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UN Libyan Resolution

When was the last time Gaddafi committed genocide?

"Genocide:
The systematic killing of substantial numbers of people on the basis of ethnicity, religion, political opinion, social status, or other particularity; Acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial or religious group"

erm... maybe killing people who peacefully protested against his regime in order to stay in power? say erm... for the last month solidly. I included a video earlier if you want to have a look.
 
do you see the rebels with much artillery, armoured cars, personnel carriers, command centres and communication centres?
I don't...

Do I see the Taliban using artillery, armored cars, personnel carriers, command centers and communication centers?

We are not the world's war police making sure both sides play fair... especially since WE aren't willing to.

I also don't see the rebels (quoting the BBC) doing this: "Government tanks shell area near the hospital in Misrata" either

Really? In a war, shelling got near a hospital? Were there civilian casualties to report? If not, then who cares... it's a war.

Nor do I think it's rebels doing this (BBC quote again)
"1812: The disappearance of hundreds of people in Libya over the past few months may amount to a crime against humanity, UN human rights expert Olivier de Frouville has told the Associated Press."

Are we doing anything to stop this? No. We aren't. We aren't interested in stopping these actions. We are only interested in supporting the rebels militarily.
 
"Genocide:
The systematic killing of substantial numbers of people on the basis of ethnicity, religion, political opinion, social status, or other particularity; Acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial or religious group"

erm... maybe killing people who peacefully protested against his regime in order to stay in power? say erm... for the last month solidly. I included a video earlier if you want to have a look.

alright let's see...

Is he intending to destroy a national group. Nope. They are part of his national group.

Is he intending to destroy an ethnic group? Nope. He's had 40+ years to wipe out those tribes and has never really bothered with them.

Is he intending to destroy them, in whole or in part? No. He's intending to put down rebellion. Before it was rebellion, he was intending to put down political protest.

Gaddafi has never shown himself to be inclined to genocide, and there is no reason to think he would start now.
 
Do I see the Taliban using artillery, armored cars, personnel carriers, command centers and communication centers?

We are not the world's war police making sure both sides play fair... especially since WE aren't willing to.



Really? In a war, shelling got near a hospital? Were there civilian casualties to report? If not, then who cares... it's a war.



Are we doing anything to stop this? No. We aren't. We aren't interested in stopping these actions. We are only interested in supporting the rebels militarily.

The Taliban are a threat to the UK, the US etc. That's self defence as well as many Afghans wanting them out as well.

I think that's partly the reason of the UN.
Genocide, defined by the UN is:

"
What is genocide?
The 1948 Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of
Genocide (article 2) defines genocide as
 
alright let's see...

Is he intending to destroy a national group. Nope. They are part of his national group.

Is he intending to destroy an ethnic group? Nope. He's had 40+ years to wipe out those tribes and has never really bothered with them.

Is he intending to destroy them, in whole or in part? No. He's intending to put down rebellion. Before it was rebellion, he was intending to put down political protest.

Gaddafi has never shown himself to be inclined to genocide, and there is no reason to think he would start now.

there's a reason I made some of it bold. I meant that was the part you should read
 
Do I see the Taliban respecting non x-Muslim-Factioners, women, opposing forces, the wounded, civilians

NO

Oh, so it's only a crime against humanity... if the opposing force has some sort of morality you agree with?

there's a reason I made some of it bold. I meant that was the part you should read

Yes, I understand. If we only take half of the definition, then it fits... unfortunately, if we only took that half of the definition, then every armed conflict to ever occur in history fits... and that greatly dilutes the meaning of genocide. Which is why you need BOTH parts of the definition.
 
Oh, so it's only a crime against humanity... if the opposing force has some sort of morality you agree with?



Yes, I understand. If we only take half of the definition, then it fits... unfortunately, if we only took that half of the definition, then every armed conflict to ever occur in history fits... and that greatly dilutes the meaning of genocide. Which is why you need BOTH parts of the definition.


If I said racism could be unjust prejudice towards blacks, whites, muslims or christians would you say you had to be against all of them to be racist? no

On an unrelated note, why are you yanks not allowed to protest outside the White House?
If you aren't allowed to protest where and when you want, what's the point of helping others do it?
 
If I said racism could be unjust prejudice towards blacks, whites, muslims or christians would you say you had to be against all of them to be racist? no

Ok. I understand what you want to be true. But you are making the definition of genocide WAY too broad in order to make it so.

Libya is not, has never been, and has no indication of ever being a genocide.

On an unrelated note, why are you yanks not allowed to protest outside the White House?
If you aren't allowed to protest where and when you want, what's the point of helping others do it?

I'm a bit confused by this statement. People protest outside the white house ALL the time.
 
On an unrelated note, why are you yanks not allowed to protest outside the White House?
If you aren't allowed to protest where and when you want, what's the point of helping others do it?

We're allowed, but you have to have permits and stuff. You typically need permits to do large protests anywhere. Got to make sure your taking precautions for safety and traffic control and stuff. And if its controversial cops what to know so they can keep peace between protesters and anti-protesters.

Plus they let people just show up on the capital lawn, its a public park I think, and protest about anything, but when you start getting too large a crowd or too out of hand, they'll start dispersing people for not having a permit.
 
Remember Rebels are not civilians. Genocide would be his forces would be killing every man, woman, and child in their homes and so on. He is fighting the people that are opposing him and when you take up arms against your leader you are no longer a civilian. You are a combatant.
 
yet he us happy to shell civilian areas, have his thugs rape journalists etc

BTW, anyone see the staged civilian casualties .. lol
 
looks like these guys weren't doing anything wrong... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8UL5aXBlsc
do permits get rejected?
You dont see what these few people did to get arrested. Its not like the cops or the protestors was hostile. Even the older man was talking and laughing with the cops. More than likely they was released and no charges was filed.

So why post a video thats so one sided and dont tell both sides of the story.

Key words is peaceful protest. If you get out of hand you break the law. As they dont want a riot on their hands.

Protest permits is for the organization of the protest and not for individuals. It gives you the right to do it but keep yourself in check.
 
Unrest Benefits Iran Most With Our Unwitting Help - Investors.com

With Iran's successful history in diplomatic subterfuge, it should come as no surprise that the U.S. has inadvertently done Iran's bidding in Libya. By aiding Libyan rebels — like the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group (which tried unsuccessfully to kill Moammar Gadhafi in 1996) and others with deep ties to both Iranian and al-Qaida-supported terror efforts — the U.S. is advancing Iranian goals.

A validation of this unfortunate alignment of U.S. military power with Iranian strategic objectives can be found in Qatar's becoming the first Arab nation to fly combat missions over Libya. Qatar, like Oman, Syria and Lebanon, is aligned with Iran. That Mirage 2000 jet fighters from Qatar's tiny air force are flying combat missions says much about Iranian approval of the ill-defined NATO mission in Libya.

Of further interest is: What base are Qatar's jets using? NATO's aircraft are flying off of U.S. aircraft carriers or from bases in southern Europe. Qatar's land-based aircraft have no choice but to use airfields in Tunisia or, more probably, Egypt — opening up the even more troubling prospect of Egypt's Muslim Brotherhood-penetrated transitional military regime allowing its bases and airspace to be used by Qatar in the Iranian-backed mission.

Libya, at least the eastern portion of that nation, may join other Iranian outposts in Africa. Iran has assembled a strong network of terror training posts in Sudan. In Eritrea, sitting adjacent to the strategic Horn of Africa shipping choke point, Iran enjoys extraterritorial rights — amounting to de facto Iranian soil adjacent to one of the world's top 10 shipping lanes.

Iranian subversion efforts are increasing in western Africa, with Senegal, Gambia and Nigeria attracting Iranian attention. In late 2010, Nigeria arrested two Iranian al-Quds (Jerusalem) Force officers who were accompanying a large arms shipment intended for rebels in Gambia. The al-Quds Force is the covert arm of Iran's Revolutionary Guards Corps.

Iran views western Africa as key. The region hosts a large population of Lebanese Shiites whose control of the diamond trade helps finance Iran's Hezbollah terror proxies in Lebanon, as well as providing conduits for supporting Iran's regional subversion and terror efforts.

But, more importantly, western Africa is home to many U.N. votes, and it is in the U.N. that Iran hopes to hold off further sanctions against its prized nuclear weapons effort.

Iran's nuclear program, temporarily stalled by the Stuxnet computer virus, will change everything. At best, it will set off a nuclear arms race in the Middle East, with first Turkey, then Saudi Arabia and Egypt seeking to develop nuclear weapons in response.
 
...Yet why has Qatar recognised the secular transitional council as the sole representative of the people of Libya

Given how little time Iran has for Lebanon's secular government...
 
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