CuBz
Android Expert
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Apple is screwed... lol
- Thread starter ryancalif
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CuBz
Android Expert
I remember when the Iphone 3G came out, I actually took a half day off of work and stood in line for almost 4.5 hours (got there at 6:00am), at the local Apple store. I was the 4th or 5th person in line.
Looking back on it I don't know why I was compelled to do that. Would never do that again, for any phone...
That's amazing! You recovered from iPhonitus
Baldilocks
Android Expert
I also remember when the original iPhone came out. People complained that the screen was too big.............
tdperry
Well-Known Member
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Platform agnostic but very frustrated today...
Look guys, I understand the arguments that everyone is making for both sides of the coin. However, a little story for you...
I am a VERY tech savvy consumer, and a good portion of professional life is spent analyzing the smartphone industry and the different platforms, so I do have a pretty good basis for what I'm talking about. I've switched back and forth between Android and iOS over the years, always choosing which platform was best for me at the time. I'm now back on Android with the Galaxy S3 on Verizon. Why? Android allows background syncing and we use GOOD at work, which means all my email (roughly 150-200 per day) are always waiting for me vs the pull model on iOS for the same app that could take minutes to sync. Couldn't have been happier with the S3, until today that is...
Today I need to copy text from one email into another, but every time I tried, no matter which app I was in, that app would crash and I'd wind up back at the home screen. OK, I never panic with stuff like this and just assumed it was a glitch with Touchdown. However, I wanted to dot all my i's and cross all my t's before removing Touchdown so I searched these forums only to find that this is a widespread issue with the S3. Not only that, the issue first popped up in June and we're still without a fix from Samsung three months later. Finally I find a solution, either do a factory reset or root the phone. I've rooted in the past and would gladly do that, but can't now as GOOD won't function on a rooted device. Doing a factory reset is just a giant headache, even with the backup and syncing solutions available, and then would require me bothering my IT department for a new PIN for GOOD.
Needless to say, this is infuriating. Apple would never let a phone out into the wild with such an obvious software bug, and if they did, they'd issue a fix rapidly. Yes, I can hear the argument now...but it took Apple a whole product cycle to introduce copy/paste! Yes it did, but when they did it was perfect with no problems since. Yes, Apple is a money-printing machine, and too many of their customers are mindless drones, but that being said, I feel Samsung and too many Android manufacturers are just fine putting out problematic devices and either leaving consumers hanging until the next major software update (Jelly Bean in this case) or the next generation of device.
Guys, we might bemoan the stale state of iOS, the lack of NFC, strange decision regarding the screen, the abysmal software that is iTunes, a dock connector that will now force mass spending on replacements for accessories, or a decision not to go with a bigger battery for the sake of a millimeter of thickness, but now Samsung has driven this consumer to reconsider switching back to his iPhone 4s just to get the most simplistic and core functionality back. Is that good business? Does that inspire confidence in the future of the platform? Today, after being very happy for a month on the S3, I'm truly saddened by the state of the Android camp once again.
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The above was copied and pasted from this forum on Opera and reposted in the forum via Tapatalk. No crash, no burn. Worked just fine.
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Platform agnostic but very frustrated today...
Look guys, I understand the arguments that everyone is making for both sides of the coin. However, a little story for you...
I am a VERY tech savvy consumer, and a good portion of professional life is spent analyzing the smartphone industry and the different platforms, so I do have a pretty good basis for what I'm talking about. I've switched back and forth between Android and iOS over the years, always choosing which platform was best for me at the time. I'm now back on Android with the Galaxy S3 on Verizon. Why? Android allows background syncing and we use GOOD at work, which means all my email (roughly 150-200 per day) are always waiting for me vs the pull model on iOS for the same app that could take minutes to sync. Couldn't have been happier with the S3, until today that is...
Today I need to copy text from one email into another, but every time I tried, no matter which app I was in, that app would crash and I'd wind up back at the home screen. OK, I never panic with stuff like this and just assumed it was a glitch with Touchdown. However, I wanted to dot all my i's and cross all my t's before removing Touchdown so I searched these forums only to find that this is a widespread issue with the S3. Not only that, the issue first popped up in June and we're still without a fix from Samsung three months later. Finally I find a solution, either do a factory reset or root the phone. I've rooted in the past and would gladly do that, but can't now as GOOD won't function on a rooted device. Doing a factory reset is just a giant headache, even with the backup and syncing solutions available, and then would require me bothering my IT department for a new PIN for GOOD.
Needless to say, this is infuriating. Apple would never let a phone out into the wild with such an obvious software bug, and if they did, they'd issue a fix rapidly. Yes, I can hear the argument now...but it took Apple a whole product cycle to introduce copy/paste! Yes it did, but when they did it was perfect with no problems since. Yes, Apple is a money-printing machine, and too many of their customers are mindless drones, but that being said, I feel Samsung and too many Android manufacturers are just fine putting out problematic devices and either leaving consumers hanging until the next major software update (Jelly Bean in this case) or the next generation of device.
Guys, we might bemoan the stale state of iOS, the lack of NFC, strange decision regarding the screen, the abysmal software that is iTunes, a dock connector that will now force mass spending on replacements for accessories, or a decision not to go with a bigger battery for the sake of a millimeter of thickness, but now Samsung has driven this consumer to reconsider switching back to his iPhone 4s just to get the most simplistic and core functionality back. Is that good business? Does that inspire confidence in the future of the platform? Today, after being very happy for a month on the S3, I'm truly saddened by the state of the Android camp once again.
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The above was copied and pasted from this forum on Opera and reposted in the forum via Tapatalk. No crash, no burn. Worked just fine.
bearballz
Well-Known Member
That's amazing! You recovered from iPhonitus
Yes after 4 Iphones I finally saw the light.
Maybe I am unclear.
If someone has trouble, he deserves no less than our help, not derision.
Driving by someone with a flat tire saying, see, all of mine are fine, you're wrong - is kind of mean.
Post count means nothing
And for those on Tapatalk who can't see it and don't know me - I'm a mod.
And if this doesn't turn around, this thread will lock.
Thank you.
If someone has trouble, he deserves no less than our help, not derision.
Driving by someone with a flat tire saying, see, all of mine are fine, you're wrong - is kind of mean.
Post count means nothing
And for those on Tapatalk who can't see it and don't know me - I'm a mod.
And if this doesn't turn around, this thread will lock.
Thank you.
I hate to admit it...but he's right. Truth is when I had the iPhone 4 had this been offered up next instead of the incremental upgrade of the 4s then it would have been enough to keep me.
I would have never tried android for 30 days and fallen in love with it.
I was an iPhone jailbreaker that enjoyed tweaking and personalizing the phone.
Android lets me do all of that without even needing to root.
I simply wanted a slightly bigger screen...considering that I had an iPad and had commitment to the ecosystem it was a TOUGH decision despite my initial disappointment with the 4s to still decide to try android. I tried to talk myself in to accepting Siri as awesome enough a reason to get the 4s.
I'm glad I tried the SGS2....I have no intentions of going back. I love my SGS3 and I look forward to the SGS4 or whatever else might be available then.
Truth is the iPhone 5 will sell a $hit ton of phones (competition is good).
I'll stick with the open nature of android and they can have their boring walled garden.
GeorgeinLA
Well-Known Member
I like Android and really don't want to go over to Apple. I haven't bought an Apple product in like six or seven years, and I love my Droid 2. Let me preface by saying that having used both platforms, I do think that Android is better than iOS. Widgets alone should settle the issue, but it goes on from there. I do think that Google is giving a lot of business away to Apple unnecessarily though, and I don't know exactly why. Here are my issues with Android:
1. Google should be forcing the updates through the system much more. One thing that I know if I buy an iPhone is that I can have the latest version of the OS on it. You can buy a brand-new top of the line Android right now, and it won't have the latest software on it, and you have no guarantee that it ever will. You're not even guaranteed it with a Nexus phone (see current Verizon Galaxy Nexus which still doesn't have Jelly Bean). Yeah, blame the carriers, but Google is a huge company. Come on, throw some weight around, dammit! That's a huge strike against Android.
2. This bullcrap of announcing phones that aren't even out sucks balls. RAZR MAXX HD looks good. When is out? Dunno. How much will it cost? Dunno. How much memory will it have in it? Dunno. LG Optimus G, when is that coming out? Dunno. How much will it cost? Dunno. Which carrier? Dunno. Shut the hell up about your phone until you're ready to announce when and where it's going to be available, and how much it's going to cost.
3. Stop trying to copy Apple. If I wanted an iPhone, I would get one. I don't, so don't try to sell me a phone with a useless physical home button. I think Apple has an argument there against Samsung.
4. Why are you killing the physical keyboard? The original reason that I bought an Android instead of an iPhone is because I wanted a physical keyboard. The biggest value-added for me of a smartphone over a feature phone is the ability to pretent I'm at work when I'm not, which basically means being able to send and receive emails on my phone. But typing a professional email on a touch screen sucks. Texting maybe is OK, but it's still preferable to have a physical keyboard. Even for searching and on-screen navigation, I still like the buttons. I thought Android was about choice, but when it comes to physical keyboards, your lucky if your carrier has a single one with top of the line spec's.
5. Stay on top of making sure the phones work perfectly. I don't really need to talk to my phone, or "beam" my content to someone else's phone, but I do need my phone not to crash frequently, and to work as intended. Android's do crash a lot, and sometimes it's a real hassle to get them to work as intended. I'd rather the engineers spend a little more time getting the bugs ironed out and a little less time adding new features.
6. Bloatware. Obviously, it's really annoying and not found on iPhones. Especially ones that affect the performance of the phone.
1. Google should be forcing the updates through the system much more. One thing that I know if I buy an iPhone is that I can have the latest version of the OS on it. You can buy a brand-new top of the line Android right now, and it won't have the latest software on it, and you have no guarantee that it ever will. You're not even guaranteed it with a Nexus phone (see current Verizon Galaxy Nexus which still doesn't have Jelly Bean). Yeah, blame the carriers, but Google is a huge company. Come on, throw some weight around, dammit! That's a huge strike against Android.
2. This bullcrap of announcing phones that aren't even out sucks balls. RAZR MAXX HD looks good. When is out? Dunno. How much will it cost? Dunno. How much memory will it have in it? Dunno. LG Optimus G, when is that coming out? Dunno. How much will it cost? Dunno. Which carrier? Dunno. Shut the hell up about your phone until you're ready to announce when and where it's going to be available, and how much it's going to cost.
3. Stop trying to copy Apple. If I wanted an iPhone, I would get one. I don't, so don't try to sell me a phone with a useless physical home button. I think Apple has an argument there against Samsung.
4. Why are you killing the physical keyboard? The original reason that I bought an Android instead of an iPhone is because I wanted a physical keyboard. The biggest value-added for me of a smartphone over a feature phone is the ability to pretent I'm at work when I'm not, which basically means being able to send and receive emails on my phone. But typing a professional email on a touch screen sucks. Texting maybe is OK, but it's still preferable to have a physical keyboard. Even for searching and on-screen navigation, I still like the buttons. I thought Android was about choice, but when it comes to physical keyboards, your lucky if your carrier has a single one with top of the line spec's.
5. Stay on top of making sure the phones work perfectly. I don't really need to talk to my phone, or "beam" my content to someone else's phone, but I do need my phone not to crash frequently, and to work as intended. Android's do crash a lot, and sometimes it's a real hassle to get them to work as intended. I'd rather the engineers spend a little more time getting the bugs ironed out and a little less time adding new features.
6. Bloatware. Obviously, it's really annoying and not found on iPhones. Especially ones that affect the performance of the phone.
George, you raise some good points, I'll try and help with a couple of them..
1) Google don't own android. Android is an open source project - that means you can go download the code, change it, add stuff, take away stuff etc, then actually build the software and install it on a device. What phone manufacturers do is take android and do their own thing with it and then put it on their devices and sell them. This means its impossible for Google to push updates - they don't even have the code! Then the carriers get their hands on it and screw around with it too..
If upgrades are important by a Nexus device, these do not use any extra code over base android and therefore will always get updates first.
3) Agreed, but it goes for everything nowadays - I was looking at pictures of the 2013 Ford about 6 months ago! crazy.
4) I think a physical keyboard is a dead duck.
6) Seems US carriers like their bloatware, in the uk we don't suffer from it too much. that said, I have yet to see any additions from a carrier that actually provide anything worthwhile.. I don't understand why they spend their time and money screwing around with firmwares. Pre-load the settings required, fine but adding all the junk ? pointless.
1) Google don't own android. Android is an open source project - that means you can go download the code, change it, add stuff, take away stuff etc, then actually build the software and install it on a device. What phone manufacturers do is take android and do their own thing with it and then put it on their devices and sell them. This means its impossible for Google to push updates - they don't even have the code! Then the carriers get their hands on it and screw around with it too..
If upgrades are important by a Nexus device, these do not use any extra code over base android and therefore will always get updates first.
3) Agreed, but it goes for everything nowadays - I was looking at pictures of the 2013 Ford about 6 months ago! crazy.
4) I think a physical keyboard is a dead duck.
6) Seems US carriers like their bloatware, in the uk we don't suffer from it too much. that said, I have yet to see any additions from a carrier that actually provide anything worthwhile.. I don't understand why they spend their time and money screwing around with firmwares. Pre-load the settings required, fine but adding all the junk ? pointless.
Wisheezy
Well-Known Member
scooter1942
Android Enthusiast
i happen to like the physical home button. there are other phones out there without them, why didnt you get one of them? isnt that the point of android, choice?
physical keyboards take up space. the keys and circuitry take up space. the mechanism for them to slide out/flip open take up space. everyone is going for thinner/lighter/more compact these days. it would be nice if at least the manufacturers or a third party provided a physical keyboard that could snap onto the phone somehow, like the ones available for the iphone. but i doubt there would be enough demand for that to be worthwhile in the first place
JunBringer
Android Expert
1. I agree that OS updates should be handled better. I'm hoping that Google learned from their exclusive deal with Verizon on the Galaxy Nexus to not ever trust Verizon again and only sell through the Play Store. My solution (for now) may be to buy a Nexus from Google themselves or get an imported device (I'm considering a Note 2) because overseas carriers don't mess up their phones as much, if at all.
2. I agree they need to learn from Apple and do their announcements and releases in the same way, announce every detail, then release a couple weeks afterwards in every market imaginable. If Apple can do it then so can everyone else.
3. I haven't had an Android phone with a physical home button, so I don't know what the problem is here, but if I get a Note 2 I'll probably grow accustomed to it and I doubt I'll be all that upset about it.
4. I think the original Droid series sold well in the first couple generations, but not so well in the 3 and 4 etc and the same goes for other phones with physical keyboards. Unfortunately you're in the minority now and companies that want to make lots of money rarely cater to the minority (folks who want physical keyboards).
5. I'd prefer to have new neato features personally, even if it means slightly less stability than Apple. IMO though ICS and especially Jelly Bean are just as smooth as iOS so it's not so much of an issue in the overall sense, but I understand what was said above about that email program etc.
6. I back you 100%. Bloatware needs to end. Period. No excuses.
I've had both platforms having come from a 3GS as my first smartphone. They do both have their place in the marketplace, as iOS caters well to people who aren't that techy and want to feel like they are (this doesn't describe every iOS user fyi, just a thought). If Apple does continue to "play it safe" and not adopt technologies eventually they'll get left behind. There are more and more people that I talk to who are becoming more and more into mobile tech and those folks tend to get bored on iOS. I'm eager to see how everything plays out over the next few years.
2. I agree they need to learn from Apple and do their announcements and releases in the same way, announce every detail, then release a couple weeks afterwards in every market imaginable. If Apple can do it then so can everyone else.
3. I haven't had an Android phone with a physical home button, so I don't know what the problem is here, but if I get a Note 2 I'll probably grow accustomed to it and I doubt I'll be all that upset about it.
4. I think the original Droid series sold well in the first couple generations, but not so well in the 3 and 4 etc and the same goes for other phones with physical keyboards. Unfortunately you're in the minority now and companies that want to make lots of money rarely cater to the minority (folks who want physical keyboards).
5. I'd prefer to have new neato features personally, even if it means slightly less stability than Apple. IMO though ICS and especially Jelly Bean are just as smooth as iOS so it's not so much of an issue in the overall sense, but I understand what was said above about that email program etc.
6. I back you 100%. Bloatware needs to end. Period. No excuses.
I've had both platforms having come from a 3GS as my first smartphone. They do both have their place in the marketplace, as iOS caters well to people who aren't that techy and want to feel like they are (this doesn't describe every iOS user fyi, just a thought). If Apple does continue to "play it safe" and not adopt technologies eventually they'll get left behind. There are more and more people that I talk to who are becoming more and more into mobile tech and those folks tend to get bored on iOS. I'm eager to see how everything plays out over the next few years.
SUroot
Extreme Android User
Yep. I'm disappointed its not an optical trackball though. Rather this than nothing. I do prefer a physical button. I'm getting on ok with the capacitive ones but not as much as the home button.
Darkhan
Well-Known Member
I ordered one. Love my S3 but I also love ios so I am not biased and will always swap to the latest and greatest. If it sucks then back to S3 I go till the next phone.
CuBz
Android Expert
Let us know your fair comparison
Personally I don't like how tall in height and short in width the iPhone 5 is. They should have made it a little bit wider too.
carracerz14
Android Expert
Should have stayed with your s3 if you Want the greatest
Easilyamused
Android Enthusiast
Well he certainly won't know until he uses it and compares. Paper specs certainly do not tell the whole story.
two and a half year samsung android user here. Went from WM TReo 800/Pros and HTC TP2s to four Epics on launch. I've been using a work provided s3 with one consulting job for a month that is ending.
We were out of contract and eligible on four lines of sprint starting last week.
Ultimately it came down to iphones 32GB 5s for wife and college student son, one to stay in box for likely resale (keeping free used iphone 4s is got for my middle schooler line), and a S3 for me. The buying decision was 80% mine.
I got the S3 for $99 on Amazon yesterday.
Yes, it grinds me to pay apple $100 for $20 of 16 gb more. The lack of micro usb ticks me off.
But there are also other considerations. (These are mine and everyone is different)
Negatives of S3:
1) not a world phone. No excuse for that in a supposedly top of the line phone. Sprint iphone is a TRUE worldphone and Sprint will unlock SIM a few days after purchase. We travel and that makes a big difference
2) The physical build quality of the s3 in my opinion is about the lowest of any super smart on the market.
3) Real life battery could be better
4) The S3 GPS in my opinion is middling, and after dealing with the absolute and abject screw-up of GPS on Epic, my faith in Samsung's post sale support or not making things WORSE and then not addressing abject failures they create, is pretty low.
5) My own opinion on likely very low resale value of s3 relative to iphone in six to 10 months. this matters to me becasue when sprint gets winmob 8 lineup in sprint 13 I will likely go to win 8
Positives of S3 (for me):
1) larger screen. I am old enough for it to matter quite a bit.
2) not only actually getting way more bang for the buck with memory but having a scalable option with micro card slot.
3) relative ease of root-tether
4) micro usb support
5) mkv and avi support (keep in mind though this is just containers so making mp4 for for iphone isnt that hard).
6) not supporting a company (apple) which is patent trolling to harm innovation and consuemr choice.
For the wife and son the apple advantages trumped, for me the s3 advantages did. So dont assume all people are just buying out of ignorance
I have to say I don't get the OP's title. How did apple get screwed? The launch is the biggest ever and by far.
I also think the intangible of brand, and owner status from brand, as much as we may not like the concept, adds value for certain consumers. I am a tech person and a road warrior and have been one since my first kaypro and hayes 300 baud. I am spec, hackability and capabilty motivated and willing to learn to juice the most out of a piece of equipment. But for a lot of people the status of brand also conveys value. Before simply laughing that off we ought to consider that probably almost all of us do overspend on brand for status vs specs on any number of purchases. I dont see my phone as an accessory but many do. If someone wants to spend a premium over value on an in-demand product that demand and brand create their own value. Why is that different than owning a famous brand watch or a shirt with an aligator? (do you guys know people now spend less on watches now that the visible worn status accesory is a smartphone?) People buy lexus over toyota, accura over honda where a certain amount of the premium is status. That is part of the equation for many.
We were out of contract and eligible on four lines of sprint starting last week.
Ultimately it came down to iphones 32GB 5s for wife and college student son, one to stay in box for likely resale (keeping free used iphone 4s is got for my middle schooler line), and a S3 for me. The buying decision was 80% mine.
I got the S3 for $99 on Amazon yesterday.
Yes, it grinds me to pay apple $100 for $20 of 16 gb more. The lack of micro usb ticks me off.
But there are also other considerations. (These are mine and everyone is different)
Negatives of S3:
1) not a world phone. No excuse for that in a supposedly top of the line phone. Sprint iphone is a TRUE worldphone and Sprint will unlock SIM a few days after purchase. We travel and that makes a big difference
2) The physical build quality of the s3 in my opinion is about the lowest of any super smart on the market.
3) Real life battery could be better
4) The S3 GPS in my opinion is middling, and after dealing with the absolute and abject screw-up of GPS on Epic, my faith in Samsung's post sale support or not making things WORSE and then not addressing abject failures they create, is pretty low.
5) My own opinion on likely very low resale value of s3 relative to iphone in six to 10 months. this matters to me becasue when sprint gets winmob 8 lineup in sprint 13 I will likely go to win 8
Positives of S3 (for me):
1) larger screen. I am old enough for it to matter quite a bit.
2) not only actually getting way more bang for the buck with memory but having a scalable option with micro card slot.
3) relative ease of root-tether
4) micro usb support
5) mkv and avi support (keep in mind though this is just containers so making mp4 for for iphone isnt that hard).
6) not supporting a company (apple) which is patent trolling to harm innovation and consuemr choice.
For the wife and son the apple advantages trumped, for me the s3 advantages did. So dont assume all people are just buying out of ignorance
I have to say I don't get the OP's title. How did apple get screwed? The launch is the biggest ever and by far.
I also think the intangible of brand, and owner status from brand, as much as we may not like the concept, adds value for certain consumers. I am a tech person and a road warrior and have been one since my first kaypro and hayes 300 baud. I am spec, hackability and capabilty motivated and willing to learn to juice the most out of a piece of equipment. But for a lot of people the status of brand also conveys value. Before simply laughing that off we ought to consider that probably almost all of us do overspend on brand for status vs specs on any number of purchases. I dont see my phone as an accessory but many do. If someone wants to spend a premium over value on an in-demand product that demand and brand create their own value. Why is that different than owning a famous brand watch or a shirt with an aligator? (do you guys know people now spend less on watches now that the visible worn status accesory is a smartphone?) People buy lexus over toyota, accura over honda where a certain amount of the premium is status. That is part of the equation for many.
scooter1942
Android Enthusiast
the trackball is one thing i miss from my mytouch 3g... pretty much the ONLY thing i miss. my vibrant had capacitive buttons so i dont have to adjust much. i do happen to trip them accidentally every so often though
You've missed the point, go back read all previous posts.
Besides I clearly said 4.5" and 4.8" anyway, not that it matters.
Iphone 5 specs compared to Samsung Galaxy S3 by "Mac Observer".........though without knowing anything about the CPU (lol) its not much of a comparison.
Spec Comparison: Apple's iPhone 5 vs. Samsung Galaxy S3 - The Mac Observer
I notice looking down the list that it has "X" against "HDR Mode" on the S3 but I can take HDR with my S3?
Maybe somebody more up with the S3 specs than me will notice more discrepancies?
Also note the I5's puny 480 minutes talk time compared to the S3's 700 minutes
Spec Comparison: Apple's iPhone 5 vs. Samsung Galaxy S3 - The Mac Observer
I notice looking down the list that it has "X" against "HDR Mode" on the S3 but I can take HDR with my S3?
Maybe somebody more up with the S3 specs than me will notice more discrepancies?
Also note the I5's puny 480 minutes talk time compared to the S3's 700 minutes
davoid
Android Expert
Hmm. I've read every post in this thread, and so if I've missed the point maybe you had better make it more clearly.
In the post I quoted you distinctly claimed that:
I was disputing your claim that the dpi is higher than Android phones by pointing out that the Sony Xperia S has a higher pixel density than the iPhone.
iPhone 4S: 640 x 960 pixels, 3.5 inches (~330 ppi pixel density)
iPhone 5: 640 x 1136 pixels, 4.0 inches (~326 ppi pixel density)
Xperia S: 720 x 1280 pixels, 4.3 inches (~342 ppi pixel density)
Which makes an Android phone the highest pixel density of any device.
"sigh"
I don't disagree with you, some Android phones do have higher ppi but that was not the point.
And I don't care enough to explain, seems like im talking to brick wall.
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