Root Important post by P3droid (For GB users especially)

[Martimus]

And when you take 5% off of Verizon's network and move them to AT&T, that's a 10% swing, which would put them in the lead more than likely. That's Verizon's worst fear. They certainly would never instigate a move like than of their own free will.

At this point in time both AT&T and Sprint have network issues that tend to nullify any significant benefit of moving to their network. Now this is only a temporary condition but there's no guarantee that AT&T's network reliability will improve significantly between now and the T-Mo merger; and Sprint will be able to resolve their WiMax problems and find a way to make their Nextel segment profitable.

At this particular moment in time I suspect it may be prudent to stay put, tolerate Verizon's Draconian policies, and wait to see if the light at the end of the tunnel is sunlight or another train...

 

[Piiman]

If you read in to the whole article, as a user, you certainly are entitled to certain things. You are not entitled to everything and IMHO the thing that sticks out to me are exactly what was talked about regarding users participating in fraud. As a company, and NOT specific to Moto OR VZW, there are expenses generated from providing "undue" services. Those are the customer service, shipping, repair, refurbishing, QA, etc, etc costs associated with less than honorable people who mess up their phone as they feel they are entitled to do whatever they want and go about getting their "entitlement" at the cost of the company. They "break" the phone by doing things "at their own risk" and expect to be bailed out for their idiocy. Anyone that feels that "doing whatever they want" to their phone (which I agree you should have the right to do AS LONG as you are willing to find your own solution) and then expects the company to pay for their mistake is sadly mistaken about their "entitlement".
.

While I agree with this I have a small problem. If they are worried about undue cost then why do they let Moto ,for example, release updates that break sbf files? files that we users could use to fix the phone? Why do they not look at the phones that are returned and see if they are rooted? Why don't they use that efuse crap to tag your phone as rooted and void your warranty (like the new xoom does) Give me the option to fore go my warranty and I'll take it and I'm sure other would also. In short if they wanted to stop the returns they could stop , if not all, most of them but they don't even try. (well until now it seems)

Give the tools needed to fix a phone and they don't have to worry about it
Don't go around deliberately breaking said tools and then bitch you have to fix phones.

Give me an option to root at my own risk and I'll gladly sign up!

As for tethering I for one was against P3 putting that hotspot app out and I told him so. I told him its just the type of thing that they can point at and say See the rooters are stealing services and everyone that installed it helps this come about.

FYI if you really need the hotspot in a pinch you can turn it on and off as needed and only be charged what you used ie one day one hour etc VZW lets you do that and will prorate the service.

Personally I don't think this is about services but about being able to lock services down so they can sell us more and more.

Once its all locked down whats to prevent them from removing Google nav and making you pay for their VZ nav? If not Google then Nothing

 

[Outlaw71]

At this point in time both AT&T and Sprint have network issues that tend to nullify any significant benefit of moving to their network. Now this is only a temporary condition but there's no guarantee that AT&T's network reliability will improve significantly between now and the T-Mo merger; and Sprint will be able to resolve their WiMax problems and find a way to make their Nextel segment profitable.

At this particular moment in time I suspect it may be prudent to stay put, tolerate Verizon's Draconian policies, and wait to see if the light at the end of the tunnel is sunlight or another train...

I'm thinking like a Verizon executive in that post. No way they willingly cut 5% of their smartphone base when that 5% could potentially jump over to their competition.

As for carriers, I fully agtee Verizon provides the best over all service. That's why I've been paying a premium for their service all these years. But I am not afraid to take my business elsewhere. Not even a little bit. I know it depends on where you are, but around here I have several friends enjoying Sprints $69 Everything package and wouldn't dream of switching to Verizon.

The reason the federal government split up the telecommunications monopoly back in the 80's was to give we the consumer the benefit of competition. I intend to use that benefit to my advantage.

 

[Piiman]

Its been obvious for some time now that this was all going to happen eventually. I think they're taking the wrong route with this tho. Before you say I'm bias, look at it from a business standpoint.

Ok option 1. Take away the root ability from android phones. Android loses appeal, people start jumping to microsoft, webOS, and iOS. The carriers don't have to allow tethering and manufacturers don't eat the cost of devices at the price of losing customers.

Option 2, be COMPLETELY open. Allow the bootloader to be unlocked , allow root, release full sbf's when updates are released, tiered data that includes tethering. Put some type of unremovable feature that raises a flash on your account if your device is rooted. Making any warranty claims impossible. Carriers won't be losing money for tethering and manufacturers won't lose money to warranty claims. Imagine the influx of customers if every android device was as open as the nexus devices.

That make way too much sense.
Translation: They'll never do it.

 

[Piiman]

I went back via SBF because I chose to. You don't have to patronize me with all of the other tracking data that I'm already aware of.

And you are easily one step behind what is going on.

Actually I think its you that is behind. You've already been pegged going back doesn't undo that. According to p3's post the carriers have been assuming anyone that didn't take the OTA updates are rooted. and they did this long before the GB leak.

 

[Steven58]

Actually I think its you that is behind. You've already been pegged going back doesn't undo that. According to p3's post the carriers have been assuming anyone that didn't take the OTA updates are rooted. and they did this long before the GB leak.

There's some conflicting info coming out of P3's tweets. For example, he tweeted that you're ok if you stop unauthorized tether and that VZ is about to do something about finding people?

So, none us us are really clear on all this.

 

[pego99]

What about 2.2 users? Nothing to worry about?

 

[Airmaxx23]

I've only tethered a couple time for a few minutes more or less to try it out to see if/how it works. I will really start believing that Verizon is going to crack down on this when the tethering apps start to get pulled from the Market. Until then I'm very skeptical.

 

[PACAnesFan]

Let me see if I can boil this down. Anyone feel free to correct me if I am wrong on any of this. This taken from days of Twitter and forum postings from many many different sources and people. I've written this in as small and simple summary as possible.

The problem is unauthorized tethering, both USB and Wi-Fi. Anyone on any phone or Android platform has SOME method of illegal tethering, being an app or a hack. Supposedly, VZW ran a test case in the Washington DC area and found that 2/3 of data used was from unauthorized tethering. How they came to this conclusion is unknown. Of particular interest is Gingerbread and the TBH 3G method. Although reports are conflicting, GB may have a 3G tethering problem that allows people to tether without a plan and without doing anything to their phones. Other users had to modify to accomplish this. Either way, doing such is a violation of the current TOS with VZW. There is a patch that TBH offers that will close the hole. Again, reports are conflicting to whether this works or not and whether a full SBF is needed and does in fact close the hole (the changes the patch makes are the NVRAM area).

So what does this mean? Apparently something is coming. What is anyone's guess at this point. TBH seem to be the only ones talking at this point. None of the other developers have come forward, other then to say it is a good idea to get rid of illegal tethering (both USB and Wi-Fi).

The main questions are:
1) What happens to users who continue to tether? As a subset of 1,
1a) Will VZW enforce their policies to the letter or spirit of the TOS (for people who tether, but don't come close to the cap vs. people who set up free wireless for the neighborhood.)
2) What happens to people that have illegally tethered in the past, but have quit?
3) What happens to people who have never tethered and simply have rooted GB?
4) And what happens if you DO have a plan and continue to tether on GB and have the GB tethering issue? I've read that although you ARE paying for it, it uses phone data allowance and not your tethering allowance.

Making a comparison to ATT, they have simple sent out C&D letters to illegal tethering users and offered them a plan.

 

[Piiman]

Hah, Metfan, I was wondering where you were. I thought you'ld be all over this.

I doubt that Google will sit around and watch the carriers do this. Moto doesn't pay an licensing fees for Android. The stand to lose some of that Ad money but Android is where it is because of the techies like us. I doubt that the partners would be infuriated by Google's new stance.

Google Tightens Its Grip On Android, Infuriating Partners

And I'll say this about tethering; you guys are completely right about the legality and, by extension, that tether users are cheating VZW if they don't pay for it. However, if I use it in certain VERY LIMITED circumstances (I'm still on GB so it's obviously not important to me) why should I pay $20 a month? My problem is not with the legality of it but with the morality of it (and yes, I know VZW/Moto couldn't care less about morals).

Eitherway, let's hear your counterpoints Metfan. (I guess this is round two LOL).

Pssst
you don't have to buy or pay for an entire month if you only use it for a day, week or whatever. You can add and remove it ANY TIME. So if you use it for a day you are charged for a day etc .

 

[dhoffman1421]

Strange, my TBH app is gone so I can't undo the hack now I guess. I never used it anyway so not sure how anyone would know I have it. But it seems really weird the TBH app disappeared. I haven't even accessed it since I dl'd GB.

 

[yawdapaah]

Pssst
you don't have to buy or pay for an entire month if you only use it for a day, week or whatever. You can add and remove it ANY TIME. So if you use it for a day you are charged for a day etc .

Really??????? I'm saved. I'm really glad that I can add a tethering plan to my account, use it for an hour or whatever, and take it off my plan after use.
Thank you.

 

[emaN resU]

vz's prepaid plans suck balls...

100 MB $15 Day
300 MB $30 Week
1 GB $50 Month
5 GB $80 Month

Really verizon, that much?

I don't need no stinkin tether!

 

[yawdapaah]

vz's prepaid plans suck balls...

100 MB $15 Day
300 MB $30 Week
1 GB $50 Month
5 GB $80 Month

Really verizon, that much?

I don't need no stinkin tether!

Hmmm User (i'm sorry but eman resu hurts my brain) I wonder if this informative post applies for prepaid as well?

Pssst
you don't have to buy or pay for an entire month if you only use it for a day, week or whatever. You can add and remove it ANY TIME. So if you use it for a day you are charged for a day etc .

 

[eraursls1984]

vz's prepaid plans suck balls...

100 MB $15 Day
300 MB $30 Week
1 GB $50 Month
5 GB $80 Month

Really verizon, that much?

I don't need no stinkin tether!

I think that is just for the 4g modems, I could be wrong though

 

[yawdapaah]

I think that is just for the 4g modems, I could be wrong though

Yeah that's kind of insane. $80 Month for 5GB .

But it doesn't matter because according to Piiman:

Pssst
you don't have to buy or pay for an entire month if you only use it for a day, week or whatever. You can add and remove it ANY TIME. So if you use it for a day you are charged for a day etc .

Sorry for doing that again. That's the last time, I'm quoting that. .

 

[Outlaw71]

he tweeted that you're ok if you stop unauthorized tether and that VZ is about to do something about finding people...

Great news. I was just about to drive out to California to spend some time finding myself. If Verizon finds me first, it'll save me a lot of money on gas.




About this certain something Verizon is about to do, I'm not anticipating anything that's any stronger than AT&T's action against their customers who were illegally tethering on their service. AT&T set the precedent, if Verizon decides to go after offenders in a manner that is much stronger than that, they risk looking like a bully. And I'm not saying that as a judgement call, personally I would say if they were to terminate service to those found guilty of unauthorized tethering, they would be perfectly within their rights to do so (meaning they could terminate my service as I have used the Wireless Tether for Root Users in the past, and I couldn't really say much about it if they did).

If you ask me P3 is getting really nervous that he's about to be sued big time by Verizon, and his paranoia is causing him to go really over board in his ramblings and warnings over Twitter. Sure things might be looking REALLY dire for him, and he's projecting that on everyone else in our community, but the likely hood that we're in any danger at all of recieving anything more than a C&D letter from Verizon is virtually non-existant. For one thing as it's being pointed out by several people on here so already, we aren't the one's who've commited a crime, we've only violated our terms of service. He's the one who could be facing a fairly stiff lawsuit, and/or criminal charges for charging us for an app that circumvents their wifi hotspot for his own monetary gain.

So if anyone needs to be worried, it's P3, not the rest of us. And I really don't know that any of that is going to happen to him, just that if it's going to happen to anyone, it will be him.

 

[faber78]

im getting pretty tired of p3....
he is affecting a lot of people with his diarrhea of the mouth.
his vague comments have grown old, if he has something to say he needs to come out and say it....not now, not tomorrow, yesterday.

if he has a source for all this crap he needs to man up and reveal it as this effects a lot more people then himself.

as far as im concerned at this point and until i see a valid statement, verifiable with a source....the guy is on crack.

edit:
(obviously we realize since gb, there is something to note....but using that to carry on all this drama and b.s. is real chicken sheit on his part).

 

[emaN resU]

Hmmm User (i'm sorry but eman resu hurts my brain) I wonder if this informative post applies for prepaid as well?

No problem, just call me mr. name.
Yes. It does, that's why I wrote "prepaid" instead of monthly.

I think that is just for the 4g modems, I could be wrong though

I just got this info from the vz site.

Here's the link. http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/mobilebroadband/?page=plans

This is my favorite part - "Data Allowance (sending and receiving)"

Edit: lol at fabers sig.

 

[JrzDroid]

here's some important posts my P3

P3Droid
We rooted users are very big community.

P3Droid
Way off 1% -2% was soo far far off. We are much stronger than that.

 

[JB in AZ]

No problem, just call me mr. name.
Yes. It does, that's why I wrote "prepaid" instead of monthly.



I just got this info from the vz site.

Here's the link. Verizon Wireless - Mobile Broadband - Plans

This is my favorite part - "Data Allowance (sending and receiving)"

Edit: lol at fabers sig.

And then if you scroll down where it says: For Smartphones & Feature Phones Mobile Broadband Connect & 3G Mobile Hotspots $20/mo for 2GB.

 

[eraursls1984]

I just got this info from the vz site.

Here's the link. http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/mobilebroadband /?page=plans

Thats not for the smartphone hotspot, thats for their dedicated hotspot devices. The smartphone price is lower on the page "$20-2gb and $20 for each gb over 2". When I called earlier they said if you use it it's $20, no daily fee if thats all you use it's still $20, but then again thats a verizon rep so they could be wrong (hey generally are)

 

[emaN resU]

And then if you scroll down where it says: For Smartphones & Feature Phones Mobile Broadband Connect & 3G Mobile Hotspots $20/mo for 2GB.

You are correct, I was wrong. I was in error. I made a mistake. Ever make a mistake? It happened to me... I thought that was daily prepaid usage for all devices. That is the price for notebooks. Apparently, they do not have daily or weekly prepaid For Smartphones & Feature Phones

Thats not for the smartphone hotspot, thats for their dedicated hotspot devices. The smartphone price is lower on the page "$20-2gb and $20 for each gb over 2". When I called earlier they said if you use it it's $20, no daily fee if thats all you use it's still $20, but then again thats a verizon rep so they could be wrong (hey generally are)

That sounds right. Still, that is too freakin much. Thanks for the info.

 

[dookie1]

i expect vzw has far bigger fish to fry than me and my rooted unofficial gb install, even if i do tether now and again.

i'm at home most days. when somebody knocks on my door, i answer. until then? whatever.

at the moment, it sounds like a bunch of hand-wringing to me. of course, we have all been wrong before...

 

[kdkinc]

Warning: Seen on US Route 75 heading towards Florida Saturday am.

Several modified vehicles all red with Directional antennas mounted on the roofs. The same type of antenna I saw in the military for RF finders and detection equipment !
The vehicle all has VZW with the logo underneath the logo was "RAT"
(Root Attack Team)

Each vehicle had two people in uniforms kind of police type uniform which I saw as they stopped at the same rest stop I stopped at.
I quickly pulled the battery from my phone and hid it in the engine compartment next to the battery.This will guarantee being detection proof according to my sources.

In the restaurant I over heard there strategy of attack. The college campus's are the there first targets. They would then proceed to the rural northern counties next week.

There main tool is a electronic EFM hyper-modulation overload causing a finely tuned blast toward any Rooted device.
Then as you reboot the screen pops up and says "Return to VZW company store NOW !!"

Has any one else seen the RAT team vehicles in their areas yet ???

Forward this info at once to protect your self or keep your phone in your engine compartment for the next two weeks at least ...