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Root [MOD] LG Esteem 720p @ 30FPS (UPDATED 9/5/12)

The concept that there is a maximum possible FPS beyond which the human eye can't distinguish any real difference is not entirely accurate. For more details, see this article and this article among the many which refute this claim. In particular the common claim that "The human eye can't see more than 24 (or 25 or 30 or 60) FPS" is completely false, and is partly borne of the misconception that TV or movie FPS is the same as PC game FPS, and partly possibly borne out of a need to justify lower frame-rates.

It's true that movies and TV only use around 24, 25 or 30 FPS, depending on which part of the world you're in. But there are three important differences between Movies, TV and PC games:

1. Movies and TV use Motion Blur, so that if at any time you freeze a movie scene on your DVD player for example, a large part of the scene may consist of blurred objects. Furthermore, the images in a movie or on TV do not have crisp detailed outlines. In a PC game on the other hand, if you take a screenshot or pause the game at any time, you will notice that everything is usually extremely sharp and distinct regardless of how fast it was moving when the shot was taken. Take a look at the screenshot comparison above: on the left is a fast motion shot of an alien from the movie Alien vs. Predator, on the right a fast motion shot of an alien from the old game Alien vs. Predator 2. Thus 24 often-blurred frames from a movie wind up looking much smoother to the human eye than 24 or even 30 distinct frames from a fast-moving PC game. So why can't games use motion blur? Well indeed most recent games have started incorporating blur effects. This can definitely help to reduce the visible impact of lower frame-rates, but aside from the fact that not all games have motion blur, the next point addresses why this doesn't always work. Even with motion blur, the graphics in PC games may still have very sharp outlines which only settings like Anti-aliasing can smooth out, but ironically this usually come at the expense of further lowering FPS.

2. Control responsiveness steps in again to further differentiate between a movie and a game. In a movie or TV show, the viewpoint is not under your control; it is typically a static or smoothly panning camera. In a game however, your control over the viewpoint means that in a rapidly moving gaming at 24 or even 30FPS you will notice the general choppiness due to a lack of responsiveness. The variability of control responsiveness based on variable frame-rate also helps highlight the next point below.

3. PC games do not have a rock-solid unchanging frame-rate, while TV and movies do. While some games have a frame-rate cap of 30 or 60 FPS, very few if any PC games can be locked down to consistently show exactly 24 or 30 FPS - their FPS will vary, sometimes significantly. Movies and TV on the other hand always show exactly the same number of frames per second and do not vary one bit. Therefore the variability in frame-rate in games also works to exaggerate the impact of lower frame-rates, making them more noticeable. In Crysis for example, if you walk out of an indoor area which has 60 FPS into a outdoor area with 25 FPS, you will notice the difference, partly due to a change in control responsiveness, and partly because your eyes detect the relative change in frame-rate.

Testing has shown that human beings can regularly distinguish differences of one frame in 200 every second. There is no actual theoretical limit on how many frames the eye can distinguish. In the natural world, human eyes don't digest motion in terms of a series of still frames, they take in a constant stream of analog movement data. In particular, we are quick to notice dramatic contrasts, no matter how brief. If there is a gap or brief fluctuation in the flow of visual data, then our eyes and consequently our brain can actually pick this up if it's relevant, even if it's subconscious - it all depends on the context of the data streaming in.

So to come back to the question of how many FPS is enough, in my experience, and for most practical purposes, a frame-rate of around 60 FPS is completely sufficient as a maximum FPS. Even 25 or 30FPS can be totally sufficient in slow or medium-paced games - particularly if the game has motion blur, softer edges, and does not display significant variability or stuttering. If there's one thing that would be perfect to have in any game, it would be a method of maintaining a fixed frame-rate. Unfortunately this is not practically possible on many systems because of the different types of hardware used. You can enable V Sync to cap the maximum frame-rate and hence reduce FPS variability, but this may also reduce performance.


Or what he said...i was too slow again. LoL
 
Fps has standards in the motion picture industry related to standardized resolutions....for.example ntsc 720 x 480 (usa) which is 29.97 fps and widescreen can be as low as 23.976 and pal (europe) which is 720 x 576 @ 25 fps. HDTV at 1080 runs between 24 - 29.97 and at 720 is either 25 or 29.97 while film is ususally 24 fps. Nothing actually plays at a full 30.

This is my understanding. Not to say it or you is wrong which basically correct. The quality of video has little to do with fps though. The main thing of fps is smoothness of the film and motion blur. You could demonstrate this (minus the motion blur hogher fps = less motion blur) by using a pad of post it notes. On one pad make a stick figure moving using 15 sheets and then make the same animation using 30. Then flip through them. The quality of picture will be the same but the animation will look more fluid.


No dude, this is the PERFECT description. You are 100% correct. ;)
 
Youtube DOES reencode video you upload so yes you need to eliminate this variable from the equation. Dropbox it or something
 
okay I have figured out something else interesting.

The Santeria is in FACT 30fps.

Although I cant replicate anything to be 30fps. Meaning Each video ive taken here recently is at 15fps.

Im wondering if it has something to do with youtube and downloading it from youtube. Even though I downloaded the shittiest version and it still says 30fps.

Uploading a video I just took at 15fps to youtube and gonna download and see if youtube is the variable.

Regardless, for the haters that said they could see the difference between the versions................well. I'll just leave it at that. Seems there's a difference between 30fps and 30fps. :rollseyes:
 
Youtube is NOT the variable.

Video I just uploaded it STILL 15fps, even when downloading the highest quality version.

So this leads me to believe that whatever camera I was using at the time I recorded the Santeria video was in fact recording at 30fps. Shit.

I do know I was on ZVB back in Feb. and the only ROM I would use was Gingersteem.
 
Fps has standards in the motion picture industry related to standardized resolutions....for.example ntsc 720 x 480 (usa) which is 29.97 fps and widescreen can be as low as 23.976 and pal (europe) which is 720 x 576 @ 25 fps. HDTV at 1080 runs between 24 - 29.97 and at 720 is either 25 or 29.97 while film is ususally 24 fps. Nothing actually plays at a full 30.

This is my understanding. Not to say it or you is wrong which basically correct. The quality of video has little to do with fps though. The main thing of fps is smoothness of the film and motion blur. You could demonstrate this (minus the motion blur hogher fps = less motion blur) by using a pad of post it notes. On one pad make a stick figure moving using 15 sheets and then make the same animation using 30. Then flip through them. The quality of picture will be the same but the animation will look more fluid.

my arguement wasnt quality...daytime soaps and indie films arent visually appealing...my point was yours just reiterated. we were both talking about motion...
 
my arguement wasnt quality...daytime soaps and indie films arent visually appealing...my point was yours just reiterated. we were both talking about motion...


Oh. Very sorry for the confusion. =( i think it was the comparison of soaps and blair witch that messed with me lol. I meant no offense.
 
Interesting indeed... WTH?? Why does my video look choppy as hell???
Honestly - if I didn't (think) I knew better, I'd swear it was @ 15fps!... I'm seriously starting to doubt my perception of all this - not to mention that of my editor.
lol
 
okay I have figured out something else interesting.

The Santeria is in FACT 30fps.

Although I cant replicate anything to be 30fps. Meaning Each video ive taken here recently is at 15fps.

Im wondering if it has something to do with youtube and downloading it from youtube. Even though I downloaded the shittiest version and it still says 30fps.

Uploading a video I just took at 15fps to youtube and gonna download and see if youtube is the variable.

Regardless, for the haters that said they could see the difference between the versions................well. I'll just leave it at that. Seems there's a difference between 30fps and 30fps. :rollseyes:

Consideration - my video goes directly to news feeds... not Youtube - maybe YT does a step-down in order to conserve bandwidth? idk...

But you guys are right - the human eye can't easily discern video quality above 24-25fps. That much is a given...

The question is - why does every video taken on my Esteem look like CRAP?
lol
:confused:
 
Interesting indeed... WTH?? Why does my video look choppy as hell???
Honestly - if I didn't (think) I knew better, I'd swear it was @ 15fps!... I'm seriously starting to doubt my perception of all this - not to mention that of my editor.
lol

I remember something about false positives concerning software but oh well...:rolleyes:

Every one of my videos reads 15fps...never have i ever seen the stock camera record higher than that....on my Evo with stock Sense i could record at 20-24fps but once i flashed a AOSP rom the camera recorded at crappy 15fps...i cant explain it scientifically and technologically and i not going to sit here and act like a genius...but HTC puts some extra stardust into the framework...might have some thing to do with the way they handle compression
 
Aight Im back. Bout to mess around with some things before I hit the bed.

So everything Ive recorded has been 15fps. Loaded into Youtube and downloaded from there has still retained it's 15fps.

So Im going to try and somehow figure out what I was using when i recorded the Sublime video. I recorded other videos around that same time period and they are all 30fps and then in March I recorded one and its in 15fps.

I never got this camera mod to work so it had to have been something within the ROMs I was using cause back then I wasnt messing with stuff that much.

Ill see what I can figure up.
 
I have found that when the mp4 is converted to an avi, it says it's 25fps when before the conversion it was 15fps. I uploaded it to youtube and downloaded and checked it again and it was still at 25fps.

My youtube vids were avi files that I would have converted from the mp4 but they are all at 30fps. I've tried every camera from zvb with no luck, even the stock GB camera.apk along with the cameraapp.apk.

Im going to try some other things but I really dont know.
 
Stop the presses. I got it to work. Tested on my phone, sisters, a friend, and my inside guy at metro. Ill post a vid later cause im to lazy to load up anything right now. But yup been working fully tested. After many phone restarts, pulled batteries. Been sitting on this for about 2 weeks
 
Stop the presses. I got it to work. Tested on my phone, sisters, a friend, and my inside guy at metro. Ill post a vid later cause im to lazy to load up anything right now. But yup been working fully tested. After many phone restarts, pulled batteries. Been sitting on this for about 2 weeks

DOOD - ARE YOU SERIOUS???
OUTSTANDING!

:congrats::congrats::congrats::congrats::congrats:
:rock:

Please tell me you're not joking... :o
 
Stop the presses. I got it to work. Tested on my phone, sisters, a friend, and my inside guy at metro. Ill post a vid later cause im to lazy to load up anything right now. But yup been working fully tested. After many phone restarts, pulled batteries. Been sitting on this for about 2 weeks


Nobody cares about the vid, people care about the mod. So post that instead.

Until then your just one of the 2 others that got it to work ;)
 
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