dbpaddler
Android Expert
And how many old school things come back in fashion simply because they're classic, work well and never really go out of style.
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Evo 4G vs Epic 4G
- Thread starter facekl
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The SPCS Guy
Member
Hi all,
I have to vote for the EVO. I played with the Epic, and i'M SORRY, it just feels very light in the hands, like a toy! It just doesn't have that heavy feeling, like a high priced device should...
JE
I have to vote for the EVO. I played with the Epic, and i'M SORRY, it just feels very light in the hands, like a toy! It just doesn't have that heavy feeling, like a high priced device should...
JE
Droidone
Android Enthusiast
I totally agree.
Droidasaurus X
Lurker
Someone push me over the edge to either side! Both phones look amazing and the only real issue I have with either phone is that I don't know if I can trust Samsung with updates on the Epic. The only other thing is that I'm a gamer so I like the Epic for that and for the fact that it has a keyboard that I can map buttons to on emulators. I won't really use it for texting so can anyone give me some input on running Nesoid, Snesoid, the Genesis emulator, Gameboid and PSX4Droid on the Evo without a controller?
Cobravision
Android Expert
It's too bad the keys on the Epic are in a grid. Had they been offset rows like the TP2, it would have made it easy to emulate a dpad.
One thing about updates that would make me think twice about the Epic is that they've had three months with the GPS problem (the first Galaxy S phone was released in Europe around the same time as the Evo), and there is still no fix. The Evo had a battery fix in a matter of weeks and froyo in two months. And the Epic isn't like the other Galaxy phones, which are primarily GSM slabs running Touchwiz 3.0. The Epic is the only CDMA slider with TW 2.5. So I would expect that the Epic would get their froyo after the rest of the Galaxy phones get them. They're talking about end of Sept for the European versions. No word on the US versions, and no word on the Epic. Imagine if the Evo got gingerbread before Epic got froyo. This could totally happen.
One thing about updates that would make me think twice about the Epic is that they've had three months with the GPS problem (the first Galaxy S phone was released in Europe around the same time as the Evo), and there is still no fix. The Evo had a battery fix in a matter of weeks and froyo in two months. And the Epic isn't like the other Galaxy phones, which are primarily GSM slabs running Touchwiz 3.0. The Epic is the only CDMA slider with TW 2.5. So I would expect that the Epic would get their froyo after the rest of the Galaxy phones get them. They're talking about end of Sept for the European versions. No word on the US versions, and no word on the Epic. Imagine if the Evo got gingerbread before Epic got froyo. This could totally happen.
Thefoodman52
Android Expert
Samsung will make SURE that happens.
Happy customers? ppffhhppffhh...... like they want people who buy their phones.... that's a gas.
Happy customers? ppffhhppffhh...... like they want people who buy their phones.... that's a gas.
dbpaddler
Android Expert
Many would disagree saying there is a level of quality in the ability to make something lighter. Yes, the Evo is heavy and solid, but the Epic fits in the hand and the pocket so much better. And many here are just hypocritical (not saying you SPCS). Once upon a time everybody wanted everything smaller and lighter. Now people are doing a 180 and equating heft with quality. If you just weigh both screens (even if you cut the evo down to 4") the AMOLED screen comes in lighter and is a nice source of weight reduction right there. So calling it a toy because it's lighter with one of the reasons being it uses newer screen tech doesn't completely make sense.
Whoever said they liked the Moment's keyboard better didn't give the Epic's a chance. Took me a few days to get speedy on the Moment's keyboard. Took me a half a day with the Epic. While I haven't done a direct Droid2 comparison, it's tough to complain about the Epic's size and weight especially when comparing the Epic directly to the Moment, which I still own. And Hero owners? the happy ones are the ones that rooted which isn't a fair comparison by any means. One cannot determine a good phone using a rooted one as a benchmark as the masses will not root, and you shouldn't have to root in the first place to have a quality product.
And for the record, I've owned four of the five Android phones on Sprint (could care less about the Intercept) and still own three of those four. The Moment was worth keeping over the Hero. And none of my sales reps kept their Hero. All were junked, returned or just never activated. Three are still using the Moment. Go figure.
Whoever said they liked the Moment's keyboard better didn't give the Epic's a chance. Took me a few days to get speedy on the Moment's keyboard. Took me a half a day with the Epic. While I haven't done a direct Droid2 comparison, it's tough to complain about the Epic's size and weight especially when comparing the Epic directly to the Moment, which I still own. And Hero owners? the happy ones are the ones that rooted which isn't a fair comparison by any means. One cannot determine a good phone using a rooted one as a benchmark as the masses will not root, and you shouldn't have to root in the first place to have a quality product.
And for the record, I've owned four of the five Android phones on Sprint (could care less about the Intercept) and still own three of those four. The Moment was worth keeping over the Hero. And none of my sales reps kept their Hero. All were junked, returned or just never activated. Three are still using the Moment. Go figure.
Thefoodman52
Android Expert
Going to combat what you said, db, I dropped my Moment like a bad habit once the radio issues became apparent with what I would consider normal use. Having the radio lockout because you're using makes this supposedly superior phone (on paper) to the Hero a fancy brick. If I want to use it for anything aside from a game or to read on, I had to pull the battery out of it, and wait while it rebooted in order to use it. I never once rooted my Hero when I had it, and it was, and still is, a far superior phone to the Moment. The Moment, there's no question if you want to keep it you'll have to root it. You're gonna have to! Under clock the CPU, do the radio fixes, then you have a decent handset. You never had to do that to the Hero to make it work as-intended...
dbpaddler
Android Expert
weird. Never had any problems with my moment whether it was stock or rooted. The Hero under 2.1 just seemed to cause everyone problems and not one of them had intact silver paint left on their send/end buttons. I mean five of them. All with solid green and red plastic buttons. Cheap paint jobs. In general though I think both phones are crap and don't even belong on the same shelf as the Evo or the Epic.
And out of the box I have nothing but good things to say about the Evo and Epic. They're both worlds apart from their predecessors. They're both fast and fun to use, and you just pick based off of the features you want.
And out of the box I have nothing but good things to say about the Evo and Epic. They're both worlds apart from their predecessors. They're both fast and fun to use, and you just pick based off of the features you want.
Ive been on the fence for a while now (though was really leaning towards the epic) on which phone to upgrade the third line and have been hanging out in the epic forums for a few days now.
I am pretty much convinced that the Epic wont be a good choice at this moment. There appear be pretty significant issues with the radios especially when in marginal conditions. Considering the complaints of gps low snr, slower 3g speeds and bad reception in general, it kinda leads me to believe that this phone perhaps has issues with the its antenna(s). I dont have any background to make such a statement as an authority, but it does seem like the simplest explanation. I cant imagine that a device of this caliber would have individual problems in each of those areas without some common denominator.
In all fairness, most are very happy with the epic, but unlike the evo's initial physical problems these appear to be more like hardware issues for those units that do have problems.
Considering that Evos seems to be running well now without the early problems some (including myself) experienced I really only see two options, 1. upgrade now to another Evo, or 2. give the Epic another look AFTER they have received a firmware update. Froyo is supposedly comming by December though I would doubt that in itself would correct the reported issues.
I am pretty much convinced that the Epic wont be a good choice at this moment. There appear be pretty significant issues with the radios especially when in marginal conditions. Considering the complaints of gps low snr, slower 3g speeds and bad reception in general, it kinda leads me to believe that this phone perhaps has issues with the its antenna(s). I dont have any background to make such a statement as an authority, but it does seem like the simplest explanation. I cant imagine that a device of this caliber would have individual problems in each of those areas without some common denominator.
In all fairness, most are very happy with the epic, but unlike the evo's initial physical problems these appear to be more like hardware issues for those units that do have problems.
Considering that Evos seems to be running well now without the early problems some (including myself) experienced I really only see two options, 1. upgrade now to another Evo, or 2. give the Epic another look AFTER they have received a firmware update. Froyo is supposedly comming by December though I would doubt that in itself would correct the reported issues.
maggiestar1961
Lurker
EVO all the way, Babe.
dbpaddler
Android Expert
well anyone is welcome to buy my evo. I'm sticking with the epic. Don't see the hate on touch wiz. I didn't even care for Sense's launcher and don't use any of their widgets. It's the other niceties of Sense that sell it (email, messaging, cut and paste). But LauncherPro runs circles around both launchers. I like the toggle widget in the notification drop down on the Epic. Great webOS like feature and it frees up home page real estate you'd otherwise waste on toggle widgets.
Also, back to PalmOS days, you can dismiss a call with a text message. That's just gold for people that often can't pick up on a call. Samsung did very well with their dialer. The HTC dialer is leaps better than stock android, and the Samsung dialer is better than HTC's.
And I'll take light and plastic like over heavy and brick. Feels better in the hand and in the pocket. The screen itself is a source of lightness as the old TFT screen on the Evo weighs more than the SAMOLED, and the back covers are the same material. So it's really on the front faceplate and keyboard surface. The fact that a slider phone is that much lighter than a slate just says something. We already have to carry these big honking phones (amazing the 180 we've done over the past so many years when small was in), the least they can do is lighten the load.
That being said, I still like my Evo and recommend it to others in the company if they're choosing a new phone.
And gps? 4 minutes for a first lock out of nowhere isn't bad. Turn it off and turn it back on and see how much quicker it is. Any cold lock in a different location than it was last used takes longer. Many have actually reported gps to be working fairly well with Tracks and Nav. I had no issues using it with nav which is 70% of why I use gps. 30% would be for doing local searches, and that's been working fine as well.
Also, back to PalmOS days, you can dismiss a call with a text message. That's just gold for people that often can't pick up on a call. Samsung did very well with their dialer. The HTC dialer is leaps better than stock android, and the Samsung dialer is better than HTC's.
And I'll take light and plastic like over heavy and brick. Feels better in the hand and in the pocket. The screen itself is a source of lightness as the old TFT screen on the Evo weighs more than the SAMOLED, and the back covers are the same material. So it's really on the front faceplate and keyboard surface. The fact that a slider phone is that much lighter than a slate just says something. We already have to carry these big honking phones (amazing the 180 we've done over the past so many years when small was in), the least they can do is lighten the load.
That being said, I still like my Evo and recommend it to others in the company if they're choosing a new phone.
And gps? 4 minutes for a first lock out of nowhere isn't bad. Turn it off and turn it back on and see how much quicker it is. Any cold lock in a different location than it was last used takes longer. Many have actually reported gps to be working fairly well with Tracks and Nav. I had no issues using it with nav which is 70% of why I use gps. 30% would be for doing local searches, and that's been working fine as well.
What? The Epic is bigger than the evo, how can it fit better in your pocket? And the change from wanting something smaller has everything to do with what these phones are now being used for, mainly people using them to play games and watch streaming media like youtube. When we mostly used them for phone calls there was no need for a large phone, but once we starting viewing videos you want a big screen to better enjoy it. And if something is too light it just feels like it will break easier.
dbpaddler
Android Expert
What? The Epic is taller and narrower and a whopping 1.2mm thicker. It also has very rounded edges compared to the Evo's almost perfectly square edges. Add up the narrower profile, highly rounded edges and lighter weight and it's easier in the pocket. Also feels nice holding it in landscape and typing, but there's no comparison there unless you switch to vs the Droid2.
I do a lot of canoeing. I have a 20oz wood paddle vs a 7oz carbon fiber paddle. Don't really think I'm equating weight with quality. I think people will skew the characteristics towards whichever phone they favor. If they like the Evo, then heft equates to quality and a solid build. If they don't like it, then it's just a brick that sits like a lead weight in the pocket. If you like the Epic, the light weight is easier to carry, feels nice in the hand and pocket. If you hate it, the light weight and plastic feels cheap.
There's also the law of diminishing returns when it comes to size and carry-ability. Having a 4.3" screen that is 3/4 keyboard when typing defeats the purpose of that nice large screen when using word and excel and other typing intensive applications. So if I lose .3" of overall screen real estate but gain 50% more viewing area when typing, it's a trade off I'm willing to make. If I lose .3" to gain better black levels and contrast along with better viewing in sunlight (which came in handy at the beach today where the Evo was useless), I'll take it.
If HTC was making a high end slider I'd consider that. I owned a Hero. I own an Evo. On screen keyboards suck, for me. I can type well on them, but it's just not intuitive and I'm too prone to mistakes. Not enjoyable at all. So the whole argument of this feature, that feature, bigger, smaller and so on is irrelevant. I care more about being productive with my phone than popping out a stand and streaming movies and playing games. The hard keyboard and better use of the screen is a big plus for me and worth losing Sense over compared to TouchWiz. Form factor outweighs anything else. If something like the Dell Lightning comes to Sprint, I'd be up for that as I'd prefer a portrait slider to a landscape. If the usability for the features I use most increases I switch. As I've said in the past, the death of PalmOS gives me zero loyalty to an OS or manufacturer, and having multiple lines I can upgrade almost at will with only a 1yr contract makes it even easier to not be loyal.
I do a lot of canoeing. I have a 20oz wood paddle vs a 7oz carbon fiber paddle. Don't really think I'm equating weight with quality. I think people will skew the characteristics towards whichever phone they favor. If they like the Evo, then heft equates to quality and a solid build. If they don't like it, then it's just a brick that sits like a lead weight in the pocket. If you like the Epic, the light weight is easier to carry, feels nice in the hand and pocket. If you hate it, the light weight and plastic feels cheap.
There's also the law of diminishing returns when it comes to size and carry-ability. Having a 4.3" screen that is 3/4 keyboard when typing defeats the purpose of that nice large screen when using word and excel and other typing intensive applications. So if I lose .3" of overall screen real estate but gain 50% more viewing area when typing, it's a trade off I'm willing to make. If I lose .3" to gain better black levels and contrast along with better viewing in sunlight (which came in handy at the beach today where the Evo was useless), I'll take it.
If HTC was making a high end slider I'd consider that. I owned a Hero. I own an Evo. On screen keyboards suck, for me. I can type well on them, but it's just not intuitive and I'm too prone to mistakes. Not enjoyable at all. So the whole argument of this feature, that feature, bigger, smaller and so on is irrelevant. I care more about being productive with my phone than popping out a stand and streaming movies and playing games. The hard keyboard and better use of the screen is a big plus for me and worth losing Sense over compared to TouchWiz. Form factor outweighs anything else. If something like the Dell Lightning comes to Sprint, I'd be up for that as I'd prefer a portrait slider to a landscape. If the usability for the features I use most increases I switch. As I've said in the past, the death of PalmOS gives me zero loyalty to an OS or manufacturer, and having multiple lines I can upgrade almost at will with only a 1yr contract makes it even easier to not be loyal.
IrishPilot
Newbie
Not to be too repetitive to whats already been said, but I got my EVO last week, and went in on tuesday for the release of the Epic...and was happy to keep my EVO.
nervouschimp
Lurker
Just played with the Epic. No thanks. I appreciate my Evo even more now. I don't want to offend any Epic fans, but that thing is hunk of garbage. It was already feeling creeky and flimsy, I can imagine how thrashed it will be after a years time. Yes, colors are a little, um, hyper-saturated, but the blue-gray wash doesn't compare to the bright white of the Evo when I viewed web pages on both. I had both the system brightness and browser brightness cranked up all the way, and my Evo is still brighter. Also, there is definitely a screen-door effect that is noticeable enough to bother me.
The Epic did not "feel" like a 250 dollar superphone, it was not noticeably faster than my Evo, either. The touch buttons are weak, and the power button and USB port are in stupid locations.
I hate the Epic.
So glad I didn't wait for this phone.
The Epic did not "feel" like a 250 dollar superphone, it was not noticeably faster than my Evo, either. The touch buttons are weak, and the power button and USB port are in stupid locations.
I hate the Epic.
So glad I didn't wait for this phone.
dbpaddler
Android Expert
Gotta love the two minute demo opinions (not to mention the OBVIOUS bias) on a phone that's been abused by everybody and their brother walking in the store, even if it's been only five days. These opinions just have zero merit.
Evo screen is brighter because you have a blazing backlight that washes out blacks. Colors might look over saturated because you're used to tft. It's like watching an lcd tv and then going back to an HD tube tv. I've posted quite a few pics on full brightness and auto brightness and when presented with any real color on the screen, you see that the overall brightness difference is minimal at best, but the colors on the evo look whitewashed. That extra white in the color adds to the perceived brightness.
I've been typing on the Epic for 3 days now. The phone doesn't creak and twist unless I exert effort to make it happen. There is a touch of play in the slider when shut but is rock solid when open. No different than other sliders I've owned or tried outside of the droid which has a slightly different mechanism.
The buttons require a touch more effort to register, but after a day or two you adjust easily.
The power button and usb connection is the only comment that actually holds water. Speed comparisons are meaningless unless you do fresh power ups on both phones and make sure the exact same things are running. And playing with my evo and epic side by side doing just that has shown the epic to be noticeably quicker. Not yugo to a porsche but it is zippier.
also...hold your Evo at all four corners. Now give a little twisting motion back and forth. Then come back and talk about creaky and flimsy.
Evo screen is brighter because you have a blazing backlight that washes out blacks. Colors might look over saturated because you're used to tft. It's like watching an lcd tv and then going back to an HD tube tv. I've posted quite a few pics on full brightness and auto brightness and when presented with any real color on the screen, you see that the overall brightness difference is minimal at best, but the colors on the evo look whitewashed. That extra white in the color adds to the perceived brightness.
I've been typing on the Epic for 3 days now. The phone doesn't creak and twist unless I exert effort to make it happen. There is a touch of play in the slider when shut but is rock solid when open. No different than other sliders I've owned or tried outside of the droid which has a slightly different mechanism.
The buttons require a touch more effort to register, but after a day or two you adjust easily.
The power button and usb connection is the only comment that actually holds water. Speed comparisons are meaningless unless you do fresh power ups on both phones and make sure the exact same things are running. And playing with my evo and epic side by side doing just that has shown the epic to be noticeably quicker. Not yugo to a porsche but it is zippier.
also...hold your Evo at all four corners. Now give a little twisting motion back and forth. Then come back and talk about creaky and flimsy.
brownhornet
Android Enthusiast
Dude we dont want the epic.. why do you seem to hard up to convince us otherwise lol
dbpaddler
Android Expert
You mean I'm not in a VS comparison type thread but an evo lovefest thread? Guess the names of both phones with the "vs" between them threw me off.
Just making sure the Epic gets a fair shake among the "I must trash the competition to make my defensive self more confident in my purchasing decision" crowd. Especially since half the comments are suspect in their validity giving the whopping two minute comparison most have given. Just sayin'.
Just making sure the Epic gets a fair shake among the "I must trash the competition to make my defensive self more confident in my purchasing decision" crowd. Especially since half the comments are suspect in their validity giving the whopping two minute comparison most have given. Just sayin'.
nervouschimp
Lurker
Thank you for evaluating my opinion, and deeming that it has no merit... otherwise I might have gone on and on without realizing that my opinions are worthless.
You like your Epic. I am happy for you, really... but I don't have to like the Epic...
crow11ad
Android Enthusiast
Bratman
Lurker
So, Seeing as we are right around the corner of the end of the 30 Days since purchase of us Evo owners... i want to hear what you guys have to say about the upcoming Epic 4G? are you going to stick with your Evo? or will you be waiting for the Epic?
as for myself... i like the thought of having a qwerty hardware keyboard, the Super AMOLED looks beautiful and that Hummingbird Processor is begging me to buy it (gpu is better than Snapdragons)... BUT i know i will miss that extra .3" real estate and Sense UI... also, as many others, i really don't like the look of the Epic 4G (especially with a name like that!) it looks like one of those phones you can get for $50
So what are YOUR thoughts?! i also would have added a poll here, but i haven't a clue how to
I'm at the "contract is up" point 9/23 with T-mo. I'm an early Android adopter G1, that is. and there are many in my boat coming to their contract end at the end of this month. We signed up because of the potential of Android and now it's our time to reap those rewards waiting through 1.x to 2.2 as of current updates.
I've been to the different stores to see where my next Android adventure will lead me. T-Mo Vibrant is very pretty like an iPhone clone actually. But I was looking for a bigger screen and physical keyboard.
The Samsung Epic is a very nice phone, it doesn't feel or look cheap as some here suggested, and coming from the G1/hardware keyboard world {SideKick 2/08/G1} it has that extra slideout feature that I like, so I spent several hours at the Sprint store testing it out.
What I Found:
I really like a physical keyboard. I found it to be a little bigger than the others in fact and had to stretched my "thinking" to reach the full keyboard, the Samsung keyboard is very nice and crisp and even feeling, tho I wish it had the shift key on both sides...
That said, the Evo and it's HUGE screen, is an exceptional communication device. I compared the screen colors and yes, the Epic is a little deeper in the color depth, but it is also a noticeably smaller screen... you wouldn't think the .3 meant much but it's wider as well as longer, and that made a big difference on web browsing, more than video viewing which seems to work fine on the Samsung (aspect ratio in HD being what it is)...and I set both screens to relative brightnesses and they were very close. The Evo looking slightly more washed out or actually just lighter in appearance.
Thumb typing on the Evo is not bad at all, coming from a hardcore physical keyboard guy, is saying a lot. The screen is so big the keys were very easy to hit. And I think I can live with it because of all the other features on the Evo. Tho the tactile feel of a real keyboard is much nicer and more reassuring, especially when knocking off something fast.
I then went to the UI and browser and compared them each. I like the Sense UI (HTC) over the Samsung's... which was much easier to get around, in my opinion.
But to me the real test is what I use the phone for most, the web. Stock browser to stock browser, the Evo was much quicker on the page download and overall page display. I did the 1...2...3 press test and every time the Evo downloaded the page (NYTimes, CNN and my personal site) a little to a lot faster. And the Evo displayed my personal page much more accurately than the Epic.
Also I read the Snapdragon vs Humingbird DSP white paper and I would have to concur the Snapdragon seemed faster in real time tests (to my surprise!). Again since I'm upgrading I want the latest greatest since I've been stuck on OS 1.6 without a chance of 2.2! (Officially, that is.) Me, your early adopter, helped you when you needed me the most, left out in the cold... Shame on you Google and T-mo for lack of lustful hardware.
Conclusion:
I've seen rumors of a Evo like instrument w/keyboard (my dream machine) online... but if it's going to ATT, as rumored, I'm out!And luckily,
Sprints seems to currently have the best Data/Vox plan and if I'm going to give up my T-mo legacy (7yrs + super discount good customer etc...) plan I better get all I want for less.
Anyway that's my 2 cents on my testing of the Evo vs Epic this weekend. I'm looking harder at the EVO (tho I do love that keyboard)... maybe something new will come up before my contract is up, but if you have reasons over those I laid out here, that the Samsung is better than the Evo or there is some newer device over the Evo let me know. I want/need to make up my mind soon, and any help is appreciated. Thanks for reading, Bratman.
wayne8888
Newbie
I was curious as to the head to head 4G performance between the 2 phones. So I went to the Sprint store in Towson (in Baltimore County) which is in a fairly strong 4G area. So with my Evo in hand (and the store's Epic), I navigated to both the speakeasy.net/speedtest as well as the speedtest.net sites. To my surprise, the Epic did not even have flash lite so I could not speed test on those sites with them. Love that screen though. I am still trying to get my partner to get the Epic so that we can have an Evo and an Epic under the same roof. Unfortunately only one of the rooms in my house gets even weak 4G with my Evo. Maybe the Epic will perform better in weaker signal areas??? Maybe not?