Help Android tablet access denied to SD card when using third party file manager

[yoramdavid]

Hi all,

I have a Samsung Galaxy 8 Note (GT-N5110).
I can use the pre-installed file manager to create, delete or move files on the SD card, but when I use a third party software I cannot do anything. It gives me a access denied error.
This third party software works fine on the internal memory.

What can be done to solve this? I searched on the options of this third party software and there are several options in the "Root access" tab such as:
1. Disabled (Root folder is not shown)
2. Normal (Showing root folder normal way, works on all devices)
3. Superuser (Access using superuser, works on rooted devices)
4. Superuser + mount writable (Superuser mode, which allows changes in read-only folders)

Now, I do not think this root folder has to do anything with my problem.
And I do see a root folder on the device when using options 2, 3 or 4. but I cannot browse it.

I do not think it is a rooted device.

Thank you for any help.

David.

 

[Mikestony]

Hello!
Do you have access to a computer to plug the device into, then access the sd card contents?
And if you don't think it's rooted, then it probably is not (assuming you have owned it since new).
What 3rd party software do you speak of? Another file browsing app or something?

 

[yoramdavid]

Hello and thank you for your help.
I have a laptop but I do not have a cable to plug the de device to it.
The only way I can browse my files is using wi-fi file transfer.
Yes, I own the device since new.
The third party software is X-plore, another file browsing application indeed.

 

[Mikestony]

Hmm, are you positive you are accessing the sd card? I mean, following the correct path?
Such as /storage/external_SD and not /storage/emulated/0 or /storage/emulated/legacy?
I'm not familiar with that app, x-plorer, sorry but nevertheless, it should read the contents of your sd card.
What android version is your device on?

 

[yoramdavid]

Hi, sorry I mis-worte the name of the app, I just corrected it, it is called X.plore.
Inthe built-in file browser there are only two paths I can go to:
1. Device storage (emulated/0/)
2. SD memory card (extSDcard)
In X-plore there is some others (something called KitKat Sandbox and /root)
But yes, I am sure I am browsing the Storage/extSDcard and it reads the content, but I cannot delete or paste or create any files or folders there.

In emulated/0/ , I can write to the folders in there. Well, I have only tried it in the /download folder which is where I need to delete or move stuff.

 

[Mikestony]

Ah, cool, Xplore?
Nice app! I tried it a bit but couldn't get used to it.
Anyhow, perhaps I'll download it again to see if I can replicate your issue (albeit a different device...)

 

[scary alien]

Sorry to pop-in unannounced , but I'm wondering if you're experiencing the fairly recent lock-down of the external storage areas (files/folders/directories) to only the applications that created them...

This was done in Jelly Bean Kit Kat I believe and was a security enhancement...

I thought that I've recently read that this is or will be loosened-up a bit in future versions of Android [edit: 5.x], but I'm thinking this is what you might be currently experiencing.

[edit: see http://hardware.slashdot.org/story/14/11/05/1348221/android-50-makes-sd-cards-great-again]

A folder like "Downloads" might be generic / not necessarily owned by a particular app, so that might be why you can access/modify files in there...

Not 100% sure, though...@Mike, does this ring a bell with you?

 

[Mikestony]

Sorry to pop-in unannounced , but I'm wondering if you're experiencing the fairly recent lock-down of the external storage areas (files/folders/directories) to only the applications that created them...

This was done in Jelly Bean Kit Kat I believe and was a security enhancement...

I thought that I've recently read that this is or will be loosened-up a bit in future versions of Android [edit: 5.x], but I'm thinking this is what you might be currently experiencing.

[edit: see http://hardware.slashdot.org/story/14/11/05/1348221/android-50-makes-sd-cards-great-again]

A folder like "Downloads" might be generic / not necessarily owned by a particular app, so that might be why you can access/modify files in there...

Not 100% sure, though...@Mike, does this ring a bell with you?

Oh, the more help, the merrier Scary!
Yes I recall that, but perhaps I may have been incorrectly assuming what files the OP was trying to move/delete etc?

I wonder if the OP can delete say, a picture that is on the sd, or some other file put there by him before.

 

[yoramdavid]

Yes, that is the one.
I like Xplore, it has dual pane view, unfortunately... I have this issue.
Which app do you use to browse your files if you use any third one app?
And sorry I did not answer your above question: my android vesion is 4.4.2

Hi scary alien,
oh, you are very welcome to step in unannounced !
I however did not understand what you said.
Something about ownership of the folders?
I tried to create a new folder on the root of the SD card, no success.

I created and then deleted folders on other locations under emulated/0/ including the root of it and it worked.
It is just that SDcard...

 

[Mikestony]

I cannot replicate your issue, sorry. Even though I am on also on 4.4.2 and running the stock rom, I am rooted and have bypassed the KitKat restriction to write to the SD card.

I do see the option for deletion when I select a file and I would assume that is what you do not see?:

Spoiler: Click for Screenshot

I use Root Explorer but doubt it would change your issue.

As far as what Scary states about the "ownership of folders" that apps create, perhaps he can explain better than I can.
I'm just a lowly user of his Applications

 

[yoramdavid]

I am not familiar with the terms KitKat (other than the chocolate ) and stock rom, I will google it but now the internet is so slow... in fact if I stop responding, it is because it dropped.

I do see all the options to "delete", "move", "copy", "create folder".
I select a file of folder, those buttons lighten up, I click on them... one second later I get the error "Error, some files could not be deleted".

Those folders were created with the pre-installed file browser, but I tried to create new one on the root of the SDcard without success.

 

[scary alien]

Android version 4.4.x had a code name of "KitKat", so that's what we're referring to .

This page explains it (the SD card permission issue) pretty well: http://www.androidcentral.com/kitkat-sdcard-changes?pg=2#content

It's simple, really. Prior to Android 4.4 KitKat, applications — provided they had permission to access the SD card — could read and write to any area on removable storage, including the system folders like DCIM, Alarms, etc. That has all changed, and now third-party applications — as in ones you download from Google Play or elsewhere — can only write to files and folders that they have created or have taken ownership of.

 

[Mikestony]

Hmm, well, I suppose if the pre-installed file browser can do what you want to the External Sd card, you should be set.
But still begs to question, why Xplore cannot.

 

[yoramdavid]

Oh, I see what KitKat is. Easy
It says that the third party applications can only write to files and folders they have created or have taken ownership of.
But I cannot create any folder on the SDcard with the X-plore app.

Mikestony,
The pre-installed file browser allows me to do all this indeed but it is very not userfriendly to use.
And X-plore is. That is why I wanted to stop using the pre-installed to use the X-plore.
So... there is nothing I can do? How do I take ownership of the folders, is that a solution?

 

[FishenFool]

If your tablet was rooted you should be able to do what you want to with the third party app.

 

[yoramdavid]

I understand, but doing so I would loose the garantee and be more at risk of malware, right?

 

[Risto Ranta]

This is stupid !!
I do really need acces to my SD card

The file system of Android is a total mess.
It should work so, that there is a home partition with all permissions for the user and a link to the sd card with all rwx rights for the user.
The system folders should be invisible until you give command sudo or su with a password. After that you should have larger permission. There could still be one level, 'root' which gives you access to change the system settings.

All installation should ask for the password

Another thing is the upgrades. They should happend in smaller pieces. Not a giant leap from 4.4 to 5.0, because for example Samsung never delivers new versions of the system. Samsung has packed hundreds of useless programs to the packet with no way to get rid of them. Now, if the system could be upgraded in pieces we could get the next version of Android even if Samsung doesnt have a new OEM version of the system.

Go and compare Android to Linux, where these things do work. Or even M$windows, where the system can be installed in any standard PC and the drivers can be downloaded from the net.

 

[Telyx]

If you are rooted, there are apps available in the Play Store (and an XPosed module, if you have the XPosed framework installed) that fix that SD card restriction and give 3rd party apps full access to the SD card.

 

[Slug]

I do really need acces to my SD card

You still have access to the card, the restriction only applies to write access.

The file system of Android is a total mess.

The Android file system is designed for small mobile devices with limited (compared to desktop computers) resources and storage.

Another thing is the upgrades. They should happend in smaller pieces. Not a giant leap from 4.4 to 5.0, because for example Samsung never delivers new versions of the system.

There was no "giant leap". The final public release of Android 4.x was actually 4.4.4, with the first public release of v5.x being 5.0.1.

Btw, Samsung have updated the Galaxy S4, now over two years old, to Android 5.x. My old Galaxy S2 received several updates from its released 2.3.5 up until 4.1.2, again well into its third year.

Samsung has packed hundreds of useless programs to the packet with no way to get rid of them.

That's a Samsung issue and by no means universal. Other choices of manufacturer are available.

Now, if the system could be upgraded in pieces we could get the next version of Android even if Samsung doesnt have a new OEM version of the system.

You can have that right now, courtesy of the Nexus range. Pure unadulterated Android, updated whenever a new build is available.

Go and compare Android to Linux, where these things do work. Or even M$windows, where the system can be installed in any standard PC and the drivers can be downloaded from the net.

Comparing a full-blown desktop OS with a mobile OS is like comparing apples to fish.

 

[funkylogik]

So much this.
Also, Google are trying to make updates more "granular" by using Google play services and the play store

 

[Risto Ranta]

You still have access to the card, the restriction only applies to write access.

So your opinion is that everything is OK, when I can read, what there is in the card, even though I can not write there ?

The Android file system is designed for small mobile devices with limited (compared to desktop computers) resources and storage.

Yes, it is rather limited, if you want to keep it such. With a well designed file system it might be worth of a PC. And here comes the SD card. If the use of the card is limited because there is no slot in Nexus, you are totally on a wrong track.
Another thing is that tablet manufacturers insert the best processors and cameras, largest RAM memories and largest FLASH to the top large models and leave the users of 'small mobile devices' to starve. And there is large population of flying mobile users, (like me) who are asking for 7" devices, which fit in their pockets and bags. They are ready to spend money, if only there was small models with high end features.

Nobody seems to have given a tought to profile the use of the devices. IMHO the small devices are for travelers (mobile) and the large oones for the home dwellers to read the newspapers and see videos. In home you do not need GPS, large FLASH nor good camera. The size and weight are not so important. The signal comes from the wall and the charge point is always near.
Even the price is not so important: you need good, you pay it !

There was no "giant leap". The final public release of Android 4.x was acat evertually 4.4.4, with the first public release of v5.x being 5.0.1.

Not exactly giant leap. rather a small step for the humankind. But still big step, when you measure it bytes, which have to be changed in your tablet.
Building new versions have always meant a bunch of new bugs and new behaviour. Look at Win8, which makes most peoples itch.

Btw, Samsung have updated the Galaxy S4, now over two years old, to Android 5.x. My old Galaxy S2 received several updates from its released 2.3.5 up until 4.1.2, again well into its third year.

Good for you. I might be still waiting an update to my GT2, if I didn't move to Cyanogenmod. in My GT3 I'm going to use 4.4 for a month more and then start seriously thinking about CGM.

That's a Samsung issue and by no means universal. Other choices of manufacturer are available.

It IS universal, because there is hundreds of Chinese tablets with Android, which can not be updated to anyting, because of some minor bit somewhere telling the system that this iron is not original Nexus.
Compare this to PC. It was back eighties, when the incompatible models dropped from the market and only standard iron was sold.
Now we have standard iron and M$ hegemony.

You can have that right now, courtesy of the Nexus range. Pure unadulterated Android, updated whenever a new build is available.

Gee, go and buy Nexus, buy Nexus, buy Nexus, BUY NEXUS !
But still, there is no place for SD in Nexus and the cloud does not work everywhere. Not in aeroplanes, not out in the sea or in the wild side. It does not even work, when I go to foreign country, because the roaming prices are discusting.
And still I need my data. I need maps. A lot of them, and they are large. And I need to be able to handle my photos and GIS. I'm not interested in games, music nor videos, but if I were, I'd need still more space, more SD cards to change when needed.
Show me a 7" Nexus with 256GB of FLASH like my Linux laptop and we start speaking business. Or even a tablet with an USB-A to mount an external hard disk or slot for a mSATA card.

Comparing a full-blown desktop OS with a mobile OS is like comparing apples to fish.

You mean that Android is in its infancy and they sell us fishy crap ?

 

[Risto Ranta]

I understand, but doing so I would loose the garantee and be more at risk of malware, right?

So they keep telling us. Do this and you loose your keys to kingdom.
If rooting is the way to follow, then why it is not made a standard feature ?

 

[funkylogik]

Bit of a tangent but in the European Union, rooting can only legally void the warranty if it can be proven that rooting or something enabled by rooting caused the fault.
Maybe worth checking up on North American law too
And if it was a standard feature can you imagine the amount of phones returned for repair because that "safety" filter is removed and any idiot can completely mess up the system.
Having said that, I guess the same applies to desktop computers (or are they even warrantied for software damage? I'm a pc idiot so honestly don't know)

 

[Slug]

So your opinion is that everything is OK, when I can read, what there is in the card, even though I can not write there ?

You CAN write, if the app is written to use the permissions correctly. There's a good discussion of the issue here.

With a well designed file system it might be worth of a PC

But it's not a PC. is it? Or even designed to compete with a PC? If you want that then buy a laptop running a desktop OS.

Another thing is that tablet manufacturers insert the best processors and cameras, largest RAM memories and largest FLASH to the top large models and leave the users of 'small mobile devices' to starve.

Not quite sure where this fits in to your original complaint, but that's no longer true when Sony (for example) equip a 4.5" "Compact" with the exact same hardware as the flagship 5.1" model.

if only there was small models with high end features.

Samsung Galaxy Note 8.4, Sony Tablet Z4 Compact spring to mind.

Good for you.

It wasn't a boast, it was a real-life example.

It IS universal, because there is hundreds of Chinese tablets with Android, which can not be updated to anyting, because of some minor bit somewhere telling the system that this iron is not original Nexus.

No, it's because the vast majority of Chinese tablets aren't supported by their manufacturer. All they have to do is download the source from Google's github and compile it to suit their particular choice of cheap hardware.

Gee, go and buy Nexus, buy Nexus, buy Nexus, BUY NEXUS !

You asked for a solution and I provided one. That's all. Take it or leave it.

Show me a 7" Nexus with 256GB of FLASH like my Linux laptop and we start speaking business. Or even a tablet with an USB-A to mount an external hard disk or slot for a mSATA card.

Can't help with the 256GB of storage as I don't think such a beast exists, but there are certainly tablets out there that support USB Host Mode and allow connection of external drives.

You mean that Android is in its infancy and they sell us fishy crap?

Annnnnnnnnnnnnnnd I'm done here. Good luck with your search - I hope you eventually find something that meets your high expectations.

 

[Risto Ranta]

Annnnnnnnnnnnnnnd I'm done here. Good luck with your search - I hope you eventually find something that meets your high expectations.

Bye !
I'm not trying to find anything. I'm just wondering, why Google shoots to his/her leg.
And trying to find a way to make my tablets work as they should.

And yes, I have high expectations. I'm expecting the computer does what I'm asking it to do.
I have built computers from bare chips. Written operating systems for them and used them. Built and used touch screens with GUI before anybody even had a mouse. I know what can be done and what should not be done.

I'm waiting for a computer and system, which are built with _The_User_ in mind and not the marketing department.