give birth to it. But until then, slavery is more wrong then abortion.
lordofthereef
Android Expert
Haven't thought about this thread for a while....
I am not sure where the job risk comes into play at all. Health risk I suppose I can see. What, exactly, do you suppose this health risk is, though? All things considered, it is very low, I believe. I am not sure about the relationships risk either. Chances are, word is going to get around that the man impregnated the woman. If the woman wants to stir the pot, that is certainly within her power. If her family or friends judge her for the pregnancy, she can certainly make sure the same people know who the baby daddy is.
So, we are basically back to the health risk. It is my opinion that the health risk is lower than or equal to the potential emotional damage a man must deal with, also possibly for the rest of his life, due to knowing the child he conceived was aborted.
I am not necessarily advocating forcing the woman to come to bring the child to term. In fact, let me make it clear. I am not advocating that at all. What I am saying, is that if it is the mother's option to give the child up or have an abortion, it should too be the fathers option of whether or not he wants to be FORCED to be financially responsible for this child.
I am not sure where the job risk comes into play at all. Health risk I suppose I can see. What, exactly, do you suppose this health risk is, though? All things considered, it is very low, I believe. I am not sure about the relationships risk either. Chances are, word is going to get around that the man impregnated the woman. If the woman wants to stir the pot, that is certainly within her power. If her family or friends judge her for the pregnancy, she can certainly make sure the same people know who the baby daddy is.
So, we are basically back to the health risk. It is my opinion that the health risk is lower than or equal to the potential emotional damage a man must deal with, also possibly for the rest of his life, due to knowing the child he conceived was aborted.
I am not necessarily advocating forcing the woman to come to bring the child to term. In fact, let me make it clear. I am not advocating that at all. What I am saying, is that if it is the mother's option to give the child up or have an abortion, it should too be the fathers option of whether or not he wants to be FORCED to be financially responsible for this child.
They are two TOTALLY differant things. They CANNOT be interlocked.