+2
IMO while IOWA can be acerbic and even sometimes confrontational, I think for the most part he's a very positive part for this forum, and truly seems to want to make this a more enjoyable place for all here. I can't say that I feel the same way about the other guy. Again, just IMO.
Sorry in advance if the Mods feel I've said too much.
You made me look up the word acerbic. I haven't had to look up a word in a long time, thanks! (really, I love expanding my vocabulary!)
iVtak said:
How many forums do you visit? A forum is NOT a democracy. Mods have basically supreme power, which is needed. The mods here seem to be lenient compared to other forums I visit.
Very true. The admins can run this as they see fit. I honestly don't see where I personally broke the rules, but instead agree that maybe it was because I "walked the line" too many times. While being a bit too harsh, that is what the admins decided on, and it's their forum, I can start my own if I want to. I have the means, own phpbb, and my own private server. I however don't have the time/motivation to put one up, and for the time being, I like this one.
Phases said:
Sigh. I see you haven't changed. You have no idea how much leeway those two got - nor the story on this situation. But thanks for your usual anti-authority canned response.
Slightly related note - what a coincidence you seem to have gravitated right to the drama on your return.
I'm not really sure what leeway your talking about, on my side. Feel free to point it out, not trying to argue, seeking clarification.
If I don't know what got me banned in the first place, there's nothing to prevent it from happening again.
When IOWA, mbell, and Dorito were banned. There was a peace that I never felt before on these forums. Now it is broken.
Gee, thanks....
Phases said:
So. You're saying you "know he pushes the limit like every time he posts", but upon his temp ban after warnings after walking the line for as long as he has... we're ban happy. Got it!
Listen man. I know you're one of those .. stir stuff up, be that guy, then scream oppression when you're asked to stop.. type guys. But seriously. If you're going to be active here, do something other than gripe about how above everyone you are and how those who act civil around here are sheep and blah blah blah.
Thanks.
Sorry if I'm thinking too black and white here, but is there not a difference between walking the line and crossing it? I'm obviously missing a key importance here. I've admitted it many times, I think differently than most (if not all) people. Clarification needed, please.
Trying to egg on mbell would be my guess. Yesterday they were both warned about bickering and such. Last night IOWA created like 10 topics with 5 or so bashing Apple, probly an attempt to lure in mbell. They are both probly on temp bans.
This post is pure speculation.
I wasn't purposely trying to egg on mbell, but I can see how it can be viewed as such. I'll have to lay off apple news for a while I suppose.
Is it just me or did you guys delete some of IOWA's threads from last night? Also I saw one a few days ago where he linked a bunch of mbell's posts from other forums and it was gone pretty quick.
I enjoy thier bickering, but I can see how it would be a mod's nightmar
I asked mods to remove that thread. I had a change of heart.
Isn't this the second time that IOWA's been banned?
Yes, it was. First time it was because of a "racist" posting that was actually statistical fact. If you mentioned racist and my name in the same sentence around my family/friends, they would laugh at you, and possible look at your funny. Oh well. What's done is done, and while I disagree, this is not my forum, so not much I can do about it, but avoid that topic altogether, start my own forum, or find a new one.
I was thinking that too, but it was only for 24-48 hours last time. I could be wrong though.
No, it was a 7 day ban.
He better not eff up anymore or it may be the last we see of him.
True enough.
Depends...can't read the forums if their IP range was banned (although that might block other users)
They would have to ban 90% of chicago to IP range ban me. The admins can tell you I access from quite a few, consistent, IP ranges.
I saw a banned member named OHIO that had recenly visited IOWA's user profile. The user had no posts what so ever. That makes me wonder if he attempted to make another account..
Not sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Yes, that was me. It was merely a mule to peddle messages back and forth to Shivers/Phases. I even made it quite obvious it was me, you know, OHIO.. lol
It wasn't until now that I just realized that his name was a the name of a state... lmao. Wow did that not really register in my head.
lol....
We told IOWA privately that it wasn't worth it. You can't make people behave (especially when misbehaving can be highly entertaining.) Unfortunately, a suspension isn't exactly what is in order here. This happens because of lack of faith that the forum staff will do what is right.
You can't really win in that situation. He'll take a temporary vacation but feel it was worth it because the forums got "cleaned up a bit." It won't really deter this from happening again because he thinks he's helping. It doesn't really say anything about IOWA really, that is just how people get. When they feel that something needs to be done, consequences be damned.
This will continue as long as people feel that the forum staff blatantly turns a blind eye to behavior such as mbell75's. IOWA would not be the only one to end up banned and everyone would be angry all of the time. The staff would be mad because of the lack of civility and posters would be mad at the "gestapo moderators."
Where do we go from here? We need to be able to trust that the forum staff will handle unwanted elements. The forum staff needs us not to become forum vigilantes yeah, it is a dorky as it sounds and make it harder for them to keep order in a fair and balanced fashion. I am not really sure how to facilitate that kind of environment, but those guys (figuratively) are pretty reasonable, so it wouldn't be too much of a stretch to give them the benefit of the doubt.
What a lot of you may ask is why can't we get them to be more aggressive with posters like mbell75, but remember that there can be a fine line between someone causing a disruption because their behavior/content is unpopular versus actually behaving in a disruptive manner. You don't want the forum staff to be forced to moderate things based on popular opinion because that would cause them and us to lose any sort of credibility we have.
We have a great environment that really encourages us to strive towards equality. The mere presence of the diverse cross section of posters we have is impressive and provides affordances for each of us to broaden our-(OK, I am sure you guys get the picture.) The long and short of it is, let's not abuse the freedoms we have to bully and pick on people just because they are unpopular. If they disrupt our environment, I fully expect the forum staff to come down on them like the hammer of the gods (well OK, not really but it would be cool.)
Thank you. You summarized pretty much what I was thinking, give or take.
Closing:
Well, guess I better watch what i "say" around here, as it has been made clear my posting patterns are not welcome here. Perhaps it is my argumentative nature, ( yes I admit it ) or a combination of some factors. I have been told several times that mbell75 was only reported slightly less than I was... why? I honestly have no freakin clue. My leading theory is people who mysteriously show up with 10 post counts(proxy/fake accounts), are reporting me. I will never know, unless the mods/admins fill me in. And they probably won't, for sake of privacy, and I don't blame them. Or maybe the people here just don't like what I have to say? From the looks of it, most people (in this thread ) seem to be wondering the same thing as me, and to you guys, and everyone who supported me, I would like to give a big thanks to you guys. I understand Phases/Shivers and the team absolutely have their hands full, and don't need more added to their load. So, the easiest solution is to get rid of both parties involved. That's what I'd do, personally, and maybe I would look into it later when things settle down. So no blame to the staff here, as I personally know some (not all) of my posts were not part of the solution, but on the opposite end indeed.
That being said, I am still going to be me, but I'll have to pick and choose my arguments very carefully, and have nothing but facts to back up my standings. (no rhetoric etc)
Why? - If I can't be me on a forum, then why bother posting. Instead, I need to quit arguing with trolls, let them get themselves banned, and just move on. I have not been blessed the official/unofficial "forum vigilante", and I'm sure the staff didn't appreciate it much, so I will refrain from that as well.
I just hope civil debates are still welcome here.....