low hung pants

[shawn1224]

And this is how rumors spread and others adopt. That is not true at all. It was because of poor-fitting prison wear. Many prisoners were issued sizes that were too large and with the combination of lack of belts (for prevention of suicide), sagging developed. It was spread to mainstream with the popularity it had with Hip Hop artists.

It has NOTHING to do with gay people "advertising" themselves in prison. No gay man in prison would advertise himself for sex in prison and it isn't done today. It supports the notion that gay men don't get raped in prison because they like it anyways, which have led to abuse of gays in prison.

Really amusing to see how easily the rumor spread within just this one thread without any ? I thought it sounded absurd.

That could very well tie in to its origins but it's a well known fact that men in prison who wore it below their butts were advertising that they were homosexuals.

 

[Vihzel]

That could very well tie in to its origins but it's a well known fact that men in prison who wore it below their butts were advertising that they were homosexuals.

Well known fact? Exactly how is it well known and factual?

It's so absurd that I can't even find articles on it other than stating the rumor.

 

[shawn1224]

Well known fact? Exactly how is it well known and factual?

It's so absurd that I can't even find articles on it other than stating the rumor.

Well known enough that peole who have been in prison have stated as such.

 

[Frisco]

..it's a well known fact that men in prison who wore it below their butts were advertising that they were homosexuals.

Gays in prison "advertise" that? There are flamboyant people of all sexual orientations, even in prison, I'm sure. But that statement you're making is hyperbolic at best, and a cruel falsehood at its center.

"Well known facts" have volumes of proof, everywhere. "Well known rumors," on the other hand, have only other rumors to fall back on.

 

[Vihzel]

Please don't confuse well known facts with "well known" rumors.

Exactly who are these "people who have stated as such" and when did it start? How many of those "people" are simply restating the rumor? Only ONE person can start a national or even international rumor, as evidenced by the recent rumor that Facebook is going to close on March 15, 2011. A million people can all say that "Facebook is closing!" without figuring out if its true or not.

Just because some people say it is so doesn't mean it is true... like the Salem Witch Trials. 20 people calling someone a witch doesn't make it true.

I've done a lot of "Googling" and can't find anything that supports this rumor of gays advertising themselves in prison. I've found several clearly stating that there was this rumor going around, like how another origin of sagging is that African Americans sagged to better conceal their weapons, which is found to be without substantial evidence.

 

[Frisco]

Well known enough that peole who have been in prison have stated as such.

Yeah, we need to gather more knowledge from ex-cons; a great source of deductive perception and of reliability at their word.

 

[Member138406]

Yeah, we need to gather more knowledge from ex-cons; a great source deductive perception and of reliability at their word.

It is about prison.. if you want the answer go to the source.. just because your in prison or a ex-con does not automatically make you a liar.

 

[shawn1224]

Gays in prison "advertise" that? There are flamboyant people of all sexual orientations, even in prison, I'm sure. But that statement you're making is hyperbolic at best, and a cruel falsehood at its center.

"Well known facts" have volumes of proof, everywhere. "Well known rumors," on the other hand, have only other rumors to fall back on.

Trust me I'm not making this stuff up. My brother inlaw spent 11 years in TDCJ and when he first went in he said he would sag because that was the style in the streets but he was warned that it had a different meaning among inmates. It was basically saying that you were somebody's girlfriend.

To be honest it might very well have originated from loose fitting clothing but it has certainly evolved into something else.

 

[Vihzel]

It is about prison.. if you want the answer go to the source.. just because your in prison or a ex-con does not automatically make you a liar.

That's correct, but it also doesn't mean that they're the most reliable either. If you want to know more about the injustices of the Chinese government committed, go talk with a government official. They're the source... but can you trust them?

 

[Member138406]

That's correct, but it also doesn't mean that they're the most reliable either. If you want to know more about the injustices of the Chinese government committed, go talk with a government official. They're the source... but can you trust them?

Ya I am not saying anything related to what you two are talking about. I just think it is unfair to label all people in prison like that.

 

[Vihzel]

Trust me I'm not making this stuff up. My brother inlaw spent 11 years in TDCJ and when he first went in he said he would sag because that was the style in the streets but he was warned that it had a different meaning among inmates. It was basically saying that you were somebody's girlfriend.

To be honest it might very well have originated from loose fitting clothing but it has certainly evolved into something else.

That's a LOT more reasonable. It's like how the word "gay" has evolved over the years. Before, everyone knew it as simply "happy" and now... VERY different meaning today.

Ya I am not saying anything related to what you two are talking about. I just think it is unfair to label all people in prison like that.

Understood!

 

[Frisco]

..just because your in prison or a ex-con does not automatically make you a liar.

I would find it easier to trust other sources.

But somebody in the thread did quote from a friend's experience in the pen that it could have started one way (the sag thing) and ended up being used another by some Gays.

That seems a bit more plausible.

As far as judging those who do that on the streets, I'm not sure if seeing them as appearing very foolish and silly is a judgement, but I'll bet it's a lot like I was seen when I wore my collar up and grew long sideburns as a kid.. so I understand that.

Judging and not trusting ex-cons, though, I'm sorry, but a great sense of wariness needs to be exercised when interacting with convicted felons. That is just a fact of life.

 

[Bnice]

The origin of sagging from what I have gathered was it started when the clothes was passed down in the family and did not always fit so you end up with a big pants that did not fit. I just wonder why a parent would let his kids leave the house with his pants hanging like that.

 

[Bob Maxey]

I dunno...maybe its Just because I'm younger but I don't see the big deal. Its something some people do and it doesn't have any effect on anyone but themselves...so why stop it? Because its unprofessional? Well last time I was professional I was at work or a job interview...and in that case I agree...it shouldn't be allowed. But for simply walking around in public...that's casual and personally I don't care. I don't do it but I don't see the harm. Personally I hate it when people judge like that. I have long hair and I'm skinny. Some people assume I'm a no good, skater punk because of it...but if they actually got to know me, I could prove to them that I'm VERY intelligent and far from the "stereotypical" long haired hooligan. And I hate it when people judge because I like my hair a certain style. Just like I hate when people judge based on clothing.

Bob is soooooooo old, he remembers when men dressed to go out, as did the women. Their hair was in order, they were clean, they wore nice clothes, ditto the men.

I think we judge people by how they look and I am fine with that. If you want to dress like a poor fool, go for it. Sends me a signal that says, "This person is a looser, avoid the dump."

Perhaps we need to get back to dressing appropriately when we go out in public. I think it is time we treat people based on their public appearance. Parents . . . Teach your children well.

Bob

 

[AndreaCristiano]

I dunno...maybe its Just because I'm younger but I don't see the big deal. Its something some people do and it doesn't have any effect on anyone but themselves...so why stop it? Because its unprofessional? Well last time I was professional I was at work or a job interview...and in that case I agree...it shouldn't be allowed. But for simply walking around in public...that's casual and personally I don't care. I don't do it but I don't see the harm. Personally I hate it when people judge like that. I have long hair and I'm skinny. Some people assume I'm a no good, skater punk because of it...but if they actually got to know me, I could prove to them that I'm VERY intelligent and far from the "stereotypical" long haired hooligan. And I hate it when people judge because I like my hair a certain style. Just like I hate when people judge based on clothing.

I'm younger and I will tell you that whole culture of sagging pants and speaking ebonics makes a whole generation seem ignorant and thuggish. No one takes anyone seriously when they look and act like that. There in lies the problem.

 

[redraptor]

Bob is soooooooo old, he remembers when men dressed to go out, as did the women. Their hair was in order, they were clean, they wore nice clothes, ditto the men.

I think we judge people by how they look and I am fine with that. If you want to dress like a poor fool, go for it. Sends me a signal that says, "This person is a looser, avoid the dump."

Perhaps we need to get back to dressing appropriately when we go out in public. I think it is time we treat people based on their public appearance. Parents . . . Teach your children well.

Bob

I think its about time to treat people as we would like to be treated, regardless of what clothing they wear, or what color skin or sexual orientation they are.

I'm younger and I will tell you that whole culture of sagging pants and speaking ebonics makes a whole generation seem ignorant and thuggish. No one takes anyone seriously when they look and act like that. There in lies the problem.

Absolutly and I agree, but to base a judgment souly on how the individual looks or dresses is a very close-minded way of viewing the world. At least sit down and have a quick conversation with them and then judge based off that short time. Give the person a chance outside of the way they look.

 

[Bob Maxey]

I think its about time to treat people as we would like to be treated, regardless of what clothing they wear, or what color skin or sexual orientation they are.



Absolutly and I agree, but to base a judgment souly on how the individual looks or dresses is a very close-minded way of viewing the world. At least sit down and have a quick conversation with them and then judge based off that short time. Give the person a chance outside of the way they look.

Sorry, I disagree. We have had, for far too long, this attitude that we must accept everyone equally. In my view, this is a problem and it is why so many young people dress like bums and act like fools. They will be accepted so why bother to change.

Why not decency and common sense for a change? If you look like a bum, you should be treated as such.

When these kids grow up and get out there in the real world where appearance does indeed make a difference, they will wonder why they are ignored or why they cannot find a good job.

I say we stop accepting mediocrity and this crazy dress and decide that we have some standards that everyone must adhere to or be rejected out of hand.

Bob Maxey

 

[redraptor]

Sorry, I disagree. We have had, for far too long, this attitude that we must accept everyone equally. In my view, this is a problem and it is why so many young people dress like bums and act like fools. They will be accepted so why bother to change.

Why not decency and common sense for a change? If you look like a bum, you should be treated as such.

When these kids grow up and get out there in the real world where appearance does indeed make a difference, they will wonder why they are ignored or why they cannot find a good job.

I say we stop accepting mediocrity and this crazy dress and decide that we have some standards that everyone must adhere to or be rejected out of hand.

Bob Maxey

But also if we accept a standard we will be stuck in the stone age, we wouldnt move foward in life if people didnt "test the limits"(If you will). And I understand dressing for the appropiate sitsuation such as a job interview or business meeting. But to restrict what people can and can not wear (Within reason of couse) while out in a casual place such as walmart or to a bar, seems incredibly controling. And personally I do not care to be in a society that feels it must decide what is the correct attire for just bumming about.

Again, I shall use myself as an example. I have a decent job at PetSmart (Yeah, not glamorous but thats not where I intend to be the rest of my life, just a simple part-time job) making a decent amount of money. I obviously have a dress code while on the job and I respect that so I can keep a professional look while at the store. Im incredibly friendly and talk in a professional but casual manner. Once out of the store I switch into my tattered ripped jeans, throw on a tank top and head out to my friend's house. May I also reelaborate that my hair is down to my shoulders and somewhat in my face. My managers do not mind and I dont plan to cut it until I am ready or my managers feel it is a problem.

Once there I talk about typical guy things (Xbox, beer, boobs ect.) in my own casual voice. That voice usually consists of slangs and "bro's" and "dudes" and what not. Now obviously I dont talk about those things to someone Im just meeting, I give a very happy, and nice response and once I feel comfortable, Ill open up like I do with buds. But if its simply meeting someone out on the street or in walmart or any other "non-professional" venue, there is no way im going to change out of my ripped, possibly sagging jeans. And I dont believe anyone else should either.

 

[tylerdurdin]

I'm younger and I will tell you that whole culture of sagging pants and speaking ebonics makes a whole generation seem ignorant and thuggish. No one takes anyone seriously when they look and act like that. There in lies the problem.

Unfortunately this is true. I live in New York, generally sagging is accompanied by. ..dat lingo dat a foo can't follow cause he not down and he can't follow cause he ain't from dat street were dudes be gettin shot at.
It is not fair to say that every one with sagging pants is trouble but in New York if you see this guy following you, I will see your ability to give someone the benefit of the doubt go right out the window.

 

[Roze]

But also if we accept a standard we will be stuck in the stone age, we wouldnt move foward in life if people didnt "test the limits"(If you will). And I understand dressing for the appropiate sitsuation such as a job interview or business meeting. But to restrict what people can and can not wear (Within reason of couse) while out in a casual place such as walmart or to a bar, seems incredibly controling. And personally I do not care to be in a society that feels it must decide what is the correct attire for just bumming about.

There are quite a number of places/venues that require you to dress appropriately. Nice/high end restaurants require that you don't wear jeans. Clubs that don't allow runners (sometimes no jeans).

So if it's not work, and it's just going out then you still dress (very) casually and refuse to 'dress up'? Like meeting your girl's parents?

Maybe I'm old school, but I was raised with the mentality that whoever I meet, I want to look my best. It shows I respect them by putting in that effort in making myself presentable.

 

[dan330]

But also if we accept a standard we will be stuck in the stone age, we wouldnt move foward in life if people didnt "test the limits"(If you will). And I understand dressing for the appropiate sitsuation such as a job interview or business meeting. But to restrict what people can and can not wear (Within reason of couse) while out in a casual place such as walmart or to a bar, seems incredibly controling. And personally I do not care to be in a society that feels it must decide what is the correct attire for just bumming about.

what i highlighted is the best part of your post.

question.. sagging has to have a limit to "within reason".
is it within reason.. if it hangs down to below your ass? when it is so low.. you can not walk or run without hindrance and tripping.

ripped jeans; tank tops; tshirts; long hair... not the same thing.

 

[redraptor]

There are quite a number of places/venues that require you to dress appropriately. Nice/high end restaurants require that you don't wear jeans. Clubs that don't allow runners (sometimes no jeans).

So if it's not work, and it's just going out then you still dress (very) casually and refuse to 'dress up'? Like meeting your girl's parents?

Maybe I'm old school, but I was raised with the mentality that whoever I meet, I want to look my best. It shows I respect them by putting in that effort in making myself presentable.

No I absolutely agree. And that's where I believe certain sitsuations require a certain level of dress. Bit to be simply walking down the streets wearing what I personally feel comfortable and being judged...well that I don't agree with.

I also believe that I should be allowed to wear whatever I want in church...but that's a different issue.

 

[redraptor]

what i highlighted is the best part of your post.

question.. sagging has to have a limit to "within reason".
is it within reason.. if it hangs down to below your ass? when it is so low.. you can not walk or run without hindrance and tripping.

ripped jeans; tank tops; tshirts; long hair... not the same thing.

But were those things within reason 60 years ago? My guess is no. Times change, as do people and trends. This one might stay with us and become the new "standard" or it might fade. Either way is it right to simply say "he is a hoodlum and a bum...lets treat him that way" because of the way he dresses? I don't believe so. Once again...sit down and have a conversation with the person...then make a judgment on how their character is based on that conversation...not by what he wears.

 

[Justintoxicated]

Maybe he just lost a bunch of weight, yesh! but as Denis Leary would say, PULL UP YOUR PANTS! (4:00)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DpKdOZuB66o&feature=related

 

[dan330]

50 yrs ago.. porn was not as accessible for everyone including children. I say that is bad.. and we should work keep it safely away from the impressionable young. Just because it is everywhere ...does not make it right.

50 yrs from now.. it might be in fashion to cut out the clothing around our private parts and show it all off.

I think as thinking adults with common sense.. we can make snap decisions on what .. is and is not within reason!