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Root Discussion: So it's been about a year now...

YankeeDudeL

Android Expert
...since the Droid was rooted, give or take. Took me a couple months to get up the nerve (and education) to do it, but one of the biggest enticements and questions we all had was about OCing. Now that many of us have had rooted and OCed Droids for the better part of a year, do you think it's safe to put rest the rumor of the ill effects OCing can do to your phone?
 
Yeah, I think I rooted mid January last year. It was on Bugless Beauty which didn't have an OC'd kernal. Took me some balls to go with Beast which was, but since then my phone has been at at least 800Mghz since then. Actually I've dialed it down from 1.2 since installing UD 2.5 since I don't even think it's needed.
 
...since the Droid was rooted, give or take. Took me a couple months to get up the nerve (and education) to do it, but one of the biggest enticements and questions we all had was about OCing. Now that many of us have had rooted and OCed Droids for the better part of a year, do you think it's safe to put rest the rumor of the ill effects OCing can do to your phone?


I think it's been safe to put that rumor to bed since the second it was brought up, personally.

Yeah, I think I rooted mid January last year. It was on Bugless Beauty which didn't have an OC'd kernal. Took me some balls to go with Beast which was, but since then my phone has been at at least 800Mghz since then. Actually I've dialed it down from 1.2 since installing UD 2.5 since I don't even think it's needed.

NOPE just because you've been able to do it, and just because you may know 500 ppl who have all done it without a hitch does not mean it is universally acceptable to put the warnings aside.

1) Different people have different levels of technical expertise. how many times can you remember in these very forums of some user running in here and yelling at the top of his lungs something to the effect of
OMG WTF I tried to root my phone and now all I get is a Triangle with an exclamation point in it WTF? It my phone dead? HELLLLLLLLLLLLLLPPPPPPP!!!!

The warnings are still valid - with a little technical knowhow, the right tools and the ability to follow instructions easily, without letting your ADD / ADHD / Short Attention Span kick in and divert your concentration, you can fix *most* of the problems. Still, though, for someone who cannot troubleshoot why an email won't send, this might be a little over his head.

2) NOT ALL DROIDS ARE THE SAME - I cannot count the number of times I have to keep reminding people of this. Some DROIDs take to overclocking well, some don't. Some take to rooting well, some don't. Some take to flashing alternate recoveries well, some don't. Some take to 'formatting' (aka wiping) partitions in a single wipe, some don't.

The perils of mass production - there is an inevitable variability in the hardware in our phones. Add to that the inevitable variability in the apps that we, as individual users, install, and you have too many variables to every be able to fully say "This will work 100% of the time."

3) I already mentioned it in the previous entry, but the human factor - our individuality - in terms of the apps we install, the themes we install, the ROM(s) we choose, etc. all factor in to whether we have a pleasurable experience or not. I honestly do not remember anymore which ROM I originally started out with, but I an tell you that for a while, I was a big fan of the AllDroid Community release (v 0.3?) - it looked exciting, ran great, mad my phone feel (subjectively) faster. Then I wavered back and forth between Pete's Bugless Beasts and UD, sticking with UD for a while as it was more stable and the first ROM that allowed me to OC to 1200 and remain stable.

Now, I have been running LFY of late b/c of some of the features that he has incorporated into his ROM - I'm tempted to try Pete's again, but I am *more* tempted to try out a GB ROM instead.

All in all, the warnings are there for a reason - the possibility of something going wrong always exists. Now, more than ever, they are more for a CYA measure, but still - they're there for a reason.
 
Well sure, your phone may not be able to HANDLE an OC, but generally, in both the PC and Android worlds alike, it's seen that overclocking can't destroy a phone because it will generally become unstable and shut down before the heat can cause any damage, unlike an overvolt where you can just instantly fry the transistors on the chip.
 
I have stated in the past that I have never personally heard of an instance where a OG Droid could not be OC'd to AT LEAST 800MHz. I would expand that and venture to say that almost all D1's (if not 100%) can handle 1.0GHz. Above that...it's on a phone-by-phone basis.

1.1GHz was the max I could go with 100% functionality (no reboots, etc.).
 
i too think that all og droids are capable of over clocking safely. most can handle 1gb easy enough.

the problems come from the operators end not the phone. mostly either by trying to go high or being uninformed about the process.

over clocking your phone will not harm your phone as long as you read up and slowly work your way up to faster kernals (imo) :)
 
I would have to generally agree with the comments made here. OCing your OG Droid is definitely possible; however, the max OC is completely dependent on your actual device. Some can handle 1.25, while others can barely handle 800.

I have been able to OC mine to 1.1 without any issue, but haven't really attempted to OC it any higher. I tried a couple Chevy kernels that were above 1.1 and my phone hated them. So, I have stuck with my trusty 1.1 Chevy LV #2 kernel. That said, I don't notice enough of a speed boost to warrant running my OG Droid at 1.1 all the time compared to 1.0 with "decent" battery life. What I mean is that I run at 1.1 while plugged in and charging, but not on battery. I get about 20-28 hours of battery with normal use (medium texting, occasional phone call, light to moderate data use) while running at 1.0 and about 10-11 hours with the same usage while running at 1.1.

As for rooting, there are so many methods available that if one doesn't work, another surely will. The main ill effect that comes from rooting is the user. If someone roots and doesn't know what the hell they are doing, they could potentially delete or change files that should not be touched. Luckily, we do have ways of reverting to stock (to try again) and backing up our entire system.

I completely agree that the warnings are all the same no matter what. Just because there have not been any (or at least any I know of) reports of a fried Droid from OCing doesn't mean that it cannot happen. I know of a couple people who have OCd their computers and ended up frying their processors, motherboards, etc. Since the general task of OCing does the same thing to a processor on a computer as it does on a mobile phone, I would say that it is completely possible to over work your phones processor.

With all of that said, I don't think that we can completely lay to rest the rumor of ill effects of OCing and rooting. However, we do know that, for the most part, they are not as bad as the Manufacturers would have us to believe.

Kratos
 
Well sure, your phone may not be able to HANDLE an OC, but generally, in both the PC and Android worlds alike, it's seen that overclocking can't destroy a phone because it will generally become unstable and shut down before the heat can cause any damage, unlike an overvolt where you can just instantly fry the transistors on the chip.

While that is true, you have to factor in the added concept of user proficiency with troubleshooting skills as well. Otherwise you get all those posts like I mentioned above.

It's not just whether the phone can handle the OC, or the rooting process, or whatnot, It's the totality of everything, including user experience, that makes the warnings still justified.

I have stated in the past that I have never personally heard of an instance where a OG Droid could not be OC'd to AT LEAST 800MHz. I would expand that and venture to say that almost all D1's (if not 100%) can handle 1.0GHz. Above that...it's on a phone-by-phone basis.

1.1GHz was the max I could go with 100% functionality (no reboots, etc.).

I have seen a pair of DROIDs that acted stupidly on 800 MHz - granted, they were both refurbs owned by different people, both of whom had had their original DROID replaced, and only one of whom had been rooted previously.

I realize the extenuating circumstances (refurbs) probably had a lot ot do with it - but if your phone cannot handle it, regardless of the circumstances, your phone cannot handle it.

i too think that all og droids are capable of over clocking safely. most can handle 1gb easy enough.

the problems come from the operators end not the phone. mostly either by trying to go high or being uninformed about the process.

over clocking your phone will not harm your phone as long as you read up and slowly work your way up to faster kernals (imo) :)

Agreed - as I said above, the problem comes from the totality of the situation - not just the phone, not just the user, not just the instructions - ALL of it put together
.

I would have to generally agree with the comments made here. OCing your OG Droid is definitely possible; however, the max OC is completely dependent on your actual device. Some can handle 1.25, while others can barely handle 800.

I have been able to OC mine to 1.1 without any issue, but haven't really attempted to OC it any higher. I tried a couple Chevy kernels that were above 1.1 and my phone hated them. So, I have stuck with my trusty 1.1 Chevy LV #2 kernel. That said, I don't notice enough of a speed boost to warrant running my OG Droid at 1.1 all the time compared to 1.0 with "decent" battery life. What I mean is that I run at 1.1 while plugged in and charging, but not on battery. I get about 20-28 hours of battery with normal use (medium texting, occasional phone call, light to moderate data use) while running at 1.0 and about 10-11 hours with the same usage while running at 1.1.

As for rooting, there are so many methods available that if one doesn't work, another surely will. The main ill effect that comes from rooting is the user. If someone roots and doesn't know what the hell they are doing, they could potentially delete or change files that should not be touched. Luckily, we do have ways of reverting to stock (to try again) and backing up our entire system.

I completely agree that the warnings are all the same no matter what. Just because there have not been any (or at least any I know of) reports of a fried Droid from OCing doesn't mean that it cannot happen. I know of a couple people who have OCd their computers and ended up frying their processors, motherboards, etc. Since the general task of OCing does the same thing to a processor on a computer as it does on a mobile phone, I would say that it is completely possible to over work your phones processor.

With all of that said, I don't think that we can completely lay to rest the rumor of ill effects of OCing and rooting. However, we do know that, for the most part, they are not as bad as the Manufacturers would have us to believe.

Kratos

Undoubtedly - for 99% of issues (specifically those not hardware related) we can fix the problem. Hardware issues are, for the most part, out of our control.

With computer CPUs, though, the majority of OCing is performed by folks who do not understand that finer points of OCing in the first place - "Let's increase our clock multiplier and see what happens!" Well, if you pay attention to your voltage, it also increases to match the desired output - so you either have to a) manually lower the voltage, or b) stick with it and monitor it to make sure it is not going too far up, especially based upon your hardware capabilities. So many tiny things, like with my Core1Quad CPU and eVGA mobo - adjust the millivoltage of the GTRLEF Lanes to execute timings and speed much better than before are beyond even me - I pick a stable OC and let it go, making sure the voltages stick close to where the hardware specs allow them to be. If I understood what those GTRLEF lanes actually did, and how better to manipulate them , I should be able to take my Core2Quad 6600 from 2.4 GHz to 3.6 GHz, achieving a 50% OC - as it is I settle for a 33% OC to 3.2 b/c that is where it stays stable without really fine tuning those Lanes.

With our phones, it is a little bit different. In the beginning, I tried pushing my phone past hte 100 Mhz barrier - it refused to budge. Back then, there were no low voltage / ultra low voltage kernels available. Low and Behold, (I don't remember who did the first LV - Taz? Chevy? just don't remember, sorry) someone came out with the LV kernel - after 3 more devs started using the LV moniker for their kernels, I tried one - Chevy's 1.2 GHz kernel - and it worked. Perfectly.

Since then I have played with quite a few ROMs, and some liked Chevy's kernel and some didn't - now, on LFY, I leave the stock 1.0 GHz kernel - I've learned that I want ultra stability with a performance boost, but IDGAF about bragging rights regarding what my Quadrant scores anymore - I want to be able to use my phone with my 130+ apps all the time, with no issues like reboots, overheating, etc.

With regards to the OP, though, the warnings, as I and others have said, are just that - warnings. Since these outcomes are theoretically possible, they must still be maintained.
 
I think you're right. While it is, as you said, a CYA kinda move, I guess it is necessary to warn less experienced users of what they're getting into.

Though honestly, I don't see the point of overclocking past 800MHz.

Also, I believe Chevy did the low-voltage kernels initially.

And just to help veer this topic off-course, 3.2GHz up from 2.4 on a Q6600 is definitely respectable. I'm rocking an E6320 and it's comfortable at 2.6GHz up from 1.86 without changing the voltage (which I'm just too scared to do; maybe when this chip can be considered "disposable" I'll do it). Of course, my chassis might as well be a jet turbine with its 7 fans. That low-level noise gives me such a headache. ;)
 
lmfao - only 7 fans? (j/k btw)

Feh. Check out these pics of my 'Beast' - it has some new upgrades that are not pictured, but...

Picasa Web Albums - John Galt - The Beast

Let's see: front intake, rear exhaust * 2, side intake, top exhaust, PSU exhaust * 2, CPU cooler, plus one on each video card (I now have 3, thanks to my buying a GTS 250 to dedicate to PhysX, so three there) plus a chipset cooler fan I rigged on my Northbridge... 12 (9 discounting the video cards, 7 discounting the video cards and PSU).

And I hear ya about the noise - the chipset fan I rigged (the mobo actually came with one, but it blew the air through the chipset cooler - straight onto my primary video card. So I grabbed an old 40mm P4 CPU cooler fan and rigged it to blow in the other direction - so now it blows the heated air off the chipset cooler up towards the CPU cooler fan.) runs full blast putting out like 42 db on its own - super loud. I now have the BIOS set to allow the mobo to control the speed, as opposed to running 100% 24/7 - makes it a lot quieter.

As for the kernel - I wasn't 100% sure, I thought it was Chevy, but I also thought that Taz made some that either only worked for a few people or else didn't work at all originally....

Finally, as for my OC being good - yeah, it's respectable, and that is what I keep pointing out to folks - a 33% stable OC for our desktop CPUs is respectable, and yet I know of lots of DROIDs that can OC 118% over stock settings from 2.0.x / 2.1.x kernels (550 Mhz --> 1200 MHz), which is the equivalent of a 100% OC based upon the CPU specifications, and which is still a 50% OC based upon stock FroYo kernels. This CPU is really a badass CPU (even desktop CPUs aren't rated to work at temps over 150 degC), and I definitely look forward to an unlockable phone with dual core or better CPUs.

P.S. _ I really need to update that entire album. Ive added a new Scanner Epson Perfection V330 Photo Scanner - Product Information - Epson America, Inc. as well as replaced the desk Z-Line
 
This is what I was looking for. Some great discussion and a lot of information going around. The thread even got hijacked, now I know it's a success! lol
 
Heh, I can't help it. I love building computers. :P

That is one badass case, though. And that case fan is huge. I've got 7 mounted on the chassis itself, but then I've also got the PSU fan and the two video card fans for my 320MB 8800GTS. I would get a newer CPU and GPU, but since I'm going to start college next year, I figured it's a good time to start getting more portable. So I got myself an Alienware M11x for a great price on Black Friday. The CPU is a bit sluggish (LV Core 2 Duo @ 1.73GHz), but it has switchable graphics, which is nice because I can actually use it on-the-go in place of my netbook. I figure in a year or so, when laptops come out with better switchable graphics, I can probably sell this one close to the price I got it for ($550).

As for overclocking the Droid CPU, I seriously doubt we'll see more chips with such overclockability, especially when dual-core chips start coming out. That'll be twice the heat to dissipate with the same amount of heatsink material. Or the industry could just do what I think it should and start making huge, 4.3" keyboarded phones!

Sorry for destroying this thread, by the way. ;)
 
Actually, you're forgetting two things:

1) Dual cores != double the heat. You have to factor in things like voltage requirements, etc. as well as better heatsink designs for newer processors (even in compact cases like our phones)

2) Newer CPUs also use a much smaller manufacturing processes (think 90 nm versus 50 nm versus 32 nm) - the smaller the processing size used, the less heat also, typically, although it is not necessarily a favorable ratio - for example, a Core i7 still puts out a lot of heat, not nearly the half that it should of my Core2Quad. Still, though, when thinking in terms of processing power, the amount of heat it puts out versus the amount of processing power available to it makes it the winning choice. For a bit less heat them my processor I get roughly 10 times the processing power....

These two factors together (OK, #1 is a co-mingling of factors, but still) allow for the eventuality of OCing multi-core processors even on our phones.

If for no other reason, then just because we can
 
Well okay, it's true chips get better and better at heat management. I mean, look at those wonderful old P4's! I was just implying that the huge overclock we see on the Droid is not likely to be reproduced in the near future; most of the chips out there generally run at close to their max stable frequency. The Droid was just a freak of nature, in many ways.
 
I have stated in the past that I have never personally heard of an instance where a OG Droid could not be OC'd to AT LEAST 800MHz. I would expand that and venture to say that almost all D1's (if not 100%) can handle 1.0GHz. Above that...it's on a phone-by-phone basis.

1.1GHz was the max I could go with 100% functionality (no reboots, etc.).

There have been a couple of ROMs that would allow me to go as high as 1.2 (maybe JRummy or Chevy), but not all of them. Most allowed me a decent 1.1Ghz, which to be honest, was just as good.
 
Well okay, it's true chips get better and better at heat management. I mean, look at those wonderful old P4's! I was just implying that the huge overclock we see on the Droid is not likely to be reproduced in the near future; most of the chips out there generally run at close to their max stable frequency. The Droid was just a freak of nature, in many ways.

Ahh, in that respect, I suppose I can see it - also there is the fact that this CPU was clocked so lowly in the first place. a 100% OC on 550 MHz is 1100 MHz - but a 100% OC on 1.3 GHz is ... 2.6 GHz - and that would be pushing the limit of a lot of higher end CPUs.

I agree with you on this end of it then.

There have been a couple of ROMs that would allow me to go as high as 1.2 (maybe JRummy or Chevy), but not all of them. Most allowed me a decent 1.1Ghz, which to be honest, was just as good.

I found it was not so much ROM based as it was the number of apps / services I had running and kernel specific. I can do 1200+ allday long using Chevy's and P3 - anything else, fuhgedabouddit
 
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