Photon lcd screen.... Pentile or not?

[jroc]

So are you saying the Epics display is like a pentile or its not a pentile and it has the 6 or more sub pixels?

We put a bunch of phones next to each other here at work awhile ago (Hero, iPhone, Evo, Epic, Moment, BB) and I thought the Epic was by far the brightest, clearest screen out of the bunch. Blew the Evo away in my eyes.

Thats amazing, since the Epic has a Pentile screen and the iPhone 4 should be considered the sharpest. Was it an iPhone 4?

Perfect example of how the anti Pentile movement is being blown outta proportion. See it for yourselves. Make your own decisions. Yea be informed by learning about it, but dont judge it until you see it for yourself.

I honestly feel that it wont bother most ppl, just folks that like to adjust their HDTV's for the best colors, contrast, sharpness, etc. Ever wonder how many ppl dont change the settings of their HDTV's? Or use settings that could be seen as over saturated? Too bright? Too dark?

Some might think my HDTV's are too bright, but thats what I like. And I have no problems looking at SD channels. I record stuff with my DVR on SD channels whenever I can. The space issues is more important than how sharp or clear the picture is. Pentile will be a personal preference, just like it was last year with the Galaxy S 1 line, the Incredible, and any other phone that used Pentile last year.

 

[drexappeal]

Thats amazing, since the Epic has a Pentile screen and the iPhone 4 should be considered the sharpest. Was it an iPhone 4?

Perfect example of how the anti Pentile movement is being blown outta proportion. See it for yourselves. Make your own decisions. Yea be informed by learning about it, but dont judge it until you see it for yourself.

I honestly feel that it wont bother most ppl, just folks that like to adjust their HDTV's for the best colors, contrast, sharpness, etc. Ever wonder how many ppl dont change the settings of their HDTV's? Or use settings that could be seen as over saturated? Too bright? Too dark?

Some might think my HDTV's are too bright, but thats what I like. And I have no problems looking at SD channels. I record stuff with my DVR on SD channels whenever I can. The space issues is more important than how sharp or clear the picture is. Pentile will be a personal preference, just like it was last year with the Galaxy S 1 line, the Incredible, and any other phone that used Pentile last year.

Finally someone that actually makes a logical point about all the complaints on screens.

For me, the reason the pentile vs. other screen type debate is a moot point is simply due to the fact that I'm not going to be staring at the phone for long periods of time EVER, to notice that it's less bright or less clear or less sharp than other phones. My primary concern is, does it look bright, clear, and sharp to me...AND...can I see the screen during the daylight? Now, on occasion, if I wanted to watch something on the phone while on a long trip somewhere...that's a bonus, but it's not a priority.

Only reason I can see people have a logical complaint about the pentile screen are those that actually spend half their day watching videos, and/or playing games on their phone.

 

[jroc]

^lol...Thanks. I was just expanding on what you were saying and what rico said:

To be honest, 95% of people out there wouldn't even notice any difference.
But the one's like us who post here at the forums would.

I know for my HDTVs I hang out at avsforum.com. I dont think most in the general public even knows that site exists.

 

[drexappeal]

^lol...Thanks. I was just expanding on what rico said tho:

Exactly. It also confirms why I personally have felt the pentile vs. other screen comparison is not as "relevant" as some of the reviews have been.

Some people that may search for information online, but not necessarily post on forums, might read information on the forums thinking pentile has to be avoided based on some people's posts about it. And to the everyday average consumer, it won't be a factor.

 

[amimemeami]

^lol...Thanks. I was just expanding on what you were saying and what rico said:



I know for my HDTVs I hang out at avsforum.com. I dont think most in the general public even knows that site exists.

I love that site, but you do not know how much better the picture is till you see it, and more than that, there is a lot of personal preference involved. Even on the avsforum forum there are lots of different setups for the "optimal" picture.

I am still on the fence on whether or not to wait for the SG2, I am swapping my wife over from her iPhone 3Gs to Sprint, so she will have to decided between the EVO and the Photon, and then it will be a bit before I have the funds to upgrade me. Stupid ATT is charging $300 to break the contract , but we just got her iPhone replaced for free cause the rocker switch fell off for no reason. Hopefully we can sell it + the $125 for switching over from ATT, and she has a 3G I am fixing a cracked screen on and selling. By the time all that gets taken care of, if there is no announcement for the SG2, I will get the photon and be happy with it, but hope the SG2 comes out within 30 days . The benchmarks, the SAMOLED screen, the shininess, Oh, if I only lived in Canada... I will be really sad if Sprint's version does not have the Exynos or a front facing camera. My wife wants both of are phones to have one, so we can video chat.

 

[EarlyMon]

Some people were sensitive to text jagginess on the earlier pentile displays, and that's not unreasonable because pentile kinda rearranges where the actual pixel boundaries might fall when displaying some info.

That said - last year in the Evo forum I posted a side-by-side blind comparison of pentile vs. rgb - only one person caught that I'd rigged the test and that both pictures were the same pentile display.

As resolution increases, in this case to qHD, that perceived jagginess on text gets sharply reduced from its 800x480 case and many that objected to lower-resolution pentile are ok with it in qHD.

Originally introduced as a measure to deal with the nasties involved in OLED color management, the only thing we haven't figured out is why Motorola went that route with LCD when that tech doesn't have OLED's problems.

Bottom line - only results count, trust your own eyes, everyone sees things a bit differently.

 

[drexappeal]

Some people were sensitive to text jagginess on the earlier pentile displays, and that's not unreasonable because pentile kinda rearranges where the actual pixel boundaries might fall when displaying some info.

That said - last year in the Evo forum I posted a side-by-side blind comparison of pentile vs. rgb - only one person caught that I'd rigged the test and that both pictures were the same pentile display.

As resolution increases, in this case to qHD, that perceived jagginess on text gets sharply reduced from its 800x480 case and many that objected to lower-resolution pentile are ok with it in qHD.

Originally introduced as a measure to deal with the nasties involved in OLED color management, the only thing we haven't figured out is why Motorola went that route with LCD when that tech doesn't have OLED's problems.

Bottom line - only results count, trust your own eyes, everyone sees things a bit differently.

And to put it in layman's terms for peeps that read the forums, but don't post:

Go with what is most comfortable to your eyes. If you don't notice a difference, it's not a factor.

 

[EarlyMon]

^If you don't notice a difference or notice a difference but it's not enough to care about, it's not a factor.

 

[Cavemansol]

^If you don't a difference or notice a difference but it's not enough to care about, it's not a factor.

...Grammar? Or am i just dumb?

Ha, sorry to be a bitch..

 

[EarlyMon]

Calling a mod out on a grammar mistake? What could possibly go wrong?

Srsly, tho, thanks for the catch, I'm doing 8 things at once.

 

[Roze]

Quite honestly, I went into best buy to take a look at the atrix in comparison to my evo 4g screen and i couldn't really tell the difference. It was clear enough a display for my needs, but could someone explain why it's such a deal breaker for many people? In real world, layman terms, how would the entile screen be "bad" in comparison to other types of displays? TIA

Some people were sensitive to text jagginess on the earlier pentile displays, and that's not unreasonable because pentile kinda rearranges where the actual pixel boundaries might fall when displaying some info.

As resolution increases, in this case to qHD, that perceived jagginess on text gets sharply reduced from its 800x480 case and many that objected to lower-resolution pentile are ok with it in qHD.

If the screen of the Photon is anything like the Atrix, than I will say it's NOT that bad. If you spend hours reading news/blogs on the phone, you'll eventually start to see the screen door effect of the pentile matrix. I didn't notice it at first but I always felt that the screen was a bit 'off' and I realized that I'm starting to see the pixelation of white on a colour caused by the pentile matrix.

I compared the Atrix qHD pentile Matrix to the Nexus One AMOLED pentile Matrix and the N1's pentile Matrix is much worst. I felt the 'jaggedness' was twice as big. I think it's due to the higher screen resoultion of the qHD that it's not so bad, as mentioned by EM.

For those that never experienced Pentile Matrix, if you can see the pixelation on your computer screen...you can see it on the Atrix's screen. If you can't, then the screen would be 'perfect' to you

For most of us on the forum, we know that a pentile matrix is used in a phone but we can ignore it 95% of the time.

Then there's the rare ones that have sensitive eyes and simply can't stand the pentile matrix *looks at Novoxx*

Originally introduced as a measure to deal with the nasties involved in OLED color management, the only thing we haven't figured out is why Motorola went that route with LCD when that tech doesn't have OLED's problems.

I really HATE motorola for cheaping out and going with the Pentile Matrix scheme *sigh* I swore I didn't have to deal with it when I got an LCD screen phone....

 

[Cavemansol]

Calling a mod out on a grammar mistake? What could possibly go wrong?

Srsly, tho, thanks for the catch, I'm doing 8 things at once.

Haha, im expecting your full wrath...im going on 28 hours awake straight, starting to be a bit of a smart ass

 

[drexappeal]

Calling a mod out on a grammar mistake? What could possibly go wrong?

Srsly, tho, thanks for the catch, I'm doing 8 things at once.

I'd almost be willing to bet that majority of general consumers won't really notice that screen door effect, unless someone went out of their way to point it out.

 

[EarlyMon]

I'd almost be willing to bet that majority of general consumers won't really notice that screen door effect, unless someone went out of their way to point it out.

Yep.

You and I agree - when it comes a display, choose what works for you first and foremost. Huge numbers of people are way happy with the pentile approach (Atrix, others) and in my mind, that tells you the story right there.

You know me - color first, resolution last.

Some day they'll make the perfect phone and then where will we be? Discussing our programmable washing machines or something, that's where.

Meanwhile, this is Android where choice is good and so far, this little beasty is sounding like a great choice. I can't wait to hear more user reviews!

 

[novox77]

I'd almost be willing to bet that majority of general consumers won't really notice that screen door effect, unless someone went out of their way to point it out.

I absolutely agree that most people won't pick up on it, but some minority of people out there have a discerning eye, and they don't have to be tech savvy to notice the PenTile array. They might not know what PenTile is, or what a subpixel is, but for sure they would "pass" Earlymon's blind test between PenTile and PenTile, or square vs. PenTile. For me, it's night and day; furthermore, it really bothers my eyes (especially the white text on black; it feels like the edges are vibrating), and therefore, the issue becomes much more important to me.

The point here is, don't start hating PenTile just because a bunch of people on the Interwebs complain about it. Go look for yourself and decide for yourself. Clearly not everyone is bothered by it. Friend of mine has an Epic, and I've tried showing him, explaining to him, and he just can't tell the difference. There's no guarantee that we all see things the same way. Frankly, he thinks I'm nit picking over something so minuscule that it's not worth his time looking for the difference.

 

[drexappeal]

I absolutely agree that most people won't pick up on it, but some minority of people out there have a discerning eye, and they don't have to be tech savvy to notice the PenTile array. They might not know what PenTile is, or what a subpixel is, but for sure they would "pass" Earlymon's blind test between PenTile and PenTile, or square vs. PenTile. For me, it's night and day; furthermore, it really bothers my eyes (especially the white text on black; it feels like the edges are vibrating), and therefore, the issue becomes much more important to me.

The point here is, don't start hating PenTile just because a bunch of people on the Interwebs complain about it. Go look for yourself and decide for yourself. Clearly not everyone is bothered by it. Friend of mine has an Epic, and I've tried showing him, explaining to him, and he just can't tell the difference. There's no guarantee that we all see things the same way. Frankly, he thinks I'm nit picking over something so minuscule that it's not worth his time looking for the difference.

Definitely understand that novox. It's much like my being uncomfortable with the 3DEVO.

And yes, you're completely correct about the mis-placed hate on Pentile, much like I advised people to test out the 3DEVO in person, so they know for themselves.

 

[Roze]

Frankly, he thinks I'm nit picking over something so minuscule that it's not worth his time looking for the difference.

:< My tech colleagues/friends think I'm TOO nicky picky when I pointed out how bad the Pentile Matrix makes all of the words displayed all pixelie.

And yes, you're completely correct about the mis-placed hate on Pentile, much like I advised people to test out the 3DEVO in person, so they know for themselves.

Reviews and what not are great but at the end of the day, it's about your personal experience with the phone (or anything) in question.

 

[jamor]

Yep.

You and I agree - when it comes a display, choose what works for you first and foremost. Huge numbers of people are way happy with the pentile approach (Atrix, others) and in my mind, that tells you the story right there.

You know me - color first, resolution last.

This isn't entirely accurate so I must correct this.

Resolution is just as important as color.

In addition, I would strongly caution a pentile display. Most people that have the absolutely hate them.

You can see all of the little dots on the screen it's HORRIBLE!

 

[drexappeal]

This isn't entirely accurate so I must correct this.

Resolution is just as important as color.

In addition, I would strongly caution a pentile display. Most people that have the absolutely hate them.

You can see all of the little dots on the screen it's HORRIBLE!

Most people on the forums or most people in general? If you mean in general, you must know a whole lot of people across the country!...LOL.

 

[Godfather13]

This isn't entirely accurate so I must correct this.

Resolution is just as important as color.

In addition, I would strongly caution a pentile display. Most people that have the absolutely hate them.

You can see all of the little dots on the screen it's HORRIBLE!

First off, define "most people." You mean youve done a survey of almost every pentile display phone owner and come to that conclusion or are you just referring to the 1%-ers like us who post on this forum?

I for one dont find anything wrong with the pentiles Ive looked at. But then again, my buddy swears his 1080p is much clearer then my 1080i, but I dont see the diff there either.

Not trying to be a smart @$$, feel free to give you opinion, but to make a post about correcting someone elses post and then throw in a completely fictional statement is crazy.

 

[Godfather13]

Most people on the forums or most people in general? If you mean in general, you must know a whole lot of people across the country!...LOL.

Damn drex you beat me to it. I was too busy typing!

 

[drexappeal]

Damn drex you beat me to it. I was too busy typing!

LOL...Wasn't tryin' to be a dick or anything, but general statements like that have to be takin' with a grain of salt no matter what it's about.

 

[busted bones]

Some people were sensitive to text jagginess on the earlier pentile displays, and that's not unreasonable because pentile kinda rearranges where the actual pixel boundaries might fall when displaying some info.

That said - last year in the Evo forum I posted a side-by-side blind comparison of pentile vs. rgb - only one person caught that I'd rigged the test and that both pictures were the same pentile display.

As resolution increases, in this case to qHD, that perceived jagginess on text gets sharply reduced from its 800x480 case and many that objected to lower-resolution pentile are ok with it in qHD.

Originally introduced as a measure to deal with the nasties involved in OLED color management, the only thing we haven't figured out is why Motorola went that route with LCD when that tech doesn't have OLED's problems.

Bottom line - only results count, trust your own eyes, everyone sees things a bit differently.

Pentiles do use less energy than a standard RGB pattern will so it may be a way of getting better battery life out of the phones as that is a major complaint. Also readability in day light is something that is important to most people so it may have been used as a way to address that issue as well.

 

[busted bones]

First off, define "most people." You mean youve done a survey of almost every pentile display phone owner and come to that conclusion or are you just referring to the 1%-ers like us who post on this forum?

I for one dont find anything wrong with the pentiles Ive looked at. But then again, my buddy swears his 1080p is much clearer then my 1080i, but I dont see the diff there either.

Not trying to be a smart @$$, feel free to give you opinion, but to make a post about correcting someone elses post and then throw in a completely fictional statement is crazy.

The only time Ive ever noticed an issue on 1080i was a scene in a movie with a lot of explosions and colors and for a quick blip the timing between the refresh rates and the movies frame rate and everything was off.

 

[busted bones]

LOL...Wasn't tryin' to be a dick or anything, but general statements like that have to be takin' with a grain of salt no matter what it's about.

Do statements like that need to be taken with a grain of salt since its a general statement? Im just giving you a hard time.