Thatdad
Android Expert
Either Canada or France. (I have LARGE amounts of french ancestory)
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free health care
- Thread starter sntaylor
- Start date
Either Canada or France. (I have LARGE amounts of french ancestory)
chrlswltrs
Extreme Android User
WTF? Obamacare is going to completely destroy America. It doesn't only aim to destroy healthcare and employment. It is literally going to be the end of America if it is ever implemented. I know federal agents better not ever show up at my house and want to "inspect" it because of my high health risk because I'm a veteran or any other of their "high risk" reasons. They won't be coming in my house without a warrant signed by a judge, and even then I will probably take a stand and not allow then to enter. Eventually we have to "draw a line in the sand" or they won't stop until we are worse off than the Germans during the Nazi rule because that is where we are headed.
This truly is a very bad time for America and liberty in general...
http://benswann.com/obamacare-provision-forced-home-inspections/
This truly is a very bad time for America and liberty in general...
http://benswann.com/obamacare-provision-forced-home-inspections/
No, I think that after having called my insurer to ask what would be changing about my plan.
It's not a special plan, it's your state law. Remember, though, that's a cap on total healthcare expenditures. Not just premiums, but co-insurance payments, deductible payments, everything. No one's premium will be that high, good lord. Hasn't your state published the list of Exchange plans yet? Here in Virginia, they're almost all lower than anything comparable currently offered, with better coverage.
Of course, I have no expensive special medications, so I'm still willing to defer to your expertise about that, if you'll share it with us.
Why won't they be covered? Can you point them out to me in the ACA? Have you called your insurer to ask what the impact on those medications will be? would you mind telling me who is your insurer, and what is the name of the plan you have? I would be fascinated to hear their response.
If you're at all interested in doing some research, I have Anthem Keycare 30. I'm assuming if you gave them a call, they'd tell you the same thing they've told me: Nothing changes.
That being said, I have the spreadsheet of the proposed plans that will be offered here in the Virginia exchange, and at least two of them are a better deal than I have now.
Come October, one of us will presumably be right. Either we'll both have the same plan we have today, or something will have forced us to switch. Either we'll pay more, the same, or less. Either your meds will still be covered, or they won't. I hope I'm right with my analysis, for all of our sakes!
Of course, there's nothing new about Walmart finding ways to avoid paying their employees any kind of benefits. When it was their own policy to provide benefits to full-time employees, they sent a memo in 2006, before Obamacare was even a twinkling, advising managers to move to more part time workers. Let's remember that this is a company that turned a 17 billion dollar profit in 2013. If they offered all of their 2.2m employees health care (at, say, the rate my company pays, which is probably double what they'd pay with a 2.2 million person group) it'd cost them around 8.8 billion dollars a year, leaving a profit of 9 billion.
Oh, wait, they already cover 48% of employees. So they're back up to 13 billion. Profit. And that's assuming they pay the same I pay for my insurance.
So yeah, I'd get 25% less dividend on my Walmart stock, but the company would still be profitable. It's not going to bankrupt them, it's not that they can't afford to. It's that they decided profits were more important than providing employee benefits. As far as I'm concerned, that's their call. But it's why I shop at Costco. Their customer service is better, their employees are well taken care of, and hey, I love me a chicken bake.
Except for that one I got that had a bandaid in it. Ew.
SiempreTuna
Android Expert
:rofl:
Somebody seems to actually think shock jock BS is for real!
:laugh:
I searched for this on Google. That link came up, closely followed by this one:
Stupidest Man on the Internet Warns ObamaCars Storm Troopers Will Come for Your Children
.. kinda says it all - I know it's t'interweb, but reality checks still apply
ElasticNinja
Android Expert
You do realise that France is still very much dirigiste?
And they force you to have healthcare! And to help others! Disgusting!
Gmash
Extreme Android User
:rofl:
Somebody seems to actually think shock jock BS is for real!
:laugh:
I searched for this on Google. That link came up, closely followed by this one:
Stupidest Man on the Internet Warns ObamaCars Storm Troopers Will Come for Your Children
.. kinda says it all - I know it's t'interweb, but reality checks still apply
I really want to laugh, but then I remind myself that people are all too eager to believe that crap.
Thatdad
Android Expert
Europe seems like they care more about their people. I would not put my faith in the most corrupt government on the face of planet Earth.
You know, the one that has initiated almost every modern war in the modern world's history?
Oh and I don't trust Obama at all, everything he spouts is almost always a lie. Oh ObamaCare isn't a tax! Dude whatever! That's how universal health care works! Lol Obama just assumes every American is completely dim witted.
copestag
Android Expert
I dont believe he assumes every American is dimwitted........ I believe he knows for an absolute fact that most Americans are dimwitted..... otherwise he wouldnt be where he is
out of ideas
Android Enthusiast
obamacare is not even close to free health care and I would appreciate it if people would stop confusing the two because they believe whatever they heard in passing. especially non-americans(love you guys but you are very unfamiliar with american healthcare if you equate it to yours)
the number one problem with american health care is and has been cost. All obamacare does is fine people who dont buy healthcare.
easily the dumbest idea i ever heard of. it does not help with costs, especially when it adds additional taxes to the industry which have yet to kick in and will be phased in over a number of years(things like medical device makers etc.)
the insurers run on greed. plain and simple. they had been steadily raising premiums as early as 2009 based on the fact that "we think more people wil be able to afford it now that the recession is nearly over". hardly a rational reason to jack up prices.
forcing everyone to buy it is nothing but a huge gift the healthcare lobby which has donated handsomely to many elections.
any projected savings are based on hopes that maybe enough young healthy people will buy it so the industry will feel generous and lower costs. this is not going to happen. capping out of pocket wont drop premiums, costs must be made up somewhere.
however this is especially misleading because healthy individual who would typically pay 1/6 of an elderly or sick person now will have to pay around 1/3 of what the elderly pay. so it actually raises rates on the young. and ofcourse will continue to raise rates on the elderly.
Additionally many national and large regional business have been cutting hours to under 30 per week to fit in with obamacare, not just the money hungry pigs at walmart. the part time work week is now about 28 hours, so you now will be having to work two jobs to get poverty-ish wages, and still pay for your healthcare.
anyone who thinks it is not cutting hours has obviously not gone looking for a job in the real world.
the number one problem with american health care is and has been cost. All obamacare does is fine people who dont buy healthcare.
easily the dumbest idea i ever heard of. it does not help with costs, especially when it adds additional taxes to the industry which have yet to kick in and will be phased in over a number of years(things like medical device makers etc.)
the insurers run on greed. plain and simple. they had been steadily raising premiums as early as 2009 based on the fact that "we think more people wil be able to afford it now that the recession is nearly over". hardly a rational reason to jack up prices.
forcing everyone to buy it is nothing but a huge gift the healthcare lobby which has donated handsomely to many elections.
any projected savings are based on hopes that maybe enough young healthy people will buy it so the industry will feel generous and lower costs. this is not going to happen. capping out of pocket wont drop premiums, costs must be made up somewhere.
however this is especially misleading because healthy individual who would typically pay 1/6 of an elderly or sick person now will have to pay around 1/3 of what the elderly pay. so it actually raises rates on the young. and ofcourse will continue to raise rates on the elderly.
Additionally many national and large regional business have been cutting hours to under 30 per week to fit in with obamacare, not just the money hungry pigs at walmart. the part time work week is now about 28 hours, so you now will be having to work two jobs to get poverty-ish wages, and still pay for your healthcare.
anyone who thinks it is not cutting hours has obviously not gone looking for a job in the real world.
ElasticNinja
Android Expert
The European countries that do (i.e. not Turkey or Serbia, but NL or Spain). do this by having large social provisions.
Europe has far more corrupt governments. Russia, Greece, Italy, etc.
The US didn't initiative the Franco-Prussian War, WWI, WWII, etc. Don't be such a drama queen.
ObamaCare isn't a tax as far as I can tell. The fact that it's an improvement on the previous situation should male everyone ashamed.
Also your facts are a bit off, so be careful about calling others dim witted.
Thatdad
Android Expert
Oh yeah its not officially a tax but they said there will be a penalty put on you by the IRS. Hmm.
I guess somewhere along the line using a different name for basically the same thing makes it completely right. :what:
Please show me where my facts are off..
And I'm not calling anyone here dimwitted. Sorry but most people from other countries call us Americans completely idiotic. I was just trying to spare feelings.
And I think America is the most corrupt on Earth. People tend to forget that it is our Government who initiated the Vietnam War, invade the most countries than any other, push our Western Ideals and language on others, imprison the most people, fight wars for obvious gains for the pockets of the wealthy elitists who fund these conflicts, how our Government sways to the companies and lobbyists with the most money for funds, can't forget about the oil war.. Oops I meant to say Iraq and war on terror..
and most recently how our NSA has the most largest spying scandal in history, oh and all for the sake of freedom! Oh joyous of joys let freedom ring!
You're free to call me a drama queen, and yes I did kind of go off like one just now. But when you sit there and say something that has been proven as fact is not true, it seems a little off to me. I'm sorry if I'm blunt and I'm sorry if I offend you.
But I don't sugar coat or kiss butt. That's what's gotten us into most of our issues today.
out of ideas
Android Enthusiast
It's not an improvement.
Also the only reason it was upheld by the supreme court was as a tax
Supreme Court upholds Obamacare individual mandate as a tax - ABC News
which is funny because in the lead up to the supreme court case, obama and co. told us over and over and over again that it wasn't a tax.
the court ONLY allowed it by saying congress could create taxes.
technically it did not originate in the proper committees with approval to create taxes, but I guess silly things like the constitution or history don't matter anymore.
ElasticNinja
Android Expert
So would you support a proper universal healthcare system then, like France's?
And I think America is the most corrupt on Earth. People tend to forget that it is our Government who initiated the Vietnam War, invade the most countries than any other, push our Western Ideals and language on others, imprison the most people, fight wars for obvious gains for the pockets of the wealthy elitists who fund these conflicts, how our Government sways to the companies and lobbyists with the most money for funds, can't forget about the oil war.. Oops I meant to say Iraq and war on terror..
Read all this, now think of what Russia did at the same time.
SiempreTuna
Android Expert
I think the problem is how you define 'corrupt': legally speaking, the US and most other western governments are remarkably clean.
Trouble is that it is the corrupt who have defined legality. Politicians have legalised many things that they themselves call corrupt elsewhere, like for instance, actions that satisfy any reasonable definition (other than the legal) of bribery - i.e. money for political favours - are suddenly renamed 'Political Contributions' and are magically transformed into something fine and honourable.
Similarly, the US rightly decries voter fraud around the world while at home, the GOP continues to openly run a decades long campaign to remove the vote from any minority it thinks might vote democrat.
I daresay the democrats have tried similar things, too.
Not really - the US was involved, but in the defence of the French and subsequently the South Vietnamese.
The French - as the colonial power - fought a long and vicious war (with US assistance in the form of military advisors) against Chinese-backed communist insurgents which culminated in the French surrender at the battle of Dien Bien Phu in 1954 (often called the First Vietnam / Indochina War).
The French were then thrown out and Vietnam was split into North and South in 1955. Following the split, the the US and other western powers were increasingly involved in the defence of the south against northern incursion, with US military involvment really picking up from around 1959 and increasing through to the US defeat in 1973 (often called the Second Vietnam / Indochina War).
Think you'll find that 'accolade' belongs to the Brits who have fought in more countries than any other: there are apparently only 22 countries left in the world where we haven't fought. Was 23 until the recent action in Chad.
imprison the most people, fight wars for obvious gains for the pockets of the wealthy elitists who fund these conflicts, how our Government sways to the companies and lobbyists with the most money for funds, can't forget about the oil war.. Oops I meant to say Iraq and war on terror..
No argument with any of that
Not entirely sure how all this relates to health care, of course ..
Thatdad
Android Expert
If we had a proper universal health care system then absolutely! Everyone deserves afforable health care. Free? I don't know about free. Affordable? Yes.
The thing that ticked me about ObamaCare was that the American people were lied to. Europe knows it's taxed. Many people still do not know it's a tax.
sntaylor
Android Expert
That's where the difference lies in UK to US, we pay tax at specific rates for what we earn, this pays for services that are available to everyone such as affordable housing and health care. So we do pay for health care unless you earn less than
Thatdad
Android Expert
OutofDate1980
Android Expert
The law was upheld because the majority of the Supreme Court ruled that it was within the rights of Congress to tax, but the Commerce Clause is more valid.
How Scalia Distorts the Framers | Consortiumnews
"In their angry dissent on June 28, the four wrote:
ElasticNinja
Android Expert
Then why don't you try and get stuff like Obamacare improved?
Romneycare isn't amazingly far off some insurance based systems in Europe. Not as efficient as public healthcare, but still a big improvement.
Healthcare isn't free at the sue where I live either, for example one has to pay to visit a doctor. Obviously operations etc are free for the person, but then a fee must be paid for medication etc.
sntaylor
Android Expert
Where as just over the water in Scotland I get free prescription medication, free doctor visits and emergency doctor home visits etc, but dental care is only subsidised, but still there is a limit on how much can be charged for dental care, so if a lot if with
needs done in one set of visits, you essentially get some of the treatment for free.
needs done in one set of visits, you essentially get some of the treatment for free.
OutofDate1980
Android Expert
Hey, at least the US Health Care is more efficient than Serbia and Brazil 
roud:, but behind every other country on the planet.
This is from Bloomberg:
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roud:, but behind every other country on the planet.This is from Bloomberg:
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Obama care is not about health care, never has been and never will be. It is about control. It was never designed to work and the website that has not fuctioned so far is going completely as planned. The dictator in charge has directed to not enforce a law passed by congress that is the dictators signature legislation. He has done this because if the bill is enforced then tens of millions of working Americans that get heath care through their employer would get cancelation notices come Sept/Oct of 2014, just before the mid term elections. If that happened the Democrates would loose big time. By dictating that the bill not be enforced until 2015 then the everyday not paying attention Americans will have no clue and vote the way they normally do.
Obamacare is designed to fail and by the time it's all over the health insurance companies will not have enough customers to stay in business thus they will go out of business. Then the dictator or his replacement will come riding in on the glory horse yelling we are here to help !!!
The dictator stated years ago that he will get us a one payer system, it may take 5,10 or 15 years but he will get it here in the USA.
Some of you say thats a good thing and that health care should not be for profit. Maybe so, but where will all the technology come from once the USA is one payer? Currently the major technology comes mainly from for profit companies and individuals from the USA. It will mostly cease and where would the world be if the USA and all other countries were one payer 40 years ago. Governments don't have the desire to create technology like health care and individuals won't because they won't make money for thier extreme hard work and cost. The smartest of us won't choose to be doctors and go through 8 years, a residencey and internship to be paid what the goverment would pay them. Hey, I know, we test everyone at a certain age and then the government tells them what they will grow up to be, souns good to some of you don't it.
This country became the most productive country in the world in a very short time, not by being a Socialist country but by being a Capitolist society. I know it makes some of your blood boil but this country allows anyone to become wealthy and famous, for now. You don't get that anywhere else in the world.
Anyway those of you that think whats been happening to this country is a good thing has another thing coming. Just wait till your health care is free.
Off my soap box!!
Obamacare is designed to fail and by the time it's all over the health insurance companies will not have enough customers to stay in business thus they will go out of business. Then the dictator or his replacement will come riding in on the glory horse yelling we are here to help !!!
The dictator stated years ago that he will get us a one payer system, it may take 5,10 or 15 years but he will get it here in the USA.
Some of you say thats a good thing and that health care should not be for profit. Maybe so, but where will all the technology come from once the USA is one payer? Currently the major technology comes mainly from for profit companies and individuals from the USA. It will mostly cease and where would the world be if the USA and all other countries were one payer 40 years ago. Governments don't have the desire to create technology like health care and individuals won't because they won't make money for thier extreme hard work and cost. The smartest of us won't choose to be doctors and go through 8 years, a residencey and internship to be paid what the goverment would pay them. Hey, I know, we test everyone at a certain age and then the government tells them what they will grow up to be, souns good to some of you don't it.
This country became the most productive country in the world in a very short time, not by being a Socialist country but by being a Capitolist society. I know it makes some of your blood boil but this country allows anyone to become wealthy and famous, for now. You don't get that anywhere else in the world.
Anyway those of you that think whats been happening to this country is a good thing has another thing coming. Just wait till your health care is free.
Off my soap box!!
Bob Blaylock
Well-Known Member
It is certainly looking more and more like the ObamaCare scandal is the product of something reminiscent of the Cloward-Piven strategy—enacted with the specific intent and expectation that it would fail, and that its failure would then be used as the foundation on which to build an even more extreme body of policy, such that they knew they could never get passed in the first place. I think the ultimate goal of this strategy was a complete government takeover of the entire health care business,and a complete elimination of any and all free market forces therefrom—in other words, the “single payer” model that is so beloved among the more extreme statists.
What I think that Obama and his stooges did not expect was that the ObamaCare scandal would fail as rapidly and as catastrophically as it is, or that its failure would reflect as badly on them and on the ideology from which they were going to base their next proposed “solution”. I think there is no very real reason to hope that the American people are finally waking up to the realities of out-of-control government, and that any further “solutions” from the cretins responsible for the ObamaCare scandal will be seen for what they truly are—an offer to treat the disease with even greater doses of the same poison that caused it in the first place. May Laurence Tureaud have compassion toward them
pbf98
Android Expert
I like how i saw the comparison: we think gun ownership is a right..
Yes it is, but that doesn't mean you HAVE to own a gun.
This healthcare bill forces you to have health care and "taxes" those who do not comply (as long as they can afford it in the first place because there is a stipulation for those who can't afford it even under the "affordable" care act) it's also raising prices of many people's policies such as mine, sure it's only 5%.. But that's still 5% more than i was paying last year
While there is a mess of negatives in this bill there are a few things that are positive, one thing in particular is no one can be denied for preexisting problems.. But why not just push that by itself if you think that's necessary..
Yes it is, but that doesn't mean you HAVE to own a gun.
This healthcare bill forces you to have health care and "taxes" those who do not comply (as long as they can afford it in the first place because there is a stipulation for those who can't afford it even under the "affordable" care act) it's also raising prices of many people's policies such as mine, sure it's only 5%.. But that's still 5% more than i was paying last year
While there is a mess of negatives in this bill there are a few things that are positive, one thing in particular is no one can be denied for preexisting problems.. But why not just push that by itself if you think that's necessary..