I believe that marijuana should be legal (discussion)

[Bob Maxey]

Doesn't it take far more processing to make a "usable" drug out of the poppy than it does with marijuana? If so, I suppose it's kind of like the ingredients for meth aren't illegal on their own, but once concocted it is an illegal substance.

1- find several pots or containers filled with soil
2- order seeds from any of more than hundreds of sources
3- plant you seeds, water, love, sing to them, feed well
4- when the pods (?) ripen and are ready for processing and are bursting with all that opium goodness . . .
5- do a simple thing with a simple tool and wait for the plant to excrete the raw stuff
6- scrape, gather, dry, and smoke

 

[lordofthereef]

That seems more involved than plucking a bud, drying it out, and smoking it. Just saying, marijuana is essentially consumed in a raw unprocessed (aside from drying I guess, but that might not even be required) form, AFAIK.

I see where you are coming from though. I would guess it would have to do with the processing involved.

 

[BiggestManEver]

Perhaps the question wasn't clear. What I am asking is, before the ban, could one even find a bar that was a non-smoking bar? I know we can currently find a non-smoking bar, but that was the point of the ban, to make all bars non-smoking.

Probably rare.

Even today there are plenty of "smoking" bars. Usually they have a locked gate and you have to ring a buzzer to get in, so they can get everyone to put out their cigs if the police come a-knocking. I know of at least three places in five miles that allow smoking illegally.

 

[tommy_ed]

Smoking the weed does not help further your health. Forget just how much or how little, it just does not help. It has to, because smoking anything is bad for your health.

Or perhaps you are saying that smoking MJ does absolutely no harm whatsoever. You are not specifically saying that, and I do not mean to put words in your mouth, just asking.

So make a public statement: MJ does absolutely no harm to the body, yes or no.

So how can the government allow something like MJ that is smoked and take such a hard stance on tobacco? Legalization is approval. Seems it would be rather hypocritical to allow MJ but not tobacco.

With the upcoming Obama Care plan, perhaps what you do with your body is in a way, my/our business? We will be paying your medical insurance bills, after all.

ummm maybe you should read my statement again, where did I claim marijuana was good for your health? I said:

why does it matter how it effects your own body? as long as the way we're doing these substances isn't effecting other people's lives we should be able to do them. Driving impaired already is and would remain illegal and enforced. I'm sure you wouldn't be allowed to smoke indoors. Why not save and then make some money off of it that we can put towards something actually useful?

in other words, why does it matter if it's addictive, good or bad for us, etc.... it's our decision to do it, not the government's. What happened to the free country?

In Utah, I cannot (easily) open a bar where people can smoke. Forget the health issues of the workers; if they want a job, smoke does not matter because they have a choice, take it or leave it. Patrons do not need to patronize if smoking is allowed.

I think those that tell me that I can't open a smokers bar should kiss my arse. A few idiots think they should dictate what I do on my property. Screw that, I say. By the way, you see outright bans on things like trans-fats, so they are coming for you.

As Paul Revere or some other dead guy said, Give me liberty or give me death. He was fighting, in part, against those that said, FU and your liberty, we will give you what we want and take from you what we want.
well on our way and guess what . . . your favorite things are likeny the next target.

the thing I love about this statement... is the fact that you've completely contradicted everything you've been saying this entire time. make up your mind, do you want a free country or don't you?!

 

[tommy_ed]

I smoke and I drink, and I know they are bad things. I think that has been conveyed in the past. But we are stuck with them and we do not need another intoxicant made legal.

So no, I oppose legalizing MJ because we do not need more intoxicants.

And I am not so sure I accused anyone of being a hypocrite. Perhaps so. I did accuse the government of being such should they legalize MJ, however.

hmmm how about this, bob.. If we were during prohibition right now, what would your stance be on alcohol? Would it be

But we are stuck with tobacco and we do not need another intoxicant (alcohol) made legal. So no, I oppose legalizing alcohol because we do not need more intoxicants.

i think the only reason you oppose marijuana is because you don't do it, therefore don't understand it. why not let someone smoke a joint in their home while you drink a beer in yours?

 

[Bob Maxey]

hmmm how about this, bob.. If we were during prohibition right now, what would your stance be on alcohol? Would it be

i think the only reason you oppose marijuana is because you don't do it, therefore don't understand it. why not let someone smoke a joint in their home while you drink a beer in yours?

I know, I know . . . my drug experience is sorely lacking, so I guess I can't discuss meth, coke or smack, either. Until you know me, perhaps you should avoid opinions that are based on lack of data. I know a great many things about a great many things and because I am older than you, I have more life experiences, too.

As for Prohibition? Well, who knows. I am a law and order kinda guy and perhaps I'd simply capitulate and avoid the local speak easy. Or improve my bathtub gin recipes. But it will not happen (again) so it is a non-issue.

The benefits of social drinking compared to MJ users, is we are not addicted and we can stop. Weed users simply argue how much they are not addicted to weed decade after decade, stoned and happy, and addicted to munchies.

By the way, absolutely nobody smokes anything in my house, period. Not even me. And those that make it through the doors know the rules, so it is not an issue. Anyone that is invited knows I do not approve of MJ so it is not an issue, either.

 

[nlsme]

I know, I know . . . my drug experience is sorely lacking, so I guess I can't discuss meth, coke or smack, either. Until you know me, perhaps you should avoid opinions that are based on lack of data. I know a great many things about a great many things and because I am older than you, I have more life experiences, too.

As for Prohibition? Well, who knows. I am a law and order kinda guy and perhaps I'd simply capitulate and avoid the local speak easy. Or improve my bathtub gin recipes. But it will not happen (again) so it is a non-issue.

The benefits of social drinking compared to MJ users, is we are not addicted and we can stop. Weed users simply argue how much they are not addicted to weed decade after decade, stoned and happy, and addicted to munchies.

By the way, absolutely nobody smokes anything in my house, period. Not even me. And those that make it through the doors know the rules, so it is not an issue. Anyone that is invited knows I do not approve of MJ so it is not an issue, either.

Really, social drinkers are not addicted, yet you ignore the alcoholics that are. To the point, that IF they tried to quite, they could die. And, in the same sentence, claim that MJ users are addicted? Seriously, you talk about data to back it up. I would like the data that backs up your claim that MJ is physically addictive....

 

[BiggestManEver]

The benefits of social drinking compared to MJ users, is we are not addicted and we can stop. Weed users simply argue how much they are not addicted to weed decade after decade, stoned and happy, and addicted to munchies.
.

Hurr durr, there are social drinkers, and social smokers.

Don't get those mixed up with the alcoholics and the addicts (even though Marijuana isn't physically addictive).

 

[nlsme]

Hurr durr, there are social drinkers, and social smokers.

Don't get those mixed up with the alcoholics and the addicts (even though Marijuana isn't physically addictive).

He thinks because some people get mentally addicted (they like it, and choose to continue doing it) it is as bad or worse than drugs that ARE physically addictive. Seriously, he thinks that meth and crack are on the same level, yet alcohol isnt.....

 

[BiggestManEver]

He thinks because some people get mentally addicted (they like it, and choose to continue doing it) it is as bad or worse than drugs that ARE physically addictive. Seriously, he thinks that meth and crack are on the same level, yet alcohol isnt.....

To be quite honest, I think meth and crack should be decriminalized too. Why should I care if people are killing themselves inside the privacy of their own homes?

 

[tommy_ed]

I know, I know . . . my drug experience is sorely lacking, so I guess I can't discuss meth, coke or smack, either. Until you know me, perhaps you should avoid opinions, blah blah blah...

way to dodge my question. again.

1.if alcohol was illegal, would you oppose legalizing for the simple fact that it would be adding another legal intoxicant, as you claim for marijuana?

and don't give me the "well it's not illegal, so that doesn't count" excuse... it just makes it obvious you have no answer.

2. Now that it's been established that impaired driving would be enforced, addictiveness has no bearing on whether or not a substance should be illegal, that we stand to save and then in turn make billions by lifting prohibition, that we could more easily keep it out of the hands of minors, and that prohibition is providing some jobs for criminals as dealers, WHAT IS YOUR REASON FOR WANTING MARIJUANA TO REMAIN ILLEGAL??

3. while we're at it: you already said you don't think it's right for the government to be able to tell you what you can and can't do in your own home, so are you saying you disagree with yourself?

let's see if you can answer these ones without avoiding the actual questions....

 

[B2L]

He thinks because some people get mentally addicted (they like it, and choose to continue doing it) it is as bad or worse than drugs that ARE physically addictive. Seriously, he thinks that meth and crack are on the same level, yet alcohol isnt.....

I completely agree with you nlsme. Some people can gain a mental dependency with Marijuana. I personally am one of those people, it's not like i am physically addicted to it. (So many people believe that you can be physically addicted but it's impossible.)

I am very responsible when it comes to smoking and only do it in my free time, i never come to work high. And i would say that i am a pretty smart person, most people that know me have no clue at all that i smoke. But my true friends know that i do about 3-4 times a day.

And the worst part about it is every time i go and buy a small amount i could be thrown in jail. The marijuana laws are really harsh in Utah, even the smallest amount can get you 6 months in jail and a huge fine.

My only question is why? It's not something that is going to kill you, it's not hurting anyone. We continue to throw people in jail for smoking pot, how can it possibly be a good thing to waste all of this taxpayer money to throw someone in jail that's just trying to have a happy life. Sorry for ranting, this topic is very frustrating to me. Especially when cigarettes and alcohol are legal but they will kill someone far before marijuana ever would.

 

[lordofthereef]

WHAT IS YOUR REASON FOR WANTING MARIJUANA TO REMAIN ILLEGAL??

His main argument, AFAIK, is that we already have enough things available to use to destroy our health, why should we have another that is sanctioned by the government.

I suppose there is some truth to this, but in my eyes there are far more benefits to legalization than anything else.

I mean let's take a look at some changes that have happened in my lifetime:

Cigarette ads can no longer be cartoons. Really? Because it was the cartoon that was getting people to start smoking?

No TV commercials for cigarettes allowed. Really? I see alcohol commercials all the time. Aside from kids networks you would be hard pressed NOT to see TV ads for some form of alcoholic beverage.

I am sure there are more, but my point is they have only gotten more strict with alcohol and tobacco even in recent years. What does legalizing one substance say when you are spending time and money placing restrictions on others?

 

[Bob Maxey]

Really, social drinkers are not addicted, yet you ignore the alcoholics that are. To the point, that IF they tried to quite, they could die. And, in the same sentence, claim that MJ users are addicted? Seriously, you talk about data to back it up. I would like the data that backs up your claim that MJ is physically addictive....

I do not ignore the alcoholics. Most certainly, they exist. Most social drinkers are not alcoholics.

His main argument, AFAIK, is that we already have enough things available to use to destroy our health, why should we have another that is sanctioned by the government.

I suppose there is some truth to this, but in my eyes there are far more benefits to legalization than anything else.

I mean let's take a look at some changes that have happened in my lifetime:

Cigarette ads can no longer be cartoons. Really? Because it was the cartoon that was getting people to start smoking?

No TV commercials for cigarettes allowed. Really? I see alcohol commercials all the time. Aside from kids networks you would be hard pressed NOT to see TV ads for some form of alcoholic beverage.

I am sure there are more, but my point is they have only gotten more strict with alcohol and tobacco even in recent years. What does legalizing one substance say when you are spending time and money placing restrictions on others?

That is what I am saying. We do not need another thing to damage health. And again, why should the government legalize it since smoking is already looked upon as a bad thing?

Yes, you see alcohol ads on TV but not smokes. So what is your point in the second paragraph? And yes, no TC commercials for cigarettes on network TV, Really!

I completely agree with you nlsme. Some people can gain a mental dependency with Marijuana. I personally am one of those people, it's not like i am physically addicted to it. (So many people believe that you can be physically addicted but it's impossible.)

So you agree the weed is addictive? And naturally, those that smoke are never addicted, it is just the other fella, right?

Enough said, I suppose.

To be quite honest, I think meth and crack should be decriminalized too. Why should I care if people are killing themselves inside the privacy of their own homes?

Well, supporting an ongoing criminal enterprise is not good, so yes indeed, lets legalize it.

 

[lordofthereef]

That is what I am saying. We do not need another thing to damage health. And again, why should the government legalize it since smoking is already looked upon as a bad thing?

Yes, you see alcohol ads on TV but not smokes. So what is your point in the second paragraph? And yes, no TC commercials for cigarettes on network TV, Really!

My point was actually backing you up... we are already getting more strict with tobacco and alcohol, so it will be hard to convince the gov. that yet another thing needs legalized while everything else is having limitations set upon it.

I do find it ridiculous that tobacco commercials can't be, yet alcohol can.

 

[tommy_ed]

I do not ignore the alcoholics. Most certainly, they exist. Most social drinkers are not alcoholics.

just as most social smokers are not addicted. we've already established that around the same percentage of people become addicted to alcohol as marijuana.

That is what I am saying. We do not need another thing to damage health. And again, why should the government legalize it since smoking is already looked upon as a bad thing?

why do you care if someone else damages their health? how is it any of your (or the government's) business?

the only reason marijuana is seen as a bad thing is because of the lies/propaganda the government has spread

 

[Adauth]

Some people are so blinded by government ( and other anti-drug groups) propaganda it's laughable.

 

[B2L]

So you agree the weed is addictive? And naturally, those that smoke are never addicted, it is just the other fella, right?

Enough said, I suppose.

There is a huge difference between a mental and physical addiction. It shouldn't even be called an addiction. It's not like I'm going around giving HJ's for some pot.

I can go weeks and months without smoking. The only problem with that is I'm a complete insomniac, and i have been since i was really young before i started smoking. I smoke because it helps me relax and go to sleep, there are plenty of benefits from doing it.

I mean seriously why are you so against it? Marijuana is the largest cash crop in the US. People will do it no matter if it's legal or not. The only thing this country is doing is hurting itself by keeping it illegal. All it needs to do is be regulated and taxed, by doing this it will help keep good people out of jail and make a great impact on our economy.

The government spends billions of dollars on the war on drugs. This is the same situation as alcohol prohibition was, and with so many Americans using it. This will/has to come to end.

Also with your claim about people smoking it and being a risk to their health. You don't even realize that most people vaporize, or cook with it. Which get's rid of the carcinogens from smoking it. If you do some research on a comparison between smoking and vaporizing you will see that most of the harm it's causing is gone.

 

[tommy_ed]

and Bobbbb I'm still waiting for an answer!!!!

way to dodge my question. again.

1.if alcohol was illegal, would you oppose legalizing for the simple fact that it would be adding another legal intoxicant, as you claim for marijuana?

and don't give me the "well it's not illegal, so that doesn't count" excuse... it just makes it obvious you have no answer.

2. Now that it's been established that impaired driving would be enforced, addictiveness has no bearing on whether or not a substance should be illegal, that we stand to save and then in turn make billions by lifting prohibition, that we could more easily keep it out of the hands of minors, and that prohibition is providing some jobs for criminals as dealers, WHAT IS YOUR REASON FOR WANTING MARIJUANA TO REMAIN ILLEGAL??

3. while we're at it: you already said you don't think it's right for the government to be able to tell you what you can and can't do in your own home, so are you saying you disagree with yourself?

let's see if you can answer these ones without avoiding the actual questions....

 

[Bob Maxey]

way to dodge my question. again.

1.if alcohol was illegal, would you oppose legalizing for the simple fact that it would be adding another legal intoxicant, as you claim for marijuana?

and don't give me the "well it's not illegal, so that doesn't count" excuse... it just makes it obvious you have no answer.

2. Now that it's been established that impaired driving would be enforced, addictiveness has no bearing on whether or not a substance should be illegal, that we stand to save and then in turn make billions by lifting prohibition, that we could more easily keep it out of the hands of minors, and that prohibition is providing some jobs for criminals as dealers, WHAT IS YOUR REASON FOR WANTING MARIJUANA TO REMAIN ILLEGAL??

3. while we're at it: you already said you don't think it's right for the government to be able to tell you what you can and can't do in your own home, so are you saying you disagree with yourself?

let's see if you can answer these ones without avoiding the actual questions....

1- No, if it were illegal, the answer is no.
2- Because we do not need more problems.
3- I still maintain that the government has no business in my business. within reason.

Clear enough?

 

[tommy_ed]

1- No, if it were illegal, the answer is no.
2- Because we do not need more problems.
3- I still maintain that the government has no business in my business. within reason.

Clear enough?

not really, to be honest.

1. i didn't understand your response, no you would not want it to be made legal, or no you wouldn't use that as a reasoning,???

2. That one is clear enough. Still doesnt make sense considering that most people already do it anyways, but...

3.Then you agree that we should be able to do what we want in the privacy of our own homes? define within reason

 

[Member243850]

I finally opened up my tiny brain and (eventually) realized that cannibus should be legalized now.

I am starting to understand it.

I owe you an apology tommy_ed (sent you a PM)

Any who

It is against human rights to stop someone from doing something like smoking weed if they really want to.

Let me try explain it as hard as I can.

A human being should be able to do whatever they want to in life as long as it does not hurt anyone else.

Okay this is hard to explain and I am not that good at explaining things but I will try.

And I do also believe that if the government puts a taxation on cannabis you can also use that money from the tax to help educate or inform people about cannabis.

I think we know too little about cannabis and all it's effects.

I could be totally wrong about its effects but I think hardly any one has actually studied it very thoroughly and very scientifically.

If we educate the youth about cannabis (with money from the taxation) then people can make the choice for themselves and it is their choice and theirs alone.

You can't tell some one else what to do with his / her life and you shouldn't be restricting what others do with their lives. That's why I believe it is against human rights.

If everybody is educated / informed about cannibus then they can make their own decision for his / her self.

Hmm damn I am really trying my best to explain it but I am falling a bit short... lol

And I also think that if alcohol is legal then why in the world can't we add cannabis to it?

Alcohol and the effects or damages on the body are close to cannabis so why not make them both legal?

Like alcohol we should make an age restriction for cannabis lets make it 18 for simplicity's sake.

If you are 18 you can smoke cannabis that is what I believe.

I think most people will be mature enough to understand at 18 what they can and can't do with his / her life.

You can't tell people what to do with their lives.

Thats why I belive it is against human rights.

We should also make the rule that if you are under the influence of cannabis or have smoked cannabis recently then you may not drive or operate any heavy machinery until it has left your body / system just like alcohol.

Hmm damn I hope I made some sense! Sorry if I am not getting my message across that well!

Sorry if this post is the size of China!

lol I could be wrong though

Regards

Stinky

 

[B2L]

I finally opened up my tiny brain and (eventually) realized that cannibus should be legalized now.

I am starting to understand it.

I owe you an apology tommy_ed (sent you a PM)

Any who

It is against human rights to stop someone from doing something like smoking weed if they really want to.

Let me try explain it as hard as I can.

A human being should be able to do whatever they want to in life as long as it does not hurt anyone else.

Okay this is hard to explain and I am not that good at explaining things but I will try.

And I do also believe that if the government puts a taxation on cannabis you can also use that money from the tax to help educate or inform people about cannabis.

I think we know too little about cannabis and all it's effects.

I could be totally wrong about its effects but I think hardly any one has actually studied it very thoroughly and very scientifically.

If we educate the youth about cannabis (with money from the taxation) then people can make the choice for themselves and it is their choice and theirs alone.

You can't tell some one else what to do with his / her life and you shouldn't be restricting what others do with their lives. That's why I believe it is against human rights.

If everybody is educated / informed about cannibus then they can make their own decision for his / her self.

Hmm damn I am really trying my best to explain it but I am falling a bit short... lol

And I also think that if alcohol is legal then why in the world can't we add cannabis to it?

Alcohol and the effects or damages on the body are close to cannabis so why not make them both legal?

Like alcohol we should make an age restriction for cannabis lets make it 18 for simplicity's sake.

If you are 18 you can smoke cannabis that is what I believe.

I think most people will be mature enough to understand at 18 what they can and can't do with his / her life.

You can't tell people what to do with their lives.

Thats why I belive it is against human rights.

We should also make the rule that if you are under the influence of cannabis or have smoked cannabis recently then you may not drive or operate any heavy machinery until it has left your body / system just like alcohol.

Hmm damn I hope I made some sense! Sorry if I am not getting my message across that well!

Sorry if this post is the size of China!

lol I could be wrong though

Regards

Stinky

Overall I agree with you. Although, the damaging effects of alcohol and marijuana can't even be compared. In the sense that alcohol can kill you from drinking any amount. You can die from alcohol poisoning. But on the other hand if you smoke marijuana it can't kill you. You would have to smoke somewhere around twice your body weight within an hour to kill yourself. Which is physically impossible. Now dying later in life from cancer caused by the carcinogens inhaled while smoking it can kill you down the road.

The other thing is that it would really be pretty much impossible to tell if someone is driving high or not. Because technically marijuana can stay in your system for 2 to 4 weeks.

But other than that I definitely agree. People should be able to do what they want as long as they aren't hurting anyone.

 

[KingOfGreen]

Think about all the new perscription drugs that come out and how many get recalled get recalled. They cause things like heart disease, blood clots, blindess, seizures, and sooooo much more. But weed is too dangerous to be legalized?? Come on!

 

[lordofthereef]

why do you care if someone else damages their health? how is it any of your (or the government's) business?

Well, when Wellfare Joe is being treated for lung cancer on my dime (tax payer $$), I have a big problem with it. That is equally true for any substance.