True, but you can't send an email to a government official and expect to retain your privacy.
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17 year old banned from the U.S.
- Thread starter G.Armour
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True, but you can't send an email to a government official and expect to retain your privacy.
so your argument is officials acted TOO QUICKLY after the President was allegedly threatened?
FTR - the moment you hit SEND, it's public record. However long it takes to "reach" the public is what varies. Sometimes, it's very quickly, sometimes, it never reaches the public attention.
Martimus
One bite at a time...
so your argument is officials acted TOO QUICKLY after the President was allegedly threatened?
Not quite the point I was trying to make... All things sent to/from a government official will "eventually" become a matter of public record... except those items that are deemed by the government to be classified or highly confidential.
And since we know for a fact that the President can use executive privilege to mark items "classified", "confidential", or a "matter of national security", there are several ways for these items to be legally buried within the system. Once an item is buried it can take years, and sometimes decades, for the public to get access to this information.
Case in point... File a FOIA (Freedom of Information Act) request for information relating to the Cuban Missile crisis and, if you are lucky, you'll get copies of documents with large blocks of information on the document blacked out. In the eyes of the U.S. government information that's more than 48 years old is still considered classified for national security reasons.
MannyMel
Newbie
I really enjoy the fact that there are people out there that think Obama is sitting at his desk reading every email that pops into his public email account. Not only do ya'll believe he reads them but he also gets so worked up from criticism that he personally had this kid banned.
This was obviously read by whoever has the job of sifting through these emails and the response (as over exaggerated as it may or may not be) is a result of the current political climate. With all the overblown responses to Obama's desicions and policies do you really expect any other response than this from those in charge of keep the president as safe?
I highly doubt this was a presidential decision and it was more a security decision that in the end doesn't mean a whole lot cause that kid may never even of planned on coming to the U.S.
This was obviously read by whoever has the job of sifting through these emails and the response (as over exaggerated as it may or may not be) is a result of the current political climate. With all the overblown responses to Obama's desicions and policies do you really expect any other response than this from those in charge of keep the president as safe?
I highly doubt this was a presidential decision and it was more a security decision that in the end doesn't mean a whole lot cause that kid may never even of planned on coming to the U.S.
well that still doesn't negate the fact that he made it public when he hit send. What national defense does with it after the fact doesn't affect that fact.
so your argument is officials acted TOO QUICKLY after the President was allegedly threatened?
FTR - the moment you hit SEND, it's public record. However long it takes to "reach" the public is what varies. Sometimes, it's very quickly, sometimes, it never reaches the public attention.
I was under this impression too - that emails sent to government officials are always public record, it just takes longer for some documents to reach the public.
basically, it's up to the recipient as to what happens to that email. Obama admin seems to think keeping it private is better. That's up to them, not the kid who sent it.
Actually, those emails generally become public record (aside from classification... confidential and For Your Eyes Only are both classified categories) when one of two things happens:
1) A new President comes to office. Then the Library of Congress starts going through and making sure they don't need to be classified before making them available to the public. (Millions of emails. It takes awhile).
2) A FOIA act request is filed. The pertinent records are searched and any classified information redacted (if the very existence of the documents is classified then they are withheld completely).
Something doesn't automatically become available to the public simply because it landed in the IN box.
Things must be declassified first, and that is generally done (but not always) after the President leaves office.
Heck, I think the Library of Congress is still going through some of Clinton's records.
we're arguing symantics here... bottom line is it's up to the recipient.... which in this case was the president. The kid has no privacy violation issues because HE hit send.
M
Member243850
Guest
Whoa dude...
Okay maybe i was not clear... i do have trouble communicating sometimes so forgive me if i did not make myself clear...maybe it is my fault... plz understand,
The reason why the childs life is now ruined is because his name is all over the net...for example: when the teenager goes to apply at university / work or any other extremely important application process that requires a good background check... his name will be shown as a criminial or banned from the states and will show up on the computer etc or facebook or wateva... they will reject his applications for work or any university applications because he has a bad background check... Thats's Why dude!
It is simple actually to understand really dude.
And it is important to remember that it is the USA government that has decided to ban the teenager.... It is important to remember that Obummer shud have enough guts to say "let this one pass...we have checked his background and he is no threat technically" and Obummer shud stop the ban that the USA government is trying to pass personally....
And like i said before.... does it really matter who saw the email?
The point of the matter is that he has banned for life now.... the consequences of this are very unfavourable for this teenager... he will have a hard time finding a job now etc....
What has happened to this world?...
ElasticNinja
Android Expert
M
Member243850
Guest
ElasticNinja
Android Expert
LOL twas your faultWhy is it that u keep going waaaaay off topic dude?
shadowninty = Troll Power!!
M
Member243850
Guest
LOL twas your fault
Say whaaaaaat?
I dunno what u mean boetjie.... u went off topic with Obama and white racism or some other sort of rubish along those lines....?
ElasticNinja
Android Expert
I was just pointing out that your "Obummer" term was a derogatory nickname from those far-right krazies
M
Member243850
Guest
I guess calling Bush names was ok though. how conveniently we forget when it suits your purposes.
you seem to think a "kid" can't cause major world wide issues. I will refer you back to that Princip (who shot Archduke Frans Ferdinand) He was 19. Just because society seems to put "adulthood" at 18 makes no difference to me in this case. a 19 and a 17 y.o., to me, is not different to me when it comes to threatening world leaders.
Princip didn't PLAN on killing the Archduke. The opportunity presented itself to him and he took advantage.
We are simply trying to REDUCE the opportunity that this "kid" has. I could care less that he has consequences you or he doesn't like.... he threatened the POTUS. There SHOULD be consequences
would you be so forgiving if it was you or your family that was threatened for doing your job? what if it was a prez you liked?
yeah, how dare the world hold people accountable for their actions.... the nerve
M
Member243850
Guest
you seem to think a "kid" can't cause major world wide issues. I will refer you back to that Princip (who shot Archduke Frans Ferdinand) He was 19. Just because society seems to put "adulthood" at 18 makes no difference to me in this case. a 19 and a 17 y.o., to me, is not different to me when it comes to threatening world leaders.
Princip didn't PLAN on killing the Archduke. The opportunity presented itself to him and he took advantage.
We are simply trying to REDUCE the opportunity that this "kid" has. I could care less that he has consequences you or he doesn't like.... he threatened the POTUS. There SHOULD be consequences
would you be so forgiving if it was you or your family that was threatened for doing your job? what if it was a prez you liked?
yeah, how dare the world hold people accountable for their actions.... the nerve
Sorry dude... you have completely misunderstood what i was trying to say.
I hope i don't get banned for this....you said something very offensive to me there....something that really struck a serious nerve...i will try to be calm...
I will try to be diplomatic here... since u have been pretty rude and intolerant...
What i was trying to say is that the child / young adult / or wateva f 'ing foolish label u want to clamp onto the person...his future is now at stake / jeopardy because every1 knows who he is and will not hire him for a job or allow him into university...plz go back and read again dude... i don't mean to insult u here... try read carefully... you totally misunderstood what i intended to say...
And age is a very important factor btw...we all develop at different rates / speeds /times in life...so i don't know what u r trying to accomplish with that 1?
There is no opportunity that this person / teenager is a threat to the president of USA (Obummer!) ... because this child has no record of terrorist activity.... so why bother with him anyway? It is pretty clear he is no threat....
And to answer ur question about if 1 of my own family members were to be threatened for their job in 1 way or another...well...well...well...
I have been shot at gun point for only a Rands 100 for doing my job which is approximately about 13 American Dollars $.... i took a bullet for my brother to save him...luckily i survived... i wud have given the guy the 100 rands if only i knew what he was after... there were no threats buddy!!...
I take serious offence to what you said there!! U have NO understanding of what that experience was like!! I almost died! And it was only hundered f##king rands .. and there was no chit chat threats "dude". No threats....no emails...no F**KING phone calls saying that i am a P*** threatening me over the telephone.... just BANG!! and that was it! Thats a fact "dude"
So plz don't make foolish assumptions dude... be carfeul what u say "pal".... you have a truck load to learn my friend......you know nothing about true pain!
And there is only 1 president i really care about.... that is our 1st and only Freedom loving and honest President.... Nelson Mandela.... i respect him more than any other president... i respect him a hell of a lot actually... he is a really caring human being that changed the world... and our country...
I think you really need to pay more attention in life "dude"....otherwise... it will get you in a crap load of trouble...
I actually don't care if i get banned for this!
You needed to hear it!
I'm glad he has consequences. Maybe had someone banned Princip after his threat, he wouldn't have had the opportunity to cost 16 million people their lives, and another 21 million injured because he got the chance to do what he wanted to do.
but sorry to say, if you die, taking a bullet for you brother, is not nearly as important as if Obama gets killed. Your death doesn't start world war III, Obama's death can.
I don't support Obama's policies either, but the scope of the reality of a crime against you vs the most powerful man in the free world is just a little bit different.
Think with SCALE, not in terms of personal issues. But Obama's death will affect more than the 20-100 or so that your life touches and therefore, precautions like lifetime bannings should be enforced.
Martimus
One bite at a time...
Dude... I'm not going to make light of your words as I've also been in the line of fire! Thankfully the jerk pulling the trigger in my incident couldn't hit the broad side of a barn... Even so I can appreciate what you've been through!
With respect to the kid I suspect that the kid not being allowed into the U.S. will have minimal impact on the kids life... especially if he has no interest in visiting the U.S.
6 months from now few people in the U.K. will likely even remember this incident. Sooner depending on current events in the United Kingdom. And I'm betting the the U.K. foreign ministry could ask that the boys name be removed from the list.
USA... being proactive in the hunt for terrorism....
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M
Member243850
Guest
Hahhaa thanx Martimus dude....
Damn i lost my temper again.... i am sorry... i just can't handle it sometimes.. damn it!
I apologize to everyone...espicially mactdtdroid... damn dude i apologize....fine we have our own opinions that is fine... i shud controll myself....
... damn... it hurt so much.... i pulled every muscle in my body to account / compensate for the pain of the shot.....i emptied my lungs out of air i screamed so loud...
not preventing Princip in 1914 - made it where 16 million (dead) + another 21 million (injured) go through the same thing you did.
preventing this 17 y.o. may just well prevent WWIII. and since he was the one that hit send on the email, I have no sympathy. I'm also willing to bet, had this kid not been from a country that is one of our strongest allies, more would have been done. I wonder if an Iranian boy who supports Achmadenajed (sp??) had done it, what the consequences would have been?
preventing this 17 y.o. may just well prevent WWIII. and since he was the one that hit send on the email, I have no sympathy. I'm also willing to bet, had this kid not been from a country that is one of our strongest allies, more would have been done. I wonder if an Iranian boy who supports Achmadenajed (sp??) had done it, what the consequences would have been?
copestag
Android Expert
I wouldnt go anywhere near the idea that this has ruined this kids life...... in fact if you think logically you would have to conclude that its just as likely that it increased his chances in life...... remember there are just as many who hate obama as there are who love him...... in some circles this kid is a hero
of course that assumes he even made a threat at all....... which is still not an established fact by any means..... the only thing any of us know for sure is that he called him a name
of course that assumes he even made a threat at all....... which is still not an established fact by any means..... the only thing any of us know for sure is that he called him a name
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